The Coffee House - the UU Fellowship Thread

[lilithu]

Hi Maize. I am from (gasp) Seattle. I don't drink Starbucks! does that make me a heretic?

Nah, you would fit right in. Orthodox UUs don't drink Starbucks; only free-trade. I'm the heretic because I actually like Starbucks.

Yes, yes, I know they're a big chain corporation and crowd out the family-owned coffee shops, but I like the taste of their over-roasted coffee dammit! Besides, Starbucks treats their employees very well. Even part-timers get health coverage. And I've tried all the locally owned cafes in my area and they just don't make good mochas.

I guess I misunderstood what UU was. I though it said Yoohoo.

UU, Yoohoo, I'll answer to either.

btw, pleased to meet you, bennettresearch. Interesting handle.

 

[lilithu]

"Church of All Souls" is growing on me too. But an across the board change seems unlikely. I wonder how many would support the change?

What are you guys talking about?

Hey Maize, when are you coming to visit my All Souls church in DC? (as opposed to the hundred other All Souls churches across the nation) I even have a futon for you to crash on if you need it. Heck, I'll even buy free-trade coffee. (Tho you'll have to make it yourself as I am the world's worst coffee maker and wouldn't wish to subject you to that.)

We had our Home-coming Sunday at church today, after the slow summer months, and the place was packed and rockin. It really did feel like coming home and I was thinkin that I wanted to share that with more people. Not that other UUs don't have their own dear spiritual homes, and I would like to visit them too!

 

[lilithu]

Hello, I am living in Hove, England and am interested in Unitarianism, have also visited the local Unitarian Chapel in Brighton, 2-3 miles away, www.brightonunitarian.org.uk
I notice from their publicity literature that the first Unitarian congregation meeting ever took place in a room at Essex Street near The Strand in the City of London on 17th April 1774. I was wondering if the 17th April is marked at all by today's Unitarians.

Can't speak for all Unitarians but it's not observed by us. I'd say that by far the biggest holiday for American UUs is Martin Luther King's birthday, with Earth Day maybe being a distant second. I think that there are some significant differences between American UUs and British Unitarians and Universalists (not that we don't also have some significant commonalities).

So the first meeting was in 1774? What about the Unitarians in Transylvania? I'm pretty sure they predate 1774 and find it hard to believe they never had a meeting. Are they refering specifically to the congregationalist tradition?

More importantly, did you enjoy your visit? And even more importantly, welcome to RF!

 

[Green Gaia]

I've never heard of bubble tea... I'd try it though.

 

[Green Gaia]

What are you guys talking about?

Hey Maize, when are you coming to visit my All Souls church in DC? (as opposed to the hundred other All Souls churches across the nation) I even have a futon for you to crash on if you need it. Heck, I'll even buy free-trade coffee. (Tho you'll have to make it yourself as I am the world's worst coffee maker and wouldn't wish to subject you to that.)

We had our Home-coming Sunday at church today, after the slow summer months, and the place was packed and rockin. It really did feel like coming home and I was thinkin that I wanted to share that with more people. Not that other UUs don't have their own dear spiritual homes, and I would like to visit them too!

I'm hoping to make a weekend trip up to DC sometime this Fall when my son has a 3-day weekend and I'm not teaching RE that Sunday. We want to do the whole Smithsonian and touristy thing... and yeah visit All Souls on Sunday.

We had our Ingathering yesterday as well, did the whole Water Cermony thing, my son loved it. Any chance to get up in front of everyone and talk, he's there! Too bad no one can understand half the things he says, I had to interpert, lol. We went to the early service, not too packed, but busier than it was in the summer and the 11am service was said to be packed.

 

[Green Gaia]

Autumn Prayer

by Barbara Pescan, parish minister,
the Unitarian Church of Evanston, Illinois

May the glory of the passing away of autumn
lie about us
fresh gold
for a time.
And when the dark comes, and the cold
may we remember how today we stand in glory,
how we walk in bounty
heaped upon earth’s dark carpet,
how we move knee deep in abundance
flung against night’s winter curtain.
We are thankful for it coming
and for its passing.

