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Should we believe in Free Will?

Willamena

Just me
Premium Member
Re the 'fact' discussion, I think it could have been solved early by noting that statements that are false are more commonly referred to as fiction, to contrast with facts, which are statements that are true.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Posts #11 and #19 here: Solve the Riddle of Compatibilism, Win Big Prize

As the subtitle of the Scientific American article you linked to states: "Quantum mechanics is not just about teeny particles. It applies to things of all sizes".

True, but your selective citation does not change the facts of the article that describes the Quantum World as the foundation of the macro world, and of course, that is why it applies to all sizes. I also gave you other references which clarify this relationship, but you choose to ignore it.
 

Nous

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Your presenting an 'argument from ignorance,'
False. There is no "argument from ignorance" in noting the fact that the thesis of determinism has been empirically refuted by the experimental findings that show that the behavior of quanta violate the Leggett-Garg inequality and thereby falsify the realism postulate, as noted by the studies cited in #11 and #19 here: Solve the Riddle of Compatibilism, Win Big Prize

According to the definition, the thesis of determinism cannot be true if there occurs even a single instance where the “the way things go” after time t is not “fixed as a matter of natural law.” Violation of the Leggett-Garg inequality refutes the assumption that quanta exist in a definite and specifiable in the absence of or prior to a measurement. Therefore, “the way things go thereafter” cannot be “fixed as a matter of natural law” by the “way things are at time t”.

You haven't addressed these facts yet.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
False. There is no "argument from ignorance" in noting the fact that the thesis of determinism has been empirically refuted by the experimental findings that show that the behavior of quanta violate the Leggett-Garg inequality and thereby falsify the realism postulate, as noted by the studies cited in #11 and #19 here: Solve the Riddle of Compatibilism, Win Big Prize

According to the definition, the thesis of determinism cannot be true if there occurs even a single instance where the “the way things go” after time t is not “fixed as a matter of natural law.” Violation of the Leggett-Garg inequality refutes the assumption that quanta exist in a definite and specifiable in the absence of or prior to a measurement. Therefore, “the way things go thereafter” cannot be “fixed as a matter of natural law” by the “way things are at time t”.

You haven't addressed these facts yet.

Yes I have, determinism only applies in this context to the macro world. I gave references to describe this and you chose to ignore them to justify your personal agenda.

Ignoring my references and repeating yourself over and over again does not get you anywhere.
 

Nous

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Yes I have, determinism only applies in this context to the macro world.
Again, empirical reality does not consist of a dualism of non-interacting worlds--a "quantum world" and "macro world"--governed by distinct laws of nature or by distinct metaphysical theses. There is only one world. Newtonian determinism is a mere approximation of quantum mechanics. You haven't been able to cite any experiment whatsoever that found that there exists a dualism of non-interacting worlds.

As pointed out multiple times, and as you have demonstrated, you can't even define what you mean by "quantum world" and "macro world".
 

`mud

Just old
Premium Member
Isn't it strange that religious people don't define 'quantum' or 'macro' truths,
maybe I'm wrong, but that could be true, like the laws of the bible.
~~postulates ~~to assume without proof, or as self-evident; take for granted,
or invisable.
Definitions are needed, definatly !
~~and theories~~I could proove it, if it were measureable, like `gods`, they're also invincible,
and invisible !
 
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