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Sumerian mythology?

DanielR

Active Member
If I'd follow Sumerian mythology or ancient religion, would I be considered Satanist?

I don't know really why but I had the feeling that a lot of people equate Sumerian religion with Satanism, is this true?

Thanks :)
 

Mindmaster

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
A lot of people see things in a soft-polytheistic light:

Satan
The Horned God
Enki
Prometheus
Shemyaza
Melek Taus
Lucifer
etc...

May all be the same guy to them. I wouldn't think that the Sumerian religion is overly important to most Satanists... They may use the names for aesthetic value, but it is more likely that the particulars of the historical religion are not applicable -- most religious Satanists are recreating their religion from folk practices and using other sources which are much more modern. Other than having a historical record and some mythology not very much is known about how similar the ancients practices were to ours... In some cultures, like Greek, we have very good direct sources of their actual ritual practices but for those older cultures we mostly can only speculate. Most modern Satanists aren't going to be too interested in trying to mimic the speculative belief structures of the ancients -- we just don't know what they really thought of these matters, and most of the "facts" we have were written down by people who were not of their mindset and were interpreted.
 

DanielR

Active Member
thanks :)

what is your opinion of the JoyofSatan site? Is it reliable?

What sites are recommended (or books)?

Thank you :p
 

Mindmaster

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
JoyOfSatan isn't regarded as Satanism, but rather some Nazi's who like Satanic Occult things. Most of their text is copy/paste from somewhere else. You should probably try this first:

Satan's Den
 

EtuMalku

Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
If I'd follow Sumerian mythology or ancient religion, would I be considered Satanist?

I don't know really why but I had the feeling that a lot of people equate Sumerian religion with Satanism, is this true?

Thanks :)
Not at all
 

1137

Here until I storm off again
Premium Member
There's tons of Sumerian Satanism, at least pseudo Sumerian. Kenneth Grant, for example.
 

Mindmaster

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Kenneth Grant? He was like an OTO die-hard... Sorry, Satanism... not even in the slightest...
 

crossfire

LHP Mercuræn Feminist Heretic ☿
Premium Member
What does Kenneth Grant have to do with Sumerian mythology being generally considered as Satanic or not? Would you consider Zecharia Sitchin (who could read and translate Sumerian, and wrote extensively about it) to be Satanic? Granted, Sitchin took quite a bit of poetic license in his writings, but does that make him or Sumerian mythology Satanic? (Remember, we are talking generalities here, so you would have to demonstrate a clear trend towards Sumerian mytholgy being considered as Satanic.)
 

1137

Here until I storm off again
Premium Member
Yes, let's ignore everything anyone ever said if they had downs in their life. Great occultism right there. This is a joke.

1. Sumerian is not considered satanic in itself by anyone worth listening to.

2. Sumerian can be integrated into lhp occultism, and often has been.

Seems like the thread is resolved.
 

Adramelek

Setian
Premium Member
The Sumerian Abzu or Absu (Abyss) has long been of interest to me as an ancient reflection of the primordial Watery Abyss, the abode of Leviathan, the Eternal Serpent. The Dragon Tiamat is also an interesting Daimon.

Tiamat_p93.jpg
 
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DanielR

Active Member
In Jungian terms, could it be that Marduk slaying Tiamat is equivalent to consciousness "winning" over the Unconscious?
 

Mindmaster

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
In Jungian terms, could it be that Marduk slaying Tiamat is equivalent to consciousness "winning" over the Unconscious?

These connections are tenuous at best, thus my caution about our interpretations vs the realities of these things. For Sumerians, these were beings not archetypes -- there is no evidence that anything that was described was metaphor. Calling something an archetype is pretty much saying that it is "not real only conceptual" which I don't think reflects the views of the ancients.

We can turn anything to some sort of metaphorical comparison that pleases us where no relation exists, and generally this is the type of thing that goes on in the Western Hermetic tradition. Everything must fit the Qabalah or some other super-system or that system is invalid -- but it is just a placebo effect it only fits in topically. I think in this case that is mostly what is going on...
 

1137

Here until I storm off again
Premium Member
To me the story of Tiamat, as well as most serpents, seems to describe the nature of the circumpolar stars. If Sumer is as old as some scholars believe, they would have seen alpha draconis, in the Draco constellation, become the dominant pole star. Their stories would the naturally include the danger of the approaching serpent and the need to vanquish it.
 

Aštra’el

Aštara, Blade of Aštoreth
In Jungian terms, could it be that Marduk slaying Tiamat is equivalent to consciousness "winning" over the Unconscious?

Or Order over Chaos, but yes, the Conscious mind over the Subconscious mind is another great way of looking at it and interpreting the myth. Tiamat was a primordial goddess of Chaos, the embodiment of the Abyss, the raging primordial waters.... whose body was used to create the world. This could be perceived as the universe before its current state, or the oceans before life... or the imagination, the subconscious, that dark Abyss from which all our thoughts and ideas and emotions emerge...

And, considering how much freedom you have to control, develop and explore your own spiritual/ religious system in the LHP, I too would have you believe that Sumero-Babylonian mythology or any mythology for that matter, even Abrahamic, can be integrated into your LHP views with great success and meaning.

 
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