Shortest proof of Jesus Christ

[Dan From Smithville]

Now on that we can agree, I've spoken to many theists who don't like the fact of species evolution at all, as one example.

That one does raise a lot of ire amongst some theists.

 

[Bird123]

Thanks, but I know who I really am. What's rather depressing is finding out who you really are.
So we're here:

You don't know what real thing, if any, you intend to denote when you say "God".

You think God is spiritual; and you know that the spiritual is indistinguishable from the imaginary.

But you'll go to any lengths not to admit that these things are the case.

Et voilà!

You have mistaken me. I am not in your box of Beliefs. Since they are no more than Beliefs, how can I admit they are truth when they are not?

You are living in the imaginary world you are attempting to create for yourself.

your quote:Thanks, but I know who I really am.

My Answer: You really have no clue. On the other hand, label and define yourself as you choose. That will not prevent you from Discovering the truth at some point in the future.

your quote:You don't know what real thing, if any, you intend to denote when you say "God".

My Answer: It's not me who doesn't know. It's you. So much of what I have told you has gone over your head. Since you do not understand, you retreat to the comfort of your box of Beliefs.

your quote:You think God is spiritual; and you know that the spiritual is indistinguishable from the imaginary.

My Answer: I do not think God is spiritual. I know God is Spiritual. I know I am a spiritual being in my true nature. I have direct experience to this. I am assuming you and every person is spiritual as well. It would not make sense I am the only one.

Since you do not know or even understand Spiritual, how can you say spiritual is indistinguishable from the imaginary? Once again, you are attempting to make everything fit in your box of beliefs.

In reality, here is where you are: I have placed truth in your life. This truth does not fit within your box of beliefs so you ignore it and try to convince me to crawl in that box with you. I will not give you all the answers, however I have pointed the direction by which you can Discover the truth. Ah, but Discovery takes work. It's easier to sit in that box and label everything outside that box as imaginary.

This is where I am at: Since becoming an adult I have worked very hard to Discover what the real truth really is. I have Discovered much. I have even had an encounter with God. I know that as much as I have Discovered; there is always more. I work on this constantly. Along my journey, I copy God. I place truth in the world so that those who are ready to Discover can Discover. I do not copy you nor religion in that it is not important that everyone follows or believes. Like God, I want everyone to Choose for themselves. Each must take their own journey.

I assume in your interaction with religious people you tell them they are all imagining everything. Granted, I have found no religion that really understands God, however the people deep down realize there is more than this physical world. Can you really see no farther than the end of your nose??

I think theists and atheists are perfect for each other. Theists teach that there is more than this physical world. Atheists should be teaching that it all must add up. Together, they will find God quicker than apart.

God gave everyone a different view to guaranty mankind a larger view than any one person could have. Where are you if you ignore everyone's view but your own? You are in a box of your own beliefs, claiming to know it all and Discovering very little. Yes, this is a Lesson many have to learn.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Hmmm?? Am I real or is all this just your Imagination?? You better pinch yourself. I can only be where you want me to be in your Dreams. Reality is another thing.

 

[Sheldon]

You have mistaken me. I am not in your box of Beliefs. Since they are no more than Beliefs, how can I admit they are truth when they are not?

You are living in the imaginary world you are attempting to create for yourself.

your quote:Thanks, but I know who I really am.

My Answer: You really have no clue. On the other hand, label and define yourself as you choose. That will not prevent you from Discovering the truth at some point in the future.

your quote:You don't know what real thing, if any, you intend to denote when you say "God".

My Answer: It's not me who doesn't know. It's you. So much of what I have told you has gone over your head. Since you do not understand, you retreat to the comfort of your box of Beliefs.

your quote:You think God is spiritual; and you know that the spiritual is indistinguishable from the imaginary.

My Answer: I do not think God is spiritual. I know God is Spiritual. I know I am a spiritual being in my true nature. I have direct experience to this. I am assuming you and every person is spiritual as well. It would not make sense I am the only one.

Since you do not know or even understand Spiritual, how can you say spiritual is indistinguishable from the imaginary? Once again, you are attempting to make everything fit in your box of beliefs.

In reality, here is where you are: I have placed truth in your life. This truth does not fit within your box of beliefs so you ignore it and try to convince me to crawl in that box with you. I will not give you all the answers, however I have pointed the direction by which you can Discover the truth. Ah, but Discovery takes work. It's easier to sit in that box and label everything outside that box as imaginary.