Let it be.

This reading is taken from our hymnbook, Singing the Living Tradition, #656

 

[Nozem]

Hello, I am living in Hove, England and am interested in Unitarianism, have also visited the local Unitarian Chapel in Brighton, 2-3 miles away, www.brightonunitarian.org.uk
I notice from their publicity literature that the first Unitarian congregation meeting ever took place in a room at Essex Street near The Strand in the City of London on 17th April 1774. I was wondering if the 17th April is marked at all by today's Unitarians.

Can't speak for all Unitarians but it's not observed by us. I'd say that by far the biggest holiday for American UUs is Martin Luther King's birthday, with Earth Day maybe being a distant second. I think that there are some significant differences between American UUs and British Unitarians and Universalists (not that we don't also have some significant commonalities
So the first meeting was in 1774? What about the Unitarians in Transylvania? I'm pretty sure they predate 1774 and find it hard to believe they never had a meeting. Are they refering specifically to the congregationalist tradition?

More importantly, did you enjoy your visit? And even more importantly, welcome to RF!

********************************************************************************************************************
Thank you for your welcome Lilithu.
Yes, I had read that Unitarianism can be traced back to Transylvania in the 16th century so I will enquire further, perhaps the publicity material for the Brighton Unitarian Church meant the first British Unitarian service.
I have been back and gain something from being there- and hope to be able to offer something in return. I find the hymns with very obvious Christian reference points hard to get used to. From talking to a regular member originally from Manchester ( Northern England), it seems that there is a difference between the regions of Britain, with the North being more Christian orientated.

 

[lilithu]

Namaste Nozem.

I have been back and gain something from being there- and hope to be able to offer something in return.

That's a great attitude! In our congregation we find that the members who get the most out of church are the ones who, like you, look to see what they can give back. Service is an integral part of spiritual practice.

I find the hymns with very obvious Christian reference points hard to get used to. From talking to a regular member originally from Manchester ( Northern England), it seems that there is a difference between the regions of Britain, with the North being more Christian orientated.

Last Sunday at my church, the first song that the choir sang was "There is a balm in Gilead," a classic Negro spiritual. I happened to be sitting in the front row and I swear that the soloist was looking straight at us as she sang, "My Lord! my Lord! He can move mountains! and He can cure cancer!..." My pagan, non-theist friend who was sitting next to me leaned over and said, "well, what's taking him so long then?" I must admit that it was a little unnerving. But then the next song that the choir later sang was "Imagine" by John Lennon. When the soloist (a different one) got to the part, "imagine no religion; it's easy if you try; nothing to kill or die for; above us only sky" my friend leaned over again and said, "That's what I love about UU, that I can be in church and still hear that."

The point of my story is, even if the Christian language is a little unsettling to you, bear with it, at least for a while. Hopefully, you will find that you share ideals with the congregation that transcend your differences.

 

[Nozem]

Last Sunday at my church, the first song that the choir sang was "There is a balm in Gilead," a classic Negro spiritual. I happened to be sitting in the front row and I swear that the soloist was looking straight at us as she sang, "My Lord! my Lord! He can move mountains! and He can cure cancer!..." My pagan, non-theist friend who was sitting next to me leaned over and said, "well, what's taking him so long then?" I must admit that it was a little unnerving. But then the next song that the choir later sang was "Imagine" by John Lennon. When the soloist (a different one) got to the part, "imagine no religion; it's easy if you try; nothing to kill or die for; above us only sky" my friend leaned over again and said, "That's what I love about UU, that I can be in church and still hear that."

