The best Government System for people?

[Aquitaine]

Hi there folks, I'm wanting to know your opinions, or ideas on a hypothetical system of Government that reduces exploitation and mal-practice, maximizes effeciency, and treats it's Citizens well, and gives them suitable "power". It would also have to be able to maintain itself over time.

Any suggestions, or ideas? Even if you just made it up, any contribution is worthy!

 

[rojse]

Anarchy?

 

[Scarlett Wampus]

Anarchy * nods *

(I'm serious)

 

[Aquitaine]

I'm not very well-knowledged in the Politcal System of Anarchy. But isn't it similar with disbanding Government/hierachy and living in a sort of "tribe" system?

 

[Scarlett Wampus]

I'm not very well-knowledged in the Politcal System of Anarchy. But isn't it similar with disbanding Government/hierachy and living in a sort of "tribe" system?

Pretty much.

Its an almost singularly personal thing, my reasons for liking anarchy. I've come to believe that what we tend to see in civilisation as historically increasing complexity is an anthropomorphic distortion that masks a trend that's quite the opposite. Our advancement has reduced overall complexity of the biosphere and continues to do so at a growing rate. Its a sort of anarcho-taoist outlook.

In the opening to his essay Civil Disobedience, Henry David Thoreau wrote, 'I HEARTILY ACCEPT the motto, — "That government is best which governs least"; and I should like to see it acted up to more rapidly and systematically. Carried out, it finally amounts to this, which also I believe, — "That government is best which governs not at all"; and when men are prepared for it, that will be the kind of government which they will have.'

I agree with this with one difference. Similar to Chuang Tzu I believe we the emergence of government is itself a sign of immaturity, sure to lead away from the Tao.

 

[Aquitaine]

Pretty much.

Its an almost singularly personal thing, my reasons for liking anarchy. I've come to believe that what we tend to see in civilisation as historically increasing complexity is an anthropomorphic distortion that masks a trend that's quite the opposite. Our advancement has reduced overall complexity of the biosphere and continues to do so at a growing rate. Its a sort of anarcho-taoist outlook.

In the opening to his essay Civil Disobedience, Henry David Thoreau wrote, 'I HEARTILY ACCEPT the motto, — "That government is best which governs least"; and I should like to see it acted up to more rapidly and systematically. Carried out, it finally amounts to this, which also I believe, — "That government is best which governs not at all"; and when men are prepared for it, that will be the kind of government which they will have.'

I agree with this with one difference. Similar to Chuang Tzu I believe we the emergence of government is itself a sign of immaturity, sure to lead away from the Tao.

But wouldn't that just create a massive power vacuum and just go back to how it was in the past: groups of tribes fighting each other for control? Also, wouldn't it also have an effect on how well people can get access to distant resources? Because there's like no co-ordination etc?

Myself personally, I'm totally for the idea of a Government, it's just got to be one that's decent.

The way I see it is, I'd much rather live in a secure, safe, stable country, that offered excellent Healthcare/Education/Living standards and future prospects for all it's people that was Authoritiarian, rather than being totally "free" on my own living in a mud hut with barely any resources and people fighting all the time LOL! ^_^

So I guess that makes us opposites here, but nevertheless I want j00 to continue and elaborate on your reasons why, and what would your ideal Anarchist scenario/society be like, describe it to meh!

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

But wouldn't that just create a massive power vacuum and just go back to how it was in the past: groups of tribes fighting each other for control? Also, wouldn't it also have an effect on how well people can get access to distant resources? Because there's like no co-ordination etc?

Myself personally, I'm totally for the idea of a Government, it's just got to be one that's decent.

The way I see it is, I'd much rather live in a secure, safe, stable country, that offered excellent Healthcare/Education/Living standards and future prospects for all it's people that was Authoritiarian, rather than being totally "free" on my own living in a mud hut with barely any resources and people fighting all the time LOL! ^_^

So I guess that makes us opposites here, but nevertheless I want j00 to continue and elaborate on your reasons why, and what would your ideal Anarchist scenario/society be like, describe it to meh!

After the romans left Britain we went tribal again, and power struggles abounded.
However we still traded with the known world, and digs have found contemporary artifacts, jewelry. swords. pottery glass from all across that world, in virtually ever part of the UK.

This shows that "war like" and trade are not incompatible.

There have been many attempts at democracy but none have achieved peace.

 

[England my lionheart]

IMO Government should be small enough to know its people

 

[monta]

IMO Government should be small enough to know its people

Completely agree with you, I think this more than the system of government is the downfall of nations, what starts out as an unqualified success, on a small scale, expands and creates a powerful nation with an efficient infrastructure, which becomes refined and refined again, encompassing a greater population, creating sub divisions of government, which become self serving enclaves with their own agendas, completely divorced from the initial ideals of people who they purport to represent, and then, like some mythical behemoth feeding off itself, the society seems to grow bigger and stronger, but in reality the fabric of that society is being pulled more and more taut until it inevitably pulls apart at the seams.

yikes that went on a bit

 

[Yes Man]

Panarchy, if I thought it could work.