This is where I am at: Since becoming an adult I have worked very hard to Discover what the real truth really is. I have Discovered much. I have even had an encounter with God. I know that as much as I have Discovered; there is always more. I work on this constantly. Along my journey, I copy God. I place truth in the world so that those who are ready to Discover can Discover. I do not copy you nor religion in that it is not important that everyone follows or believes. Like God, I want everyone to Choose for themselves. Each must take their own journey.

I assume in your interaction with religious people you tell them they are all imagining everything. Granted, I have found no religion that really understands God, however the people deep down realize there is more than this physical world. Can you really see no farther than the end of your nose??

I think theists and atheists are perfect for each other. Theists teach that there is more than this physical world. Atheists should be teaching that it all must add up. Together, they will find God quicker than apart.

God gave everyone a different view to guaranty mankind a larger view than any one person could have. Where are you if you ignore everyone's view but your own? You are in a box of your own beliefs, claiming to know it all and Discovering very little. Yes, this is a Lesson many have to learn.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Hmmm?? Am I real or is all this just your Imagination?? You better pinch yourself. I can only be where you want me to be in your Dreams. Reality is another thing.

God told me you're lying, and are controlled by the Devil.

Hmm, how is my claim any less credible than your disjointed rant?

 

[blü 2]

your quote:You don't know what real thing, if any, you intend to denote when you say "God".

My Answer: It's not me who doesn't know. It's you.

Tell me then, what real entity are we looking for that is God, such that when we find a real suspect we can determine whether it's God or not.

But we both know you haven't a clue, can't give a relevant coherent answer to that.

your quote:You think God is spiritual; and you know that the spiritual is indistinguishable from the imaginary.

My Answer: I do not think God is spiritual. I know God is Spiritual. I know I am a spiritual being in my true nature.

But I've asked you several times what objective test will distinguish the 'spiritual' from the imaginary ─ and you don't know.

That's because there's no such test.

And there's no such test because there's no difference ─ the 'spiritual' doesn't exist in the world external to the self, is not real, and thus is only found as a concept or thing imagined in individual brains.

It's very plain.

 

[Bird123]

God told me you're lying, and are controlled by the Devil.

Hmm, how is my claim any less credible than your disjointed rant?

The Devil does not exist so this really makes me doubt you. You have been corrupted by religion. Now if you left the Devil out of it, I would ask specifically what God said I was lying about and why exactly was I lying. I would ask how your conversation went along with your description of the event.

From your initial statement, it seems to have a lot of holes in it. I will also consider that so much is said about God that simply isn't true. Since God doesn't need a middle man, I would question the accuracy of your statement. What purpose would God have for telling you I am lying??

Clearly, if you really knew God, you could never make such a statement.

Still, it doesn't matter what everyone else does. It's what I choose to do that counts. With this in mind, I have placed Real Truth in your life. Now, it's your turn to choose what you will do with Real Truth. Since it is important everyone make their own choices, I am happy whatever you choose.

I have merely copied God by placing Real Truth in this world. I'm going to copy God again and leave the rest up to you.

Beliefs: It has never ever been about Beliefs or Credibility. Those who seek now have possibilities to seek and direction to venture.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Sheldon]

From your initial statement, it seems to have a lot of holes in it.

God doesn't lie, apparently.

Clearly, if you really knew God, you could never make such a statement.

Right back at ya .

Still, it doesn't matter what everyone else does. It's what I choose to do that counts.

Ditto....

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Me too...

 

[Bird123]

Tell me then, what real entity are we looking for that is God, such that when we find a real suspect we can determine whether it's God or not.

But we both know you haven't a clue, can't give a relevant coherent answer to that.
But I've asked you several times what objective test will distinguish the 'spiritual' from the imaginary ─ and you don't know.

That's because there's no such test.

And there's no such test because there's no difference ─ the 'spiritual' doesn't exist in the world external to the self, is not real, and thus is only found as a concept or thing imagined in individual brains.

It's very plain.

There was this junior college, trying to make extra money,so they opened an electronics class for the summer. When the students arrived, they had to close the class. Why? Since the students didn't even have the basic knowledge of electricity, they were lost and confused as soon as the teacher started teaching.

This is where we are. You are going to have to return when you have Discovered so much more before my words will no longer be confusing to you.

Perhaps your first step is to Discover who you really are.

It's very plain and simple.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[blü 2]

There was this junior college, trying to make extra money,so they opened an electronics class for the summer. When the students arrived, they had to close the class. Why? Since the students didn't even have the basic knowledge of electricity, they were lost and confused as soon as the teacher started teaching.

I dare say you know this from being one of them.

Meanwhile ─ to get back to what we're actually talking about ─ you still can't tell me what objective test will distinguish the 'spiritual' from the imaginary, not least because you don't know.

But don't worry ─ with ordinary luck, one day it'll all become clear to you.

