The Buddha Explains Universal Mind

[atanu]

There is no point. Which is the point.

Sir. Does the pointlessness include your point?

 

[Twilight Hue]

The point in all religions ,IMO, is that the unborn must be heard about, then experienced within one's consciousness, and abided in as the very self.

The fragile body and the monkey mind, which are ignorantly assumed to be the self and become the 'i', but which are actually phenomenal nature, may do their acts, providing enjoyment.

YMMV.

I dunno if that's entirely the point of religion, but I don't necessarily disagree in light there is a manifested perspective of self enabled through the aggregates dependent upon our physical form.

The latter certainly alludes the wild and unpredictable nature of monkey mind. Something that seems tame and controlled also proves unpredictable and uncontrollable. Still a product of the aggregates, it's movements and behaviors still indeed entertain as with all aspects that arise and fall throughout our lives. I approach it as introspection by which the monkey behaves leading to understanding and acknowledgement concerning our nature. Including everything that is and has been learned at the end, when the aggregates finally dissolve and pass with form and formless.

It's whiskey straight up.

 

[Twilight Hue]

.
Sir. Does the pointlessness include your point?
.
[/QUOTE ]

-nowhere man-

Makes for a nice koan.

My answer is, "It certainly does.

 

[YmirGF]

Has anyone ever heard of birth and evolution of Nirvana?

Not really, but I'm always interested in what you have to say. Got a link?

 

[godnotgod]

... you... seem impervious to the suggestion that you might be looking at this in a peculiar way. .

What if it is not being looked at in any peculiar way you are suggesting? We already know about peculiar views; why else do you suppose we keep pointing to a view that is not peculiar in any way whatsoever, free from doctrine, and untainted? That Unborn View is simply to 'see things as they are', and as simple as that sounds, is one of the most difficult things to achieve, due to all of the peculiar views we have been bombarded with since childhood.

'Pointing to the moon' has no peculiar view attached to it; it is doctrineless, the point being 'the Moon' itself (ie 'Reality'), and not the pointing finger.

 

[godnotgod]

I really dislike the term monkey mind. It is unnecessarily negative, but if meant in a light-hearted way, then I can live with it. It's not a descriptor I would ever think of using however.

You have the wrong idea. Sorry, but 'monkey mind' does not allude to level of intelligence or behavior as in monkeys, but to the fact that the discursive mind is always jumping about, like a monkey. So while it is negative from the POV of Higher Consciousneness, it is not negative in the way you imagine.

 

[psychoslice]

You have the wrong idea. Sorry, but 'monkey mind' does not allude to level of intelligence or behavior as in monkeys, but to the fact that the discursive mind is always jumping about, like a monkey. So while it is negative from the POV of Higher Consciousneness, it is not negative in the way you imagine.

Thanks for clearing that up, I was bothered lol.

 

[godnotgod]

The issue is that there is no true static aspect involving mind, consciousness, and body.

There certainly exists in form among the formless spanning micro and macro realms a wholeness by which there is indeed a true undisputed aspect pertaining towards "one"-ness, yet bearing no true lasting characteristics by which could be permanently identified, such as any centralized nexus where form and formless ceases that is void of impermencence and change.

It would be like say saying your ancestors still exist when in fact they do not in any identifiable way or manner, yet at the same time, they actually still do exist among the dynamics of changeless change bringing about new form and rising phenomina by which can be related to and with.

To argue anything such as a changeless static realm would be as erroneous as it's counter point involving ever-changing dynamic fluidity, leaving a middle way in perceiving how things are such as universal mind, and universal consciousness, nirvana and all the other crap that goes with it. There remains acknowledged periods of staticicity such as the maintaining of form, but one that will not escape the passing away, for upon doing so, arises in form and the cycle repeats of which the cycle itself is not impervious to change and impermanence.

Don't point to the moon too long nor grab for it. Even if you happen to "catch" it. I happen to know a secret. It.. ........ s. Eh, I'll forget that secret myself someday.

