Should nuns do it.

[Greatest I am]

Should nuns do it.

On past occasions nuns have petitioned the Vatican to be raised from their subordinate position within the Church. At present the Vatican is having some problems in finding priests to replace an ever deepening hole in their ranks.
Would this be a good time for nuns to girdle their loins and have another crack at the Vatican. Would our new Pope have a kinder ear than the previous Popes? Is the Vatican ready to give the souls of nuns the same value as the souls of men or should it keep woman and nuns behind priests and silent?

If things are to be the same in heaven as on it is on earth, does that mean that they are also secondary souls in heaven. This concept sound more like Islam than Christianity.

Does God agree with this gender bias?

Regards
DL

 

[Breathe]

:spit:
Oh... when you said "do it".. I thought you meant.. never mind. *coughs*

Nuns and monks should be equal, in my opinion. Hopefully, times will change. However, it's getting rarer to see monks and nuns nowadays, at least, I've noticed it.. I've not seen a young nun in my country for.. well, ever!

Perhaps the next pope will be more liberal and address such an issue, but I suppose at the moment they have more pressing issues at hand than a misogynistic and outdated system of hierarchy..

 

[Greatest I am]

:spit:
Oh... when you said "do it".. I thought you meant.. never mind. *coughs*

Nuns and monks should be equal, in my opinion. Hopefully, times will change. However, it's getting rarer to see monks and nuns nowadays, at least, I've noticed it.. I've not seen a young nun in my country for.. well, ever!

Perhaps the next pope will be more liberal and address such an issue, but I suppose at the moment they have more pressing issues at hand than a misogynistic and outdated system of hierarchy..

Looks like it.

Regards
DL

 

[UnityNow101]

The Catholic Church has no other choice then to either change with the times, or die off like the other cults over the centuries. There is really no other way. If they continue down the path of supression, how can they continue to function in an increasingly integrated world? When the morals and standards of religious purity move slower then that of society as a whole, they must change or face extinction. Every religion that has held to an idea contrary to that of the wishes of society, has been removed and replaced with another. Whether it claims to be a revelation from God or not makes no difference to fate...

 

[Jordan St. Francis]

I'm not quite sure there has ever been such a thing as a "liberal pope"- perhaps in behavior- but never in questions of the faith. The Papacy is, of neccessity, a conservative institution.

The first point that needs to be made is that, though nuns nor any woman are presently permitted into the priesthood (nor were they ever), their souls are not regarded to be "worth less". I would reccommend reading St. Paul's description of the Body of Christ in First Corinthians, which discusses how not everyone is called to the same role in the Body of Christ, but as the members of the Body are both diverse and neccessary- so to are the members of the Church called to different roles, all of equal dignity.

The prohibition of women to the Catholic priesthood has been re-affirmed by the most authoratative exhortation in the Church, shy of infallibility- though many regard the prohibition to be infallible not only on account of the wording of John Paul II's statement, but also on account of the Church's consistent position through out the ages.

In addition, our sister Churches, such as the Orthodox, are adamant on this point as well. A female priesthood within the Catholic Church would seriously injure our relationship to these Churches, whom we consistently grow closer to as other major Christian traditions opt for different paths.

A more likely solution to the problem of the priest-shortage is an alteration to the discipline of mandatory celibacy for priests of the Latin Rite. This will not happen under Pope Benedict XVI, IMO.

Secondly, the Vatican is currently considering a restoration of the female diaconate- that is an ordained ministry. A deacon is a servant of the Word who serves at Mass during the Liturgy of the Word and proclaims the Gospel.

The Catholic Church has no other choice then to either change with the times, or die off like the other cults over the centuries. There is really no other way. If they continue down the path of supression, how can they continue to function in an increasingly integrated world? When the morals and standards of religious purity move slower then that of society as a whole, they must change or face extinction.

I know people tell themselves this, but I seriously doubt it. The Church has been through worse times and more than survived, even resurfaced and flourished more than ever. Will the Church grow smaller? It's likely, as current trends show, but it will not dissapear- I more than doubt that it will dissapear- but that is also on account of faith in Christ's promise.

 

[Greatest I am]

The Catholic Church has no other choice then to either change with the times, or die off like the other cults over the centuries. There is really no other way. If they continue down the path of supression, how can they continue to function in an increasingly integrated world? When the morals and standards of religious purity move slower then that of society as a whole, they must change or face extinction. Every religion that has held to an idea contrary to that of the wishes of society, has been removed and replaced with another. Whether it claims to be a revelation from God or not makes no difference to fate...

As far as I know, almost every religion fromZoroastrian on up is still here. Their longevity, even obscure ones is interesting. Perhaps you could inform on the ones you know that are defunct.

Regards
DL

 

[Greatest I am]

Jordan

You gave the church view. thanks.

What do you think?

Regards
DL

 

[Jordan St. Francis]

Personally, I will accept the current position of the Church on this matter. It is my private hope that such a thing will never be formally declared infallibly. I do not feel that the exclusion of women from the priesthood is anything like misogyny- rather it is to safeguard the language of God whom we are not free to speak of as a goddess. The all male priesthood was formulated in a society which already permitted females as priests (among the pagans), so I do not see it as an overalay from the oppressive aspects of "patriarchy",but rather a theological statement in itself.

That being, its possible I would be open to seeing if women could be incorporated into the priesthood in a way that avoided altering our language of God- avoiding praying "the Our Mother". Perhaps a female priesthood that regards the Blessed Virgin as the sacramental model. If the Lord entered all humanity through a single blessed woman, and thus made a woman the gate of our salvation, I don't see why God could not use a woman to effect a sacrament. The Word became flesh by means of a woman, why not the bread become flesh?

