Sin

[zenzero]

Friends,

What is a * SIN *?

Personally SIN is when one's concious disagrees with the action done and the individual suffers due to that guilt.
A professional Killer, may not have guilt similar to a Butcher who too kills animals. It is not a sin for them as they are not yet CONCIOUS as to who they are and what other beings are. Karma takes care of those deeds.

Comment / discuss / ignore / whatever
BUT just with AWARENESS / CONCIOUSNESS

Love & rgds

 

[Guitar's Cry]

We are emotional beings in a seemingly tumultuous universe. Sin appears to be the experience of that emotion defining itself in the individual.

 

[Dunemeister]

Sin is "missing the mark," which implies that there's a mark that people are missing.

 

[zenzero]

Friend Guitar's Cry,

Sin appears to be the experience of that emotion defining itself in the individual.

Can you explain this sentence further by what way, etc.?

 

[zenzero]

Friend Dunemister,

Sin is "missing the mark," which implies that there's a mark that people are missing.

Kindly clarify further as to what is this mark you are talking about? hOW AND where is this marK MISSED, etc.?

 

[oldcajun]

A Bible definition: I John 3:4 "...sin is the transgression of the law."

Referring here to the Torah including the Ten commandments.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

Friend Guitar's Cry,


Can you explain this sentence further by what way, etc.?

Well, sin is highly tied to emotion; we suffer because we respond emotionally to our sensory information.

Sin is an action that is deemed immoral by the amount of suffering it brings to people.

But emotions are very individual, even when shared. When someone experiences sin, it is their emotion responding to suffering either of oneself or another (though that must come back through oneself).

 

[Mister Emu]

A sin is an act contrary to the will of God...

 

[Dunemeister]

Friend Dunemister,

Kindly clarify further as to what is this mark you are talking about? hOW AND where is this marK MISSED, etc.?

I'm just saying what the word means. Originally, it had to do with an archer missing a target. To miss the target (or the bullseye) is to "sin." Later Greek writers analogically extended the term to morality, whether that morality was based on some sort of philosophy, as in the case of the ancient Greeks and Romans, or on God's law, as in the case of the ancient Christians, who used the word to translate the Hebrew word that meant to transgress God's law. Thus sin came to mean to transgress God's law in Jewish and Christian circles.

This is what the word means. Pace Guitar's Cry, emotion and suffering are irrelevant to the meaning of the word. One can sin without emotion, and one can ascribe sin to someone without emotion. Degree of suffering is also irrelevant. The Hebrews, for example, said that eating a pig is a sin. Apart from the harm done to the pig, there's no harm done in eating a pig (assuming it's cooked correctly, but the same can be said about all forms of meat). When Guitar's Cry and others speak of experience and emotion and so forth, they have left off speaking of sin and are discussion something else. It's a category mistake to call that stuff "sin."

The only question with respect to sin is what constitutes the "mark" that we are "missing" in any case. What moral law is there that we're falling short of? And what is the basis for that moral law? Without that moral law, there's no sin.

 

[zenzero]

Friend Guitar's Cry,

Well, sin is highly tied to emotion; we suffer because we respond emotionally to our sensory information.

Sin is an action that is deemed immoral by the amount of suffering it brings to people.

But emotions are very individual, even when shared. When someone experiences sin, it is their emotion responding to suffering either of oneself or another (though that must come back through oneself).

Exactly. The individual sufferring due to his own actions [karma] is a result of the guilt which is emotions that you are stating. Agreed.
Love & rgds

 

[zenzero]

Friend Dunemeister,
Now, do understand your point.
What you are stating is socially termed as having committed a SIN but that is not necessarily have any emotional or any guilt feeling by the doer.
So many times we do some thing wrong in school and the teacher punishes us but we even enjoy that punishment so here we are not sufferring due to that action which others may consider a sin even though one may be off the MARK.
Love 7 rgds

 

[.lava]

Friends,

What is a * SIN *?