The point of my story is, even if the Christian language is a little unsettling to you, bear with it, at least for a while. Hopefully, you will find that you share ideals with the congregation that transcend your differences.
*********************************************************************************************************************
Thanks for your reply Lilithu : With respect to Christianity, I find hymns more unsettling as they remind me of the more coercive side of the teachings of the Church. I am not opposed to Jesus Christ, the Sermon on the Mount must be one of the most important pieces of writing known to humanity, along with the Tao Te Ching, and other sacred literature. Your Neo-Pagan friend would have enjoyed our last service in Brighton and Hove, which was marking the Autumn Equinox, with dedications to the four elements of Air, Fire, Water, and Earth and a reading from Tagore. It was very moving.

 

[lilithu]

With respect to Christianity, I find hymns more unsettling as they remind me of the more coercive side of the teachings of the Church. I am not opposed to Jesus Christ, the Sermon on the Mount must be one of the most important pieces of writing known to humanity, along with the Tao Te Ching, and other sacred literature.

Agreed! And my pagan friend would agree too. For me personally, Jesus' teachings are central, as he focused even more on social justice than did other great spiritual teachers like Lao-Tse or even the Buddha.

I am not sure which hymns you're refering to; perhaps I'm just unfamiliar with them. Certainly "Onward Christian Soldiers" reminds me of coercive aspects of Christianity, but we would never sing that in my church anyway. Otoh, I find "Amazing Grace" to be very comforting, except for the last verse. In general, I find the Negro spirituals to be uplifting, as they speak of hope for justice in an unjust world. But occasionally a song gets on my nerves when it seems to leave everything up to God, without addressing our responsibility in helping to bring about our own "salvation." So when the soloist was singing "My Lord can cure cancer" I was shifting uncomfortably in my pew.

Your Neo-Pagan friend would have enjoyed our last service in Brighton and Hove, which was marking the Autumn Equinox, with dedications to the four elements of Air, Fire, Water, and Earth and a reading from Tagore. It was very moving.

Yes, she would have loved that, as would I. Our Sunday services would never do something like that, unfortunately. In fact, even the pulpit announcement that I requested announcing the autumn equinox somehow did not get announced. It could be due just to a mistake, but it's also not the first time that earth-based spirituality has been "overlooked" at our pulpit. (We had a lay-led service on the evening of equinox itself.) It comes back to the issue of religious pluralism within our tradition and how to properly acknowledge it.

Happy Autumn equinox Nozem. It sounds like you've found yourself a good congregation.
-lilith

 

[Nozem]

"But occasionally a song gets on my nerves when it seems to leave everything up to God, without addressing our responsibility in helping to bring about our own "salvation." So when the soloist was singing "My Lord can cure cancer" I was shifting uncomfortably in my pew."
**************************************************************************************************************************
I couldn't agree more! I find it hard to accept the more Calvinistic idea that one is 'saved' or 'damned'. I think that it is in Voltaire's novel 'Candide' there is the expression , 'that we must work on the garden of ourselves'. Trying to be constanly conscious of our thoughts and actions. I hope to add to the 'energy' of the service by trying to involve myself in my visit to the Church.

 

[Green Gaia]

It's official now... I'm a UU Lite. I have successfully decaffeinated myself. It only took 2 weeks and 3 or 4 headaches. I love my coffee but I did this for health reasons. Basically, I'm trying to be healthier and found if I was downing a pot of coffee in the morning I wasn't eating breakfast and was stark raving hungry by mid-morning which would send me searching for something (usually unhealthy) to snack on. I've replaced that jolt I got from my coffee with exercise and a good breakfast. Wasn't easy the first few days, but I'm feeling much better throughout the whole day now.

Anyway, just thought I'd ramble on a bit.... I hope you all are well. :bounce

 

[Davidium]

I'm a UU Lite.

I would have thought of you as a UU Latte myself, Maize

Me... I tend to think of myself as more of the UU Navy Brew.... as dark as coca cola and you have to use a spoon to get it out of the cup....

Congrats on cutting out the caffiene. There are quite a few more serious health risks for women that are caffiene related than for men, for some odd reason.

Yours in Faith,

David

 

[lilithu]

It's official now... I'm a UU Lite. I have successfully decaffeinated myself.

No coffee!!? Aw Maize, say it ain't so! Just kidding. Congratulations!!