 

[Sheldon]

There was this junior college, trying to make extra money,so they opened an electronics class for the summer. When the students arrived, they had to close the class. Why? Since the students didn't even have the basic knowledge of electricity, they were lost and confused as soon as the teacher started teaching.

This is where we are. You are going to have to return when you have Discovered so much more before my words will no longer be confusing to you.

Electronics is not a superstition based on no objective evidence, that's the difference. These claims for knowledge of hidden esoteric truths would ring a little less hollow if they could be supported by a shred of objective evidence.

The facts that underpin electronics doesn't vary from culture to culture, or from era to era, and people who understand electronics don't make vapid platitudes about students having to find or discover themselves before they can learn what the facts are that underpin it, as you have risibly done here.

The facts that explain electronics are the same in Afghanistan, Iraq and Iran as they are in the US and Europe, because it is underpinned by objective facts, and not based on subjective superstition like religious apologetics.

 

[Bird123]

Electronics is not a superstition based on no objective evidence, that's the difference. These claims for knowledge of hidden esoteric truths would ring a little less hollow if they could be supported by a shred of objective evidence.

The facts that underpin electronics doesn't vary from culture to culture, or from era to era, and people who understand electronics don't make vapid platitudes about students having to find or discover themselves before they can learn what the facts are that underpin it, as you have risibly done here.

The facts that explain electronics are the same in Afghanistan, Iraq and Iran as they are in the US and Europe, because it is underpinned by objective facts, and not based on subjective superstition like religious apologetics.

You still do not get it. I am not talking about beliefs, stories, cultures, religions, or superstitions. I'm talking about what actually exists.

The new students had no clue what the electronics teacher was saying simply because they lacked the knowledge necessary to immediately jump to a higher level.

If you are wrapped up in religion and beliefs, if you are bias and see God could not exist, it's no wonder the electronic student doesn't really see what I have been saying. Until that light bulb goes off over their head and they realize at a rudimentary level they will have no clue. Still, placing truth in the world is important because those who are ready will see.

There was a small town where everyone knew each other. A stranger moved to town. The stranger was different in a lot of ways. The people of the town talked and talked: This guy is crazy. This guy does some mighty strange things. One day, one of those town's people stopped in his tracks. He told his friends: Wait a minute!! There is Method to this guy's madness.

Look at this world around you. Look for the Method to the madness. Look for the knowledge beyond the surface. Look for the Genius behind it all. I'm not asking anyone to believe. Forget the beliefs. Go for the MATH!!!!!

If all the physics add up so well, why would you ever think the People factor wouldn't???

All the secrets of the Universe stare us all in the face. The knowledge is just waiting to be Discovered. On the other hand, it will take Work, Open and wide view, and stretching that intellectual capability to the limits.

IQ exists far beyond that of mankind. It's going to take stretching for an ant. On the other hand I think everyone is capable of Discovering something.

One who really seeks the knowledge could never settle for mere believing and accepting. This is who I have always been.

The question remains: Do you know yourself? Do you know what you really want? Do you seek or are there other things you are chasing instead??

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Sheldon]

You still do not get it. I am not talking about beliefs, stories, cultures, religions, or superstitions. I'm talking about what actually exists.

That's a bare claim, there's nothing there to "get".

The new students had no clue what the electronics teacher was saying simply because they lacked the knowledge necessary to immediately jump to a higher level.

What you seem not to be grasping is that there is objective knowledge to underpin electronics, as I said. Neither you nor any theists here, nor any I've encountered in decades of asking have ever been able to demonstrate a shred of objective evidence for any deity.

All the secrets of the Universe stare us all in the face. The knowledge is just waiting to be Discovered.

Except it is science and not religion that is explaining and evidencing the workings of the universe. Religions haven't taught us any objective facts about the universe, in fact what they have claimed were immutable truths have been often been debunked by scientific rigour.

IQ exists far beyond that of mankind.

Demonstrate objective evidence for that claim please....

The question remains: Do you know yourself? Do you know what you really want? Do you seek or are there other things you are chasing instead??

I have no idea what you mean, they seem like empty platitudes to me.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Yet you can't come close to demonstrating any objective evidence for your belief in a deity? That is clear to me.

 

[Bird123]

That's a bare claim, there's nothing there to "get".



What you seem not to be grasping is that there is objective knowledge to underpin electronics, as I said. Neither you nor any theists here, nor any I've encountered in decades of asking have ever been able to demonstrate a shred of objective evidence for any deity.



Except it is science and not religion that is explaining and evidencing the workings of the universe. Religions haven't taught us any objective facts about the universe, in fact what they have claimed were immutable truths have been often been debunked by scientific rigour.



