Sin is real

[Sonic247]

Probably most people here would say that sin isn't real. But I bet everyone here has done something there conscience told them not to and has suffered from a guilt complex because of it. So do you think good and evil exists in this world as something more than developments in our own brain, is there really no need to repent. In fact for people who know how bad their sin is the sacrifice of Jesus makes the most since. They think how can I ever be righteous, and they look at what Jesus did at his death and it's like he saying, yeah but look how much I went through for it. Anyone that comes to Jesus can definitely be forgiven.

 

[linwood]

Probably most people here would say that sin isn't real.

I`d agree with them.

But I bet everyone here has done something there conscience told them not to and has suffered from a guilt complex because of it.

Most definitely.

So do you think good and evil exists in this world as something more than developments in our own brain, is there really no need to repent.

All simply human concepts.
No need to repent.

In fact for people who know how bad their sin is the sacrifice of Jesus makes the most since.

What sacrifice?

They think how can I ever be righteous, and they look at what Jesus did at his death and it's like he saying, yeah but look how much I went through for it. Anyone that comes to Jesus can definitely be forgiven.

Really?
Charles Manson went to Jesus.
So did Jim Jones.
Jeffrey Dahmer.
Hitler.
Eric Rudolph
Timothy McViegh

Funny how these guys will be forgiven according to your doctrine yet my wonderfully kind, helpful, wouldn`t hurt a bug, give the shirt of his back, gay, atheist, friend is done for.

Thanks but no thanks, I`d rather burn with the homos.

 

[Sonic247]

I`d agree with them.



Most definitely.



All simply human concepts.
No need to repent.



What sacrifice?



Really?
Charles Manson went to Jesus.
So did Jim Jones.
Jeffrey Dahmer.
Hitler.
Eric Rudolph
Timothy McViegh

Funny how these guys will be forgiven according to your doctrine yet my wonderfully kind, helpful, wouldn`t hurt a bug, give the shirt of his back, gay, atheist, friend is done for.

Thanks but no thanks, I`d rather burn with the homos.

I have my doubts that anyone on that list really cared that much about Jesus. You know the whole "tree is known by it's fruits" thing. I think the verse that would best go with that is Galatians 6:7- Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. But maybe one of them did get saved who knows.

 

[linwood]

I have my doubts that anyone on that list really cared that much about Jesus. You know the whole "tree is known by it's fruits" thing. I think the verse that would best go with that is Galatians 6:7- Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. But maybe one of them did get saved who knows.

I`m not really into the whole "true Christian" argument but prison has a way of exponentially spitting out converts.


Point is still unanswered.

Christian doctrine states that Hitler himself has a spot in heaven yet Gandhi is burning in hell.

You think this is just?

 

[Sonic247]

Why not, if Christianity is real then a "true Christian" has the Holy Spirit living in him. And that's not something you can see so anyone can say they are a Christian. And I never read anything in the Bible about Hitler or Ghandi. There are different people saying different things about what Hitler believed, but I know it wasn't Christianity.

 

[linwood]

Why not, if Christianity is real then a "true Christian" has the Holy Spirit living in him.

So let me just get this perfectly straight.

Under your moral standards given to you by the doctrine of Christianity, eternally rewarding a murderous genocidal maniac while at the same time eternally torturing a man who brought peace and freedom to hundreds of thousands and inspired it in millions more, is good and just?

This is justice?
This is good?

And that's not something you can see so anyone can say they are a Christian. And I never read anything in the Bible about Hitler or Ghandi. There are different people saying different things about what Hitler believed, but I know it wasn't Christianity.

In the same sentence you state that a persons "Christianity" can`t be seen while simultaneously stating that you "know" Hitler wasn`t a Christian.

Do you see a problem with that statement?

FYI: Hitler was a Catholic .

“I am now as before a Catholic and will always remain so.”

“Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord.”

The Religious Views of Adolf Hitler

 

[Sonic247]

So let me just get this perfectly straight.

Under your moral standards given to you by the doctrine of Christianity, eternally rewarding a murderous genocidal maniac while at the same time eternally torturing a man who brought peace and freedom to hundreds of thousands and inspired it in millions more, is good and just?

This is justice?
This is good?

In the same sentence you state that a persons "Christianity" can`t be seen while simultaneously stating that you "know" Hitler wasn`t a Christian.

Do you see a problem with that statement?

FYI: Hitler was a Catholic .

Yes, your right about that I'll admit it. I guess I don't no for sure. Let me put it this way though if I knew hypothetically that one of them went to heaven and had to bet on it I would go for Ghandi. Although after the British left there was a civil war, so whatever his intentions I don't think he brought peace, although maybe more freedom for India.

