So much for Indonesia being a bastion of tolerance...

[Revoltingest]

I worded what I said poorly. It wasn't meant as an accusation (though the way I worded it made it sound quite the opposite) because, as you succinctly put, privilege is not something you can help. Unfortunately the libertarian approach on this i.e. 'just stick it all under the same laws, it makes no difference' does not help to actually correct the problems that caused said crimes in the first place.

I entirely disagree.
If we fight the actual problem, eg, crimes, assaults, then we also fight the actions based upon bigotry, hatred & prejudice.
We can fix problems simply because they're problems, whatever their cause....even problems which aren't about bigotry.

Your way does have a downside because of its narrow focus....
I prefer that laws not fight some crimes with greater fervor than identical ones simply because of the kind of motive.
Is murdering an ordinary citizen unworthy of the attention given to murdering a cop?
I can understand why cops think so, but I disagree.
Do black lives matter more than others?
On this last one, more white guys are wrongfully killed by cops than black guys.
But the problem is addressed as solely a racial one, while I see a larger one of
cops abusing their authority with impunity against us all. And even this is part
of a large one of legal & judicial corruption.

You're certainly welcome to pursue whatever perspective you have,
but tis hubris to dismiss someone else's as ignorance due to "privilege'.
You wouldn't want to be accused of victimization politics, eh?

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

...

I'll respond to your post tomorrow. I don't have the energy to stay awake and give this the attention it deserves right now.

 

[Revoltingest]

I'll respond to your post tomorrow. I don't have the energy to stay awake and give this the attention it deserves right now.

I don't deserve much attention.
I'll settle for a little name calling.
(That's enuf for me to feel wanted.)

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

I entirely disagree.
If we fight the actual problem, eg, crimes, assaults, then we also fight the actions based upon bigotry, hatred & prejudice.
We can fix problems simply because they're problems, whatever their cause....even problems which aren't about bigotry.

You can't hope to stop problems at the source if you don't tackle the cause of those problems. I'm sure you've heard the saying 'ounce of prevention, pound of cure'.

Your way does have a downside because of its narrow focus....

Say what? My way has a narrow focus? Your way would have us treat every crime the same regardless of motive - establishing motive is imperative to tackling & reducing crime in the long run. Your way is seems reactionary.

I prefer that laws not fight some crimes with greater fervor than identical ones simply because of the kind of motive.
Is murdering an ordinary citizen unworthy of the attention given to murdering a cop?
I can understand why cops think so, but I disagree.

I agree with you on this because I don't agree that government officials' lives should be held above those of others. Police seem to react more urgently to these crimes because it's seen as an attack against them.

Do black lives matter more than others?

That's not what the movement is about. It's not 'Black Lives Matter more' it's 'Black Lives Matter too'.

On this last one, more white guys are wrongfully killed by cops than black guys.
But the problem is addressed as solely a racial one, while I see a larger one of
cops abusing their authority with impunity against us all. And even this is part
of a large one of legal & judicial corruption.

That's because there are more white people in America than blacks. I think you need to look at the arrest & fatal shootings for blacks & whites as a percentage of their respective populations. Then you'd see that blacks suffer way more proportionally speaking.

You're certainly welcome to pursue whatever perspective you have,
but tis hubris to dismiss someone else's as ignorance due to "privilege'.
You wouldn't want to be accused of victimization politics, eh?

You say your perspective isn't due to white privilege yet you put that privilege on display by opting out of racism. You've got the option of simply pretending it doesn't exist or that it's not a factor. Minorities don't have that luxury. I apologise for my bringing up the term in a bad way, but it really wasn't meant as an accusation. Besides - I'm in no position to point fingers as I have white privilege as well.

 

[Revoltingest]

You can't hope to stop problems at the source if you don't tackle the cause of those problems. I'm sure you've heard the saying 'ounce of prevention, pound of cure'.

Exactly!

Say what? My way has a narrow focus? Your way would have us treat every crime the same regardless of motive - establishing motive is imperative to tackling & reducing crime in the long run. Your way is seems reactionary.

Were I to use the term, I'd say your way, is the reactionary way because it's about giving more attention to crimes which flame public passions.
I'm more of a generalist.
But I don't like the term, "reactionary".
It's dismissive without really saying anything.

I agree with you on this because I don't agree that government officials' lives should be held above those of others. Police seem to react more urgently to these crimes because it's seen as an attack against them.

It shows the problem with tribal thinking, ie, they care more about their own.
And in this case they wield more political clout than others....you know, because they posture as heroic.

That's not what the movement is about. It's not 'Black Lives Matter more' it's 'Black Lives Matter too'.

But that's not what the slogan is about.
And the protests are about only black folk being abused.
I don't fault them for this myopia, but neither do I believe it reasonable for them to expect everyone to buy into it.

That's because there are more white people in America than blacks. I think you need to look at the arrest & fatal shootings for blacks & whites as a percentage of their respective populations. Then you'd see that blacks suffer way more proportionally speaking.

What makes you think I haven't looked into it?
Unlike undue force, shootings might not be so racially disparate......
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/12/u...e-use-of-force-but-not-in-shootings.html?_r=0
Moreover, we have pervasive racism in the news, which treats black deaths as far more significant than white or other deaths.
This interferes with finding more general solutions to protect everyone, & it inflames anti-white racism & anti-cop violence.

You say your perspective isn't due to white privilege...

I haven't said this.

....yet you put that privilege on display by opting out of racism. You've got the option of simply pretending it doesn't exist or that it's not a factor.

Just as I don't pretend my views, I assume you don't either.
But my perspective is no less legitimate than black, red, yellow or other ones.
We all differ, but I utterly reject the argument that they can know, but we cannot.
But I cannot "opt out of race" (whatever that means), since it affects me too.

Minorities don't have that luxury. I apologise for my bringing up the term in a bad way, but it really wasn't meant as an accusation. Besides - I'm in no position to point fingers as I have white privilege as well.

"Privilege" is not the problem, & focusing upon it distracts from what matters,
ie, the wrong being done to people, whatever their race, religion or gender.