1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured Since we are at the “end times” what are the revelations of Daniel 12:10?

Discussion in 'Scriptural Debates' started by 2ndpillar, Feb 6, 2018.

  1. Hockeycowboy

    Hockeycowboy Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2015
    Messages:
    7,020
    Ratings:
    +4,119
    Religion:
    Christian
    People have to change themselves, though.

    Yes, God provides the means to refine them, but they have to take the appropriate action, to clean themselves, by repentance and obedience.
    That has always been the case, as we read throughout the Scriptures. Romans 12:1-3 is one such passage.

    No. As with all other verses that are deemed questionable by some, the following versions put that accusation to rest, at least here in regard to Daniel 12:10; they read similar to NWT:



    English Standard Version
    Many shall purify themselves and make themselves white and be refined, but the wicked shall act wickedly. And none of the wicked shall understand, but those who are wise shall understand.



    JPS Tanakh 1917
    Many shall purify themselves, and make themselves white, and be refined; but the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand; but they that are wise shall understand.



    American Standard Version
    Many shall purify themselves, and make themselves white, and be refined; but the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand; but they that are wise shall understand.



    English Revised Version
    Many shall purify themselves; and make themselves white, and be refined; but the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand: but they that be wise shall understand.



    World English Bible
    Many shall purify themselves, and make themselves white, and be refined; but the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand; but those who are wise shall understand.



    Young's Literal Translation
    Purify themselves, yea, make themselves white, yea, refined are many: and the wicked have done wickedly, and none of the wicked understand, and those acting wisely do understand;
     
    • Like Like x 2
  2. wizanda

    wizanda One Accepts All Religious Texts
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2004
    Messages:
    8,421
    Ratings:
    +1,969
    Religion:
    Øneness
    Daniel 12:2-3 is saying that the wise will shine at this point, which we find in Revelation 15:2.

    This to me is the Baptism of Holy Fire, our whole reality is to be washed, and what is Godly remains, what is demonic shall fall into the Pits of Hell (Isaiah 24, Isaiah 34).

    In my opinion. :innocent:
     
  3. Kangaroo Feathers

    Kangaroo Feathers Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...

    Joined:
    May 19, 2017
    Messages:
    10,648
    Ratings:
    +8,445
    Religion:
    Catholic
    Oh good, another condescending yet evidence free answer.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  4. 2ndpillar

    2ndpillar Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2013
    Messages:
    2,692
    Ratings:
    +184

    Daniel 12:2-3 is about “those who sleep in the dust of the ground will awake”, which is the resurrection of the righteous, who do not have the “mark of the beast” (Revelation 20:4). Those that “have insight”, which are not the “wicked” (Revelation 12:10), will “lead the many to righteousness” (Daniel 12:3). What Revelation 15:2 is talking about, is “those who had come off victorious from the beast….and the number of his name”, and have not the “mark of the beast” (Revelation 20:4). That resurrection precedes the “great tribulation”, and the “armies…. clothed in fine linen, white and clean, were following Him on white horses” (Revelation 19:14). The fine linen, white and clean” represents the “righteous acts of the saints” (Revelation 19:8)

    It is the “angel coming down from heaven” who “bound” “Satan” for “a thousand years” and “threw him into the abyss”. There is no “baptism of Holy Fire”. There is the baptism of the Holy Spirit, and one of “fire” (Matthew 3:11). Isaiah 24 is about: “therefore the inhabitants of the earth are burned, and few men are left”. They are killed with fire, smoke, and brimstone (Revelation 9:18). There would be the “refining fire” for the “little ones”, in which only 1/3 came out alive and refined. Two thirds shall “perish” (Zechariah 13:8-9). As for the nations/Gentiles, those that remains, will be under the rule of a “rod of iron” (Revelation 19:15), with the surviving liars “outside the gates” (Revelation 22:14-15). You will have the righteous and the wicked, and “the one who does wrong, still do wrong” (Revelation 22:11). Their judgment will be in line with what they “do”. There is no “hell”, there is only the pit called “Sheol” where dead bodies are thrown. The demons are not thrown into “hell”/Sheol, but into the “abyss”, where the Satan will remain “bound” for 1000 years (Revelation 20:2).
     