 

[Phasmid]

Rationally... there isn't any good or evil. There are wise and unwise choices.

The thing about percieved 'evil' is that it usually comes back to bite you in the butt. But really there is no tangible thing/entity/whatever, that you can identify as evil.

Of course it's very easy for me to say this sat in my cosey home without worry. But if someone were to rape someone I loved, or tortured them, I imagine I'd consider them evil... and also I'd likely kill them for what they'd done... and end up like them... tangent... must... get back... to... topic...

Uhhh... so yeah, I don't see there being sin as such. IMO it's more to do with wise and unwise decisions.

 

[logician]

Probably most people here would say that sin isn't real. But I bet everyone here has done something there conscience told them not to and has suffered from a guilt complex because of it. So do you think good and evil exists in this world as something more than developments in our own brain, is there really no need to repent. In fact for people who know how bad their sin is the sacrifice of Jesus makes the most since. They think how can I ever be righteous, and they look at what Jesus did at his death and it's like he saying, yeah but look how much I went through for it. Anyone that comes to Jesus can definitely be forgiven.

Thanks for the mini-sermon.

 

[Storm]

Probably most people here would say that sin isn't real. But I bet everyone here has done something there conscience told them not to and has suffered from a guilt complex because of it. So do you think good and evil exists in this world as something more than developments in our own brain, is there really no need to repent. In fact for people who know how bad their sin is the sacrifice of Jesus makes the most since. They think how can I ever be righteous, and they look at what Jesus did at his death and it's like he saying, yeah but look how much I went through for it. Anyone that comes to Jesus can definitely be forgiven.

"Sin" is a vague word, so let's compare definitions. I understand sin to mean "something God disapproves of." This concept is incompatible with my concept of God, therefore I do not believe in sin.

Do you dis/agree with my definition?

 

[Storm]

Ugh, let's not turn this into yet another argument on Hitler's religion....

Christian doctrine states that Hitler himself has a spot in heaven yet Gandhi is burning in hell.

That depends entirely on the flavor of Christianity. It's a teaching I loathe, myself, but it's not fair to attribute it to all Christians.

 

[linwood]

Ugh, let's not turn this into yet another argument on Hitler's religion....


That depends entirely on the flavor of Christianity. It's a teaching I loathe, myself, but it's not fair to attribute it to all Christians.

I`m not attributing it to Christians.

I`m attributing it to Christianity, it is part and parcel of the theology.

I can`t account for those Christians who don`t follow their own theology.

 

[Storm]

That's arguable too, and I'd like to discuss it further, but I think it's off-topic here. Want to start a thread?

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Probably most people here would say that sin isn't real. But I bet everyone here has done something there conscience told them not to and has suffered from a guilt complex because of it. So do you think good and evil exists in this world as something more than developments in our own brain, is there really no need to repent. In fact for people who know how bad their sin is the sacrifice of Jesus makes the most since. They think how can I ever be righteous, and they look at what Jesus did at his death and it's like he saying, yeah but look how much I went through for it. Anyone that comes to Jesus can definitely be forgiven.

I've never suffered a guilt complex - I guess that makes me without sin.

 

[tumbleweed41]

I've never suffered a guilt complex - I guess that makes me without sin.

(ATS prepares to gather up stones)

 

[Falvlun]

I've never suffered a guilt complex - I guess that makes me without sin.

Whether you believe in sin or not, I'd be surprised to learn that you have never felt guilty about anything you have done.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Whether you believe in sin or not, I'd be surprised to learn that you have never felt guilty about anything you have done.

I gotta admit - I'm just such a generous, thoughtful, empathetic, and all around great guy who always thinks of others, and always does just the right thing, that I've never had to feel guilty about anything. What does this "guilt" thing feel like anyway?

btw, is feeling guilty and a "guilt complex" the same thing?

 

[Bedlam]

Why not, if Christianity is real then a "true Christian" has the Holy Spirit living in him. And that's not something you can see so anyone can say they are a Christian.

I can see it.

Prove I can't.

 

[themadhair]

Probably most people here would say that sin isn't real.

So let me get this straight – you create a thread to argue for sin being real but never share with us a working definition we could use to debate it?


What's the point in that?

 

[Alla Prima]

Probably most people here would say that sin isn't real. But I bet everyone here has done something there conscience told them not to and has suffered from a guilt complex because of it. So do you think good and evil exists in this world as something more than developments in our own brain, is there really no need to repent. In fact for people who know how bad their sin is the sacrifice of Jesus makes the most since. They think how can I ever be righteous, and they look at what Jesus did at his death and it's like he saying, yeah but look how much I went through for it. Anyone that comes to Jesus can definitely be forgiven.

Sin is just a judgemental coloring for that which creates more suffering.