Then there is the Conscious Nothingness that is behind all that arises and passes away. You are witnessing such arising and subsiding of the phenomenal world via such Conscious Nothingness, though you may be unaware that you are doing just that, primarily because your attention is held by the foreground of existence, while having forgotten the background against which arising and subsiding actually occur. IOW, we are not getting the Big Picture yet. When you begin to see the foreground with the background included, your view becomes completely transformed.

The Conscious Nothingness itself does not come and go, but it is exactly because of the Conscious Nothingness that you can detect coming and going.

“ Whatever we see is changing, losing its balance. The reason everything looks beautiful is because it is out of balance, but its background is always in perfect harmony. This is how everything is in the realm of Buddha nature, losing its balance against a background of perfect balance. So if you see things without realising the background of Buddha nature, everything appears to be in the form of suffering. But if you understand the background of existence, you realise that suffering itself is how we live, and how we extend our life. So in Zen sometimes we emphasize the imbalance or disorder of life."

from: 'Zen Mind, Beginner's Mind', by Sunryu Suzuki
*****

'All this world is filled with coming and going.
Show me the path where there is no coming and there is no going'
Zen source

 

[godnotgod]

Well, somebody gets it, at least, so I guess we are making some semblance of progress.

I don't think he means what you think.

Zen says it this way:

"...freedom from anxiety can only be found at the point where the Self settles naturally upon itself."

...but not the self.

 

[godnotgod]

Thanks for clearing that up, I was bothered lol.

 

[godnotgod]

 

[Ben Dhyan]

I approach it as introspection by which the monkey behaves leading to understanding and acknowledgement concerning our nature.

This....what is this mind that is observing the monkey mind?

 

[Twilight Hue]

This....what is this mind that is observing the monkey mind?

Which mind is asking?

 

[YmirGF]

You have the wrong idea. Sorry, but 'monkey mind' does not allude to level of intelligence or behavior as in monkeys, but to the fact that the discursive mind is always jumping about, like a monkey. So while it is negative from the POV of Higher Consciousneness, it is not negative in the way you imagine.

Um, I'm quite aware of what it means, godnotgod. What is it with you continually making incorrect assumptions, LOL.

 

[YmirGF]

I don't think he means what you think.

Zen says it this way:

"...freedom from anxiety can only be found at the point where the Self settles naturally upon itself."

...but not the self.

Another assumption, I see. You have this down to an art form.
@atanu what say you? Care to elaborate on this statement?

The point in all religions ,IMO, is that the unborn must be heard about, then experienced within one's consciousness, and abided in as the very self.

 

[godnotgod]

Um, I'm quite aware of what it means, godnotgod. What is it with you continually making incorrect assumptions, LOL.

If you 'understand' the meaning, why the protest?

 

[godnotgod]

Another assumption, I see. You have this down to an art form.
@atanu what say you? Care to elaborate on this statement?

If The Unborn is experienced as The Unborn, it won't be via the self, but via the Self. The self is that which is subject to birth and death; the Self is Unborn and Deathless.

 

[YmirGF]

If The Unborn is experienced as The Unborn, it won't be via the self, but via the Self. The self is that which is subject to birth and death; the Self is Unborn and Deathless.

That sounds suspiciously like my quaint notion of the "larger identity". What gets me, is that you think that I haven't thought of all this, LOL. That IS continuously hilarious.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I really like the Shunryu Suzuki roshi and Alan Watts submissions fellas. Sincerely.


However it seems in posting the words you end up doing the Dogen hustle.

It's actually a bit like the Curly hustle woo woo woo woo nyuk nyuk nyuk.

Needs less cowbell though.

Your actually making me grin. _/\_

=0D

 

[godnotgod]

That sounds suspiciously like my quaint notion of the "larger identity". What gets me, is that you think that I haven't thought of all this, LOL. That IS continuously hilarious.

HA HA HA HA HA....good acting job!