    • Creative Creative x 1
  5. 2ndpillar

    2ndpillar Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2013
    Messages:
    2,692
    Ratings:
    +184
    Bravo, you have found bibles that support your unsupportable case. I can do the same, but make a verifiable case (Zechariah 13:9-9), and show the majority number of bibles support the version I presented. Approximately 6 out of 24 support your version. Daniel 12:10 Many will be purified, made spotless and refined, but the wicked will continue to be wicked. None of the wicked will understand, but those who are wise will understand.

    As far as "repentance", "confession" and "water baptism" (Matthew 3), they were all followed by the "brood of vipers", trying to escape from the "wrath to come", yet it is doubtful, that they brought forth "fruit in keeping with your repentance" (Matthew 3:10) and will ultimately be "cut off" and "thrown into the fire". . As for the JW's keeping the Commandments, they follow the "beast with two horns like a lamb", and accept his Roman church as the source of the Word of God, and their form of the Commandments/being obedient. (Daniel 7:25)

    New American Standard Bible Daniel 12:10
    "Many will be purged, purified and refined, but the wicked will act wickedly; and none of the wicked will understand, but those who have insight will understand.

    King James Bible Daniel 12:10
    Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.
     
  6. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    6,867
    Ratings:
    +570
    Religion:
    Christian
    All that you given does not line up.

    In the book of Zechariah 12:1-8,
    In Verse 3, what is that ( day ) being spoken of, when does this ( day ) take place according to the book of Revelation ?

    What does it mean in Verse 3 "All the people of the earth be gathered together against it" This be Jerusalem.
    but when does this all take place according to the book of Revelation ?

    That of Zechariah 12:11 and
    Revelation 16:16, When does this all take place According to the book of Revelation, that all nations are gathered together to be Destroyed ?
     
  7. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    6,867
    Ratings:
    +570
    Religion:
    Christian

    Do you have any idea who the beast is that has two horns that comes up out of the earth, Who is this according to the book of Revelation ?
    As to how do you get the beast that comes up out of the earth that has two horns like a lamb, As being the Roman Catholic Church ?
     
  8. 2ndpillar

    2ndpillar Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2013
    Messages:
    2,692
    Ratings:
    +184
    "That day" was in 1967 during the 1967 Israeli war (Daniel 2:34), whereas the Russian tanks/horses, were stricken with "madness", and the "clans of Judah" were a "flaming torch among the sheaves". This set up the restoration of Judah and "Jerusalem" (Joel 3:1-2), which set up the "gathering of all the nations to the valley of judgment (Daniel 2:34) & (Zechariah 14:1-3), which is just behind to the door (Matthew 24:23).
     
  9. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    6,867
    Ratings:
    +570
    Religion:
    Christian
    So your saying that day already happened in 1967, Wow that's amazing, I didn't know Christ Jesus second coming already happen, and I though all this time the second coming of Christ Jesus was still future yet. And your saying it happen back in 1967, now that's amazing.
     
  10. 2ndpillar

    2ndpillar Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2013
    Messages:
    2,692
    Ratings:
    +184

    The Roman Catholic church is not a beast. She is a daughter (Revelation 17:5) of the “woman”, Babylon, sitting on the beast with 7 heads (Revelation 17:3).

    The “beast with two horns like a lamb” who “deceived” “those who dwell on the earth”is the Roman emperor Constantine, the “another”king of Daniel 7:24-25, who institutionalized the Roman church at his convened Council of Nicaea. The two horns like a lamb, which are Christ like leaders, are the two staffs of Zechariah 11:4-7, who are Peter (Zechariah 11:16-17) and Paul (Zechariah 11;10). The Roman Church and her daughters, the Protestant churches, would be the “flock doomed to slaughter” (Zechariah 11:4-7). Tick tock.
     
  11. 2ndpillar

    2ndpillar Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2013
    Messages:
    2,692
    Ratings:
    +184
    You might want to read and listen before speaking. The war of 1967 was with respect to Daniel 2:34. The "Day of the LORD", is with respect to Daniel 2:35 & 44. You cannot have the day of the LORD (Zechariah 14:1-3) & Daniel 2:35 & Joel 3:2 & Matthew 24:17 & Joel 2:31-32, without first restoring Jerusalem (Joel 3:1-2).
     
  12. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    6,867
    Ratings:
    +570
    Religion:
    Christian

    Who told you all this. Because they have no idea who the mother of Harlots is nor who the beast is that comes up out of the earth with two horns like a lamb.

    The beast with two horns like a lamb, that comes up out of the earth, This is Satan impersonating Christ Jesus. To deceive those who dwell upon the earth into believing that he is Christ Jesus.