 

[monta]

Panarchy, if I thought it could work.

Panarchy makes me panicky :cover:

 

[England my lionheart]

Completely agree with you, I think this more than the system of government is the downfall of nations, what starts out as an unqualified success, on a small scale, expands and creates a powerful nation with an efficient infrastructure, which becomes refined and refined again, encompassing a greater population, creating sub divisions of government, which become self serving enclaves with their own agendas, completely divorced from the initial ideals of people who they purport to represent, and then, like some mythical behemoth feeding off itself, the society seems to grow bigger and stronger, but in reality the fabric of that society is being pulled more and more taut until it inevitably pulls apart at the seams.

yikes that went on a bit

You said it all Monta

 

[Yes Man]

Panarchy makes me panicky :cover:

?????

 

[Neo-Logic]

Hi there folks, I'm wanting to know your opinions, or ideas on a hypothetical system of Government that reduces exploitation and mal-practice, maximizes effeciency, and treats it's Citizens well, and gives them suitable "power". It would also have to be able to maintain itself over time.

Any suggestions, or ideas? Even if you just made it up, any contribution is worthy!

A federalist democracy with loosely regulated capitalist economy.

Example: America.

America has outlasted every other form of communist, socialist, fascist, and pseudo-democracies in the world and is economically superior than the rest.

 

[monta]

?????

I can't resist a pun , ashamed I am , well I would be if I did that sort of thing

 

[Aquitaine]

A federalist democracy with loosely regulated capitalist economy.

Example: America.

America has outlasted every other form of communist, socialist, fascist, and pseudo-democracies in the world and is economically superior than the rest.

lulwut?

 

[T-Dawg]

A federalist democracy with loosely regulated capitalist economy.

Example: America.

America has outlasted every other form of communist, socialist, fascist, and pseudo-democracies in the world and is economically superior than the rest.

... You have got to be kidding me. The American economy is crumbling beneath your very eyes while the "socialists" in Europe and the "communists" in China are still standing tall, yet you insist that America is economically superior to the rest of the world because it's capitalist?

Just out of curiosity, do you happen to be upper-middle class? It's ok to admit it, I'm white and upper-middle class myself. I'm one of those few that stand to gain from a capitalist, far-right society, but I decided that I had a conscience.

PS: America's only been around as it's own country since 1776. Other countries have lasted longer and are currently far more successful than Americans claim they are.

 

[rojse]

Panarchy, if I thought it could work.

Panarchy?

 

[Neo-Logic]

Amazing loser,

America economy is NOT crumbling before our eyes. DOW is back around the 10,000, the foreigners are still buying our mortgage backed bonds (because we're so god damn good still), our global trades are still strong, inflation is not doomed yet, housing has stopped declining. I feel like people scream "LOOK AMERICA IS DEAD AND GONE" when it goes through cycles like every other nation and try to use that as some sort of a definitive proof as to why we should stop being capitalist when there are NO GREAT ALTERNATIVES out there. The fact is, if another system was truly better, then the law of nature would make them the world's greatest economy. Currently, that's us, so why should we switch to inferior, and failed systems?

FYI: our GDP is still unmatched. And CHINA and EUROPE is standing TALL while our economy is crumbling? Can you look at the facts instead of just citing countries that fit your communist ideology? China and Europe were hit with the same problems we were. EU had to lower interest rates and they're struggling. China is suffering from a worldwide slip in retail markets and a host of other problems related to its uber-efficient government planned economy. We're still on top of the world, like it or not. The fact that our economy was in a recession doesn't take away from our #1 position.

And I'm middle-class. I've never had the privilege of being brought up in a rich family - and thankful for that. I spent half of my life under a dictatorship and centrally planned economy. Then I came here, worked hard, got good jobs made a lot of money and got to see corporate life. Now I'm in a really liberal town but I still hold both left and right wing ideas. I advocate for democracy and capitalism because they are proven to work, better so than the alternatives for OUR SIZE of a population and country, is sustainable more so than other systems, and the fact is, we're still here, and #1. Why would I possibly switch to any systems where people gets the benefits of my hard work when I know they don't deserve it under socialism or capitalism? See I believe in making good money, working hard, being ambitious, and struggling - any system that would deny people, or discourage people from these fundamentals of self-interest to me is not a sustainable system.

I'll tell you what, the day a communist country out does the United State economically, I will believe that it works. Until then, anyone who preaches Communism in today's world are preaching something that has proven to not work in reality. End of story.

 

[Neo-Logic]

lulwut?

Well, you asked!

All systems of government are hypothetical .... and are ideas .... and I do not think myself, or most of us here, can out do the founding fathers and originalists on the best crafted instrument of governance in the Constitution.