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The Buddha Explains Universal Mind

Ben Dhyan

Ben Dhyan

Veteran Member
Spiny Norman said:
Again, you are leaping from a meditative experience of non-duality to some universal cosmic consciousness thingy beyond space and time. It's just an unfounded belief.
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No......you are talking about the pointing finger......non-duality is the reality that my words point to....the reality represented by the words....non-duality....is simply beyond observation as if it were a separate object...
 
godnotgod

godnotgod

Thou art That
Spiny Norman said:
You haven't done anything of the sort, it's just a muddle of unfounded assertions. You haven't even explained what this fictional "Universal Mind" is supposed to be, and whether it's the same as "Cosmic Consciousness".
So in your vocabulary, are "Universal Mind" and "Cosmic Consciousness" the same thing? And if not, how exactly do they differ? If you insist on using all these jargon buzz-words you really should provide a glossary.

I really think you should start a thread called "Why I believe in Cosmic Consciousness". Try presenting a coherent argument for your belief system, and provide a glossary at the beginning.
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Well, if CC were some sort of doctrine to be believed in, I suppose I could start such a thread. But CC is not such a doctrine. It is the experience of Ultimate Reality, which has no doctrine. What doctrine did you have in mind?
 
Ben Dhyan

Ben Dhyan

Veteran Member
Spiny Norman said:
This is a reference to the Buddhist teaching of anatta, not-self. But this has nothing to do with "Cosmic Consciousness".
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Anatta has everything to do with buddha nature...or true self... If the personal self is not the true self...then if the mind is stilled so that the personal self is not present....the true self or buddha nature is revealed... This is just another finger pointing to the same non-dual universal existence....read my sig line....those labels are the tip of an iceberg as to the all the religious conceptual teaching that point the way....
 
godnotgod

godnotgod

Thou art That
Spiny Norman said:
Using anatta as an argument for cosmic conciousness is deeply flawed. All you're really doing is replacing one view with another.
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Answer the question: if there is no self or self view, what kind of view must there then be? Consciousness is present throughout, so it cannot be 'no-view' as you previously stated. That's just forcing things to fit your position.
 
Rick O'Shez

Rick O'Shez

Irishman bouncing off walls
ben d said:
Anatta has everything to do with buddha nature...or true self... If the personal self is not the true self...then if the mind is stilled so that the personal self is not present....the true self or buddha nature is revealed...
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OK, but what has the experience of Buddha nature got to do with all that metaphysical garbage about cosmic consciousness, beyond time and space, ultimate reality etc? Nothing that I can see.
 
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Rick O'Shez

Rick O'Shez

Irishman bouncing off walls
godnotgod said:
Well, if CC were some sort of doctrine to be believed in, I suppose I could start such a thread.
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Cosmic Consciousness clearly is something you believe in, but you present your beliefs in a very muddled way with random bits from here and there, you also continually move the goalposts.
So I am suggesting a more coherent presentation, beginning with succinct definitions of the terms you use. You still haven't clearly explained what you mean by "Cosmic Consciousness", all you have done is muddied the water further by introducing more similar-sounding jargon like "Universal Consciousness" and "Universal Mind". Are these in fact all referring to the same thing, and if not what exactly are the differences? You really need to provide a glossary instead of arrogantly expecting everyone else to make sense of your idiosyncratic vocabulary.
 
Rick O'Shez

Rick O'Shez

Irishman bouncing off walls
ben d said:
No......you are talking about the pointing finger......non-duality is the reality that my words point to....the reality represented by the words....non-duality....is simply beyond observation as if it were a separate object...
Click to expand...

Sorry but that word salad doesn't say anything useful. Meaningless rhetoric.
 
Rick O'Shez

Rick O'Shez

Irishman bouncing off walls
godnotgod said:
Answer the question: if there is no self or self view, what kind of view must there then be? Consciousness is present throughout, so it cannot be 'no-view' as you previously stated. That's just forcing things to fit your position.
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"View" does not apply. You're still stuck in dualism.

Instead of continually trying to prove your theory of "Cosmic Consciousness" maybe you should step back and look at your basic assumptions.
 
Rick O'Shez

Rick O'Shez

Irishman bouncing off walls
godnotgod said:
Of course view applies. Universal Consciousness is no particular view, which means a universal view. It's that simple. What seems to be your problem? You want to over complicate everything.
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View implies duality, so you still haven't got it. And equating "no particular view" with "universal view" seems tenuous to say the least.

But anyway, your belief in "cosmic consciousness" sounds very much like Advaita. Could you say what the difference is exactly?
 
Rick O'Shez

Rick O'Shez

Irishman bouncing off walls
godnotgod said:
Well, if CC were some sort of doctrine to be believed in, I suppose I could start such a thread. But CC is not such a doctrine. It is the experience of Ultimate Reality, which has no doctrine. What doctrine did you have in mind?
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Define "Cosmic Consciousness". Define "Ultimate Reality". Until you provide a glossary of your jargon this is all just meaningless word salad.
 
YmirGF

YmirGF

Bodhisattva in Recovery
Spiny Norman said:
Define "Cosmic Consciousness". Define "Ultimate Reality". Until you provide a glossary of your jargon this is all just meaningless word salad.
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Meanwhile the very concept of "Ultimate Reality" is itself the result of dogmatic thinking. The answers we get do certainly seem to be mood based, imo. The definitions morph to cover any imperfections in the ideology, so that one is never talking about the same thing for more than 2 seconds... If this thread is an example of the fruits of higher consciousness I'd suggest we are all doomed.
 
Rick O'Shez

Rick O'Shez

Irishman bouncing off walls
YmirGF said:
Meanwhile the very concept of "Ultimate Reality" is itself the result of dogmatic thinking. The answers we get do certainly seem to be mood based, imo. The definitions morph to cover any imperfections in the ideology, so that one is never talking about the same thing for more than 2 seconds... If this thread is an example of the fruits of higher consciousness I'd suggest we are all doomed.
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Yes, the ground is continually shifting, fingers pointing in a random succession of directions.

Better to watch small fawns. ;)
 
godnotgod

godnotgod

Thou art That
YmirGF said:
Meanwhile the very concept of "Ultimate Reality" is itself the result of dogmatic thinking. The answers we get do certainly seem to be mood based, imo. The definitions morph to cover any imperfections in the ideology, so that one is never talking about the same thing for more than 2 seconds... If this thread is an example of the fruits of higher consciousness I'd suggest we are all doomed.
Click to expand...

In your world, the sleep-dream world is a kind of 'reality', but your ultimate reality is waking sleep.
 
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