Though the likely response would be something like: neither woman nor man accomplishes the sacrament, but the male priest participating in the priesthood of Christ the Head, works in the person of Christ- of which his maleness is neccessary for the sacrament to fulfill its requirement as a "sign".

Either way, in light of our current cultural situation, I don't think now would be a fitting time for a female priesthood were it to be found theologically possible.

 

[Elessar]

The Catholic Church has no other choice then to either change with the times, or die off like the other cults over the centuries. There is really no other way. If they continue down the path of supression, how can they continue to function in an increasingly integrated world? When the morals and standards of religious purity move slower then that of society as a whole, they must change or face extinction. Every religion that has held to an idea contrary to that of the wishes of society, has been removed and replaced with another. Whether it claims to be a revelation from God or not makes no difference to fate...

It's kind of insulting to call a religion of over a billion adherents a cult...

 

[Greatest I am]

Personally, I will accept the current position of the Church on this matter. It is my private hope that such a thing will never be formally declared infallibly. I do not feel that the exclusion of women from the priesthood is anything like misogyny- rather it is to safeguard the language of God whom we are not free to speak of as a goddess. The all male priesthood was formulated in a society which already permitted females as priests (among the pagans), so I do not see it as an overalay from the oppressive aspects of "patriarchy",but rather a theological statement in itself.

That being, its possible I would be open to seeing if women could be incorporated into the priesthood in a way that avoided altering our language of God- avoiding praying "the Our Mother". Perhaps a female priesthood that regards the Blessed Virgin as the sacramental model. If the Lord entered all humanity through a single blessed woman, and thus made a woman the gate of our salvation, I don't see why God could not use a woman to effect a sacrament. The Word became flesh by means of a woman, why not the bread become flesh?

Though the likely response would be something like: neither woman nor man accomplishes the sacrament, but the male priest participating in the priesthood of Christ the Head, works in the person of Christ- of which his maleness is neccessary for the sacrament to fulfill its requirement as a "sign".

Either way, in light of our current cultural situation, I don't think now would be a fitting time for a female priesthood were it to be found theologically possible.

Sorry to hear that 2000 yr old thinking still exists.

Get yee behind me woman has a nice ring. It then allows woman to recognize the *** in front of her.

Regards
DL

 

[Greatest I am]

It's kind of insulting to call a religion of over a billion adherents a cult...

Believing in talking snakes and ten headed monsters makes Christianity a superstition and fantasy cult. They may be a billion but if you chop up all the sects then all are small cults.

Regards
DL

 

[Elessar]

Believing in talking snakes and ten headed monsters makes Christianity a superstition and fantasy cult. They may be a billion but if you chop up all the sects then all are small cults.

Regards
DL

I meant the Roman Catholic Church alone is one billion.

 

[Jordan St. Francis]

Sorry to hear that 2000 yr old thinking still exists.

Get yee behind me woman has a nice ring. It then allows woman to recognize the *** in front of her.

Regards
DL

I'm quite pleased I have you to enlighten me, never mind disregard what I'm saying.

I myself am a male, I am not a priest. I do not think more highly of a priest than I do myself, nor do I think of men as better than women.

If you did not notice, my tradition holds that the perfect Christian, who is set out before us all to imitate, was herself a woman- the real archtype of humanity before God.

 

[Greatest I am]

I meant the Roman Catholic Church alone is one billion.

At what number does a cult become a religion. Should a religion believe in talking snakes and ten headed monsters.

Any religion that bases it belief on fantasy is selling a book of fairy tales and not a Bible. Bibles are works of philosophy, not fantasy.

Regards
DL

 

[methylatedghosts]

It doesn't, as far as I can tell, treat it's followers like cults do - limiting contact with outsiders etc...

I do not see mainstream christianity as cult-like, whatever the flavour, be it catholic or protestant etc

 

[madcap]

At what number does a cult become a religion.

For many people, it's "number of people in my religion, minus one".

Should a religion believe in talking snakes and ten headed monsters.

Why not? They're good stories.

 

[UnityNow101]

It's kind of insulting to call a religion of over a billion adherents a cult...

Nothing insulting about it at all. The ideas concerning modern-day cults is what makes you feel that it is odd or even offensive to call the Roman Catholic Church one. The definition simply states that it is usually a small set of believers. Every religion begins as a cult and the Roman Catholic Church fits within this definition on atleast 4 points according to Merriam-Webster:


CULT
1: formal religious veneration : worship2: a system of religious beliefs and ritual ; also : its body of adherents3: a religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious ; also : its body of adherents4: a system for the cure of disease based on dogma set forth by its promulgator <health cults>5 a: great devotion to a person, idea, object, movement, or work (as a film or book) ; especially : such devotion regarded as a literary or intellectual fad b: the object of such devotion c: a usually small group of people characterized by such devotion

 

[Jordan St. Francis]

What religion doesn't fit that?

 

[Elessar]

And that's why one uses the Oxford English Dictionary:

Cult, n. A relatively small group of people having religious beliefs or practices regarded by others as strange or sinister.

 

[Gharib]

first of all sorry for making this post i don't think it is the appropriate thread but if it's a wrong place to post it in, then please tell me so that i can delete the message.

can i know why nuns are called mothers if they have never done it,
and why are preists called fathers if they too haven't done it.

it seems rediculos to me to call a a nun and a preist, a mother or a father, it doesn't make sense can you guys help me.

and sorry for the intrussion but i had to ask, this seems like an appropriate place but then again it may not be, so please tell me, and i hope no one gets offended by my questions.