Personally SIN is when one's concious disagrees with the action done and the individual suffers due to that guilt.
A professional Killer, may not have guilt similar to a Butcher who too kills animals. It is not a sin for them as they are not yet CONCIOUS as to who they are and what other beings are. Karma takes care of those deeds.

Comment / discuss / ignore / whatever
BUT just with AWARENESS / CONCIOUSNESS

Love & rgds

dear friend zenzero,

in this world everything gets dirty all the time. houses, cars, clothes, bodies...etc. these are what gets dirty on the outside. we have to clean them once in awhile. there is also a world within. sin is the dirt of inside. we need to purify our egos to clean it.


.

 

[zenzero]

Friend Mister Emu,

A sin is an act contrary to the will of God...

That is a wild statement as god itself means differently to different people BUT the WILL of GOD must surely be ONE for all humans which can never be known as GOD does not exists exceptt in human minds that also because god is a concept long established and accepted and words like TAO are not yet popular which gives a different understanding than the word god.
Love & rgds

 

[zenzero]

Friend .lava,

sin is the dirt of inside. we need to purify our egos to clean it.

EGO. one can never clean it. One has to *LET GO* of it.
Ego is nothing but the MIND as a personality.
Love & rgds

 

[.lava]

Friend .lava,


EGO. one can never clean it. One has to *LET GO* of it.
Ego is nothing but the MIND as a personality.
Love & rgds

friend zenzero,

purifying ego is my path. according to knowledge i am given it is possible to purify ego and it should be done. imho this is one of the differences between human and animal. animal could not go for fasting. human can. cos human can be patient. ego does not want to be patient. but we choose to be.


.

 

[zenzero]

Friend .lava,

purifying ego is my path. according to knowledge i am given it is possible to purify ego and it should be done. imho this is one of the differences between human and animal. animal could not go for fasting. human can. cos human can be patient. ego does not want to be patient. but we choose to be.

Understand what you are trying to communicate here.
Before we go into that,
Kindly explain what you mean by EGO and how does it get dirty and how to purify it.
Love & rgds

 

[Sunstone]

One can feel guilt for all sorts of things that are not wrong. Guilt is a very poor test of whether something is right or wrong.

 

[zenzero]

Friend Sunstone,
Maybe the choice of words may not be appropriate.
Can you suggest some scale which should stand the test?
Any action can be termed Sin on one side and not sin on the other side with ranges like small sin, minor sin and something similar on the other side.
Any suggesstions?
Love & rgds

 

[.lava]

Friend .lava,

Understand what you are trying to communicate here.
Before we go into that,
Kindly explain what you mean by EGO and how does it get dirty and how to purify it.
Love & rgds

here is a short summary of what i know;

we have three bodies. physical/soul=ego=body we have in dreams/Spirit = that belongs to God and therefor perfect.

daily practices effect physical and soul bodies. soul has heart like physical body and it is full of vices. opposites of each vice is a virtue that Spirit naturally has.

i can not purify heart of soul on my own. each vice could be cleaned by a name of God. practice is called zikr. as we repeat name of Allah, we also repeat certain names at certain number. Names of God, carries Nur. Nur means light maybe. but it is from God. we also perform salaats. that's how soul is purified. if i did not know anyone who complete this process, i could not exactly understand it. thank God, it is not that far to meet saints.



.

 

[Dunemeister]

That is a wild statement as god itself means differently to different people BUT the WILL of GOD must surely be ONE for all humans which can never be known as GOD does not exists exceptt in human minds that also because god is a concept long established and accepted and words like TAO are not yet popular which gives a different understanding than the word god.
Love & rgds

The idea that "sin" is "action or thought contrary to the will of God" is hardly "wild." It's mainstream in the West and Africa and gaining acceptance in the East with the wild propagation of both Islam and Christianity in those regions. Granted, the word "sin" would have to mean something very different under a taoist interpretation. Perhaps someone could tell us what room taoism has for the concept of sin.