    The Mother of Harlots of Revelation 17, is the Spirit of confusion that has all the nations of the world in confusion
     
  13. Sleeppy

    Sleeppy Fatalist. Christian. Pacifist.

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2011
    Messages:
    5,758
    Ratings:
    +406
    Where is the end to self-righteousness? You find that first.
     
  14. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    6,867
    Ratings:
    +570
    Religion:
    Christian
    You might want to get things right before you go jumping into things, that your not making any sense by.

    The Day of the Lord, is Christ Jesus second coming. Which is still future from us.
    Therefore when Daniel and Joel speaks of that day, this is reference to the day of the Lord Christ Jesus second coming.
     
  15. Phantasman

    Phantasman Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2017
    Messages:
    1,963
    Ratings:
    +467
    Religion:
    Christian gnosis
    Orthodoxy have been using this tactic for 2000 years. If the Jews couldn't see Jesus as the truth, I doubt they can predict the end times with any better accuracy.

    Paul tells us as Christians what to think on. Philippians 4:8
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. 2ndpillar

    2ndpillar Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2013
    Messages:
    2,692
    Ratings:
    +184

    The son of hell, the false prophet Paul, goes on in Philippians 4:9, to define what is right and pure, is what comes out of his mouth. Of course those practicing what Paul gave them, have no “peace” nor “God” with them. (Phil 4:9)

    As for the “holy people” of Daniel 12:7, it is not until “they finish shattering the power of the holy people, all these events will be completed”. The “shattering” of the power of the holy people was finished in 1967 Israel war, and they are now a world power, with the power to help the LORD “fight at Jerusalem” (Zechariah 14:14). And the LORD will strike down all the people who have gone to war against Jerusalem”(Zechariah 14:12) with a curse, whereas those “peoples” will have “their flesh rot while they stand on their feet”.
     
  17. Bartholomew

    Bartholomew New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2018
    Messages:
    9
    Ratings:
    +2
    Religion:
    Jehovah's Witnesses
     
  18. Bartholomew

    Bartholomew New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2018
    Messages:
    9
    Ratings:
    +2
    Religion:
    Jehovah's Witnesses
    The whisperer in revelation is the "Dragon" the "original serpent" the one called Devil and Satan who is misleading the entire inhabited Earth. Revelation 12:9 NWT.

    This war will happen when The United Nations forms one world government and is inspired by Satan to initiate an all out invasion on Jehovah's People. This will then lead to the coalition being gathered together to wage a literal war with God the almighty at a symbolic location called Armageddon (Mount Megiddo). Revelation 16:13,14 NWT

    It will probably be reported in the News media at that time.
     
  19. 2ndpillar

    2ndpillar Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2013
    Messages:
    2,692
    Ratings:
    +184

    Daniel 2:34 is not the “Day of the LORD” it is the day that the feet of iron and clay were crushed. The “Day of the LORD is Daniel 2:35, when all the nations are crushed “all at the same time”. That day is just behind the door (Matthew 24:23).

    If Joel 2 & 3 confuses you, keep in mind that the bible repeats itself using different parables. Judah and Jerusalem have to first be restored (Joel 3:1) before those in Jerusalem can escape, be “delivered”(Joel 2:31-32) After Jerusalem is restored (Joel 3:1), “I will gather all the nations , and bring them down to the valley of judgment (Joel 3:1-2). “Before the great and awesome day of the LORD comes, and it will come about that whoever calls on the name of the LORD will be delivered” (Joel 2:31-32) "which follows blood, fire, and smoke, and the moon into blood”. Well we have just had two blood moons in one month, and one of the head Rabbis in Jerusalem just died after having a dream of Yeshua being the Messiah (Joel 2:28). Jerusalem was restored per Joel 3:1, and “Jerusalem” will be “captured” before the LORD comes to fight. (Zechariah 14:1-3). The restoration of Jerusalem is in the past, the ”capture” of “Jerusalem” is in the future. That will be when the “LORD” “fights”. That will be when you will say to the mountains “hide us from.... the wrath of the Lamb” (Revelation 6:16), when every mountain and island are moved out of their place” (Revelation 6:14).
     
  20. Faithofchristian

    Faithofchristian Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2017
    Messages:
    6,867
    Ratings:
    +570
    Religion:
    Christian

    As to how do you come by Armageddon as being a Symbolic Location, when Revelation 16:16-21 & Revelation 20:7-9 points out it's a literal location ?
     
Loading...