I love my coffee but I am so phobically opposed to any kind of chemical dependancy that I make sure to never drink more than two cups a day, usually only one, and never for more than two or three consecutive days. And unless I'm at a conference, I only drink coffee in the afternoon, over conversation, not as a stimulant in the morning.

David, asside from an increased risk of osteoporosis, what other negative eefects does caffeine have on women's health? In moderate amounts, caffeine is supposed to help ward off depression in women (but for some reason not in men).

 

[Davidium]

There are studies out there linking caffine to the development of cysts in breast tissue... and if you are at a hereditary risk for breast cancer, there is the belief that caffine related cysts could increase that risk.

Here is a good personal website on this and other such issues...

http://www.bangalorenet.com/system1/anitha/womens%20health.htm

This is not well publicized.... the only reason I know about it is that an ex of mine was at an increased risk for breast cancer due to family history, and her doctor had us take caffine completely out of her diet. I think if you are not at serious risk, then a moderate amount of caffine is not a problem.

Almost every female in her family line had developed breast cancer.

Yours in faith,

David

 

[Green Gaia]

There are studies out there linking caffine to the development of cysts in breast tissue... and if you are at a hereditary risk for breast cancer, there is the belief that caffine related cysts could increase that risk.

I did not know that. That's good to be aware of, even though I'm not considered a "high" risk for breast cancer it's still something that concerns me, obviously.

My reason for cutting out the caffine was just part of a complete change in the way I approach diet and nutrition. I'm sure I'll still have caffine on occasion, but I got out of that cycle of needing it everyday. And I feel great for it.

 

[Green Gaia]

Faith without Good Deeds Is Dead
(From the New Testament) James 2:14-18

Dear brothers and sisters, what's the use of saying you have faith if you don't prove it by your actions? That kind of faith can't save anyone. Suppose you see a brother or sister who needs food or clothing, and you say, "Well, good-bye and God bless you; stay warm and eat well"--but then you don't give that person any food or clothing. What good does that do?

So you see, it isn't enough just to have faith. Faith that doesn't show itself by good deeds is no faith at all--it is dead and useless.

Now someone may argue, "Some people have faith; others have good deeds." I say, "I can't see your faith if you don't have good deeds, but I will show you my faith through my good deeds."

 

[lilithu]

Faith without Good Deeds Is Dead
(From the New Testament) James 2:14-18

Dear brothers and sisters, what's the use of saying you have faith if you don't prove it by your actions? That kind of faith can't save anyone. Suppose you see a brother or sister who needs food or clothing, and you say, "Well, good-bye and God bless you; stay warm and eat well"--but then you don't give that person any food or clothing. What good does that do?

So you see, it isn't enough just to have faith. Faith that doesn't show itself by good deeds is no faith at all--it is dead and useless.

Now someone may argue, "Some people have faith; others have good deeds." I say, "I can't see your faith if you don't have good deeds, but I will show you my faith through my good deeds."

Hey Maize, namaste.

Just to let you know:
We had our UU theology class this evening - tonight about linking our theology to our social justice work - and it was my turn to pick an opening reading. The poem that I wanted to do on prophets was too long.
(http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/showthread.php?postid=249691#poststop)
So I chose your James quote above. May not have thought of using it if I hadn't just seen it here, even tho I cite it all the time. It was perfect. Thanks! Very modern translation. Where is it from? My minister actually asked me whether it really was from James because the language was so conversational.

 

[Green Gaia]

It's the New Living Translation. Very readable.

I love that passage from James, and very relateable to UU.

The King James verison really turned me off reading the Bible. Here's that same passage in KJV:

14What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

15If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,

16And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

17Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

I get too caught up tripping over the words to get the meaning of it. Shew?

Yea for modern translations! :clap:

 

[Ciscokid]

I cut coffee out of my life for about a half year. I've picked it back up in a big way, I'm now back to drinking two cups a day. It is the nectar of the Gods...I am a prisoner to it's supernatural Javatic lure.