Demonstrate objective evidence for that claim please....



I have no idea what you mean, they seem like empty platitudes to me.



Yet you can't come close to demonstrating any objective evidence for your belief in a deity? That is clear to me.

Just like the electronic student in my example, you didn't understand a word of what I was saying to you.

I think you have already been corrupted by religion. You speak in terms of beliefs and getting you to believe. Once again, I'm not talking in terms of Beliefs or Religion. I point not to where you can believe but to where you can Discover for yourself. My goal has never ever been to feed beliefs.

Clearly, through all this you do not seek the Real Truth. Those who seek do not look for excuses not to seek. Still, this is your free choice to make.

I realize you did not understand when I asked did you know yourself and what you really want. I don't think you even know yourself. Perhaps, it's time to take a good look at yourself and Discover what is it that you really want. At the very least one needs to be true to oneself.

You may not be ready, however the Real Truth will be out there waiting to be Discovered for those who seek. On the other hand, one must also be willing to venture out of their comfortable box of beliefs that so many have been taught to value.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[Sheldon]

Just like the electronic student in my example, you didn't understand a word of what I was saying to you.

Much of it was cryptic and meaningless, but I sense you were implying something else.

I think you have already been corrupted by religion.

Think harder...

I point not to where you can believe but to where you can Discover for yourself.

I'm right here, on my couch, and in my extensive experience random capital letters are synonymous with vapid woo woo.

Clearly, through all this you do not seek the Real Truth.

No true Scotsman fallacy. Incidentally the absurd tautology "real truth" is as ludicrous as it is hilarious.

Clearly, through all this you do not seek the Real Truth. Those who seek do not look for excuses not to seek.

Another no true Scotsman fallacy, and rather tellingly more inexplicable random capital letters.

I realize you did not understand when I asked did you know yourself and what you really want.

That's because it is meaningless word salad. Incidentally and FYI, when conveying a point it for the writer to ensure their assertions are clear unambiguous and understandable.

You may not be ready, however the Real Truth will be out there waiting to be Discovered for those who seek. On the other hand, one must also be willing to venture out of their comfortable box of beliefs that so many have been taught to value.

More meaningless word salad peppered with random capitals.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

Things usually are when someone is as closed minded as you appear to be, but nothing you have asserted is clear here. I can only suggest you look up the word truth in a dictionary. I see nothing in accordance with any facts or reality there, just vague cryptic assertions.

 

[Riders]

It is wrong to say, that we can not know all. Because there is no limit (for example, 80%) to research. If we get to know all 100%, we get to know, that we are all-knowing. Hence, the all-knowing being does exist.

My premise is: ``future research will tell us about twice as much as we know in 2021AD''.
From it I derive the theorem: ``somebody has achieved that in 2021AD.''
All you need is to accept the premise, you do not need to accept as a premise the
result of the proof.

Nobody loves my paper, not because of flaws. Simply, we had no sex or
other type of personal contact. To get loved by the communities,
you need good social wellness and ability. Otherwise, your work won't be
loved. The more of love, the fewer mistakes they see in your work.

I am not about the ultimate love expression (which is sex), but about
social skills. You do not trust my paper, because you had no physical
contact with me. We haven't been on conference somewhere. Hence, your
instinct and immunity tell you to ignore me as I would be a virus or a
monster.

I don't understand all The sex talk and what it has to d with Jesus Christ you lost me.

 

[Riders]

Just like the electronic student in my example, you didn't understand a word of what I was saying to you.

I think you have already been corrupted by religion. You speak in terms of beliefs and getting you to believe. Once again, I'm not talking in terms of Beliefs or Religion. I point not to where you can believe but to where you can Discover for yourself. My goal has never ever been to feed beliefs.

Clearly, through all this you do not seek the Real Truth. Those who seek do not look for excuses not to seek. Still, this is your free choice to make.

I realize you did not understand when I asked did you know yourself and what you really want. I don't think you even know yourself. Perhaps, it's time to take a good look at yourself and Discover what is it that you really want. At the very least one needs to be true to oneself.

You may not be ready, however the Real Truth will be out there waiting to be Discovered for those who seek. On the other hand, one must also be willing to venture out of their comfortable box of beliefs that so many have been taught to value.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

This is a waste of my time.

 

[Bird123]

This is a waste of my time.

Apparently so. On the other hand, at some point, you might Discover that it really wasn't after all.

That's what I see. It's very clear!!

 

[MonkeyFire]

Belief and faith prove absolutely nothing.

it proves the truth and hopens.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

it proves the truth and hopens.

no sir, belief and faith do not prove that anything in particular is true.