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Religious Degrees = Worthless?

Neo Deist

Th.D. & D.Div. h.c.
I read an article a while back (trying to find the link) that talked about how a "religious degree" is basically worthless. It went on to point out that bible colleges or "universities" charge outrageous tuition fees, make you research the same crap you already knew from growing up in church, they are biased toward their particular beliefs and in the end give you a piece of paper that grants you a title for your name.

That same degree does not teach you to perform surgery, become an engineer, an architect, a musician, a mechanic, or how to properly flip burgers at McDonald's. It is only good in religious circles, and in particular, your own religion/denomination. Those that hold such degrees and insist on being called "Dr." are a joke...like this guy:


The irony is that I hold a Th.D. as well as a D.D., with the latter being honorary for work that I did. However, I do NOT go by the title of Dr., nor do I use any fancy letters before or after my name.
 
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StarryNightshade

Spiritually confused Jew
Premium Member
I sure hope not; otherwise my work towards an MDiv (and afterwards an MA or PhD in theology) will be for naught.

Also:

It went on to point out that bible colleges or "universities" charge outrageous tuition fees, make you research the same crap you already knew from growing up in church, they are baised toward their particular beliefs and in the end give you a piece of paper that grants you a title for your name.

Couldn't one argue that this could potentially apply to any institution of higher learning?
 

Mindmaster

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Only worth it if you are going to a program that leads to a position in an established church. If you do that, it works out well -- otherwise, not so much.
 

StarryNightshade

Spiritually confused Jew
Premium Member
Yes, but with other professions you learn to do something such as surgery. That was the point of the article. Wish I could find it.

Well, considering what I'm going for, I can be involved in:

- Education
- Social Work
- Non-profit
- Writing
- Leadership
- Counseling

Among other things. A degree doesn't have to teach one surgery or rocket science in order to be "useful" or worthwhile.
 

morphesium

Active Member
I read an article a while back (trying to find the link) that talked about how a "religious degree" is basically worthless. It went on to point out that bible colleges or "universities" charge outrageous tuition fees, make you research the same crap you already knew from growing up in church, they are biased toward their particular beliefs and in the end give you a piece of paper that grants you a title for your name.

That same degree does not teach you to perform surgery, become an engineer, an architect, a musician, a mechanic, or how to properly flip burgers at McDonald's. It is only good in religious circles, and in particular, your own religion/denomination. Those that hold such degrees and insist on being called "Dr." are a joke...like this guy:


The irony is that I hold a Th.D. as well as a D.D., with the latter being honorary for work that I did. However, I do NOT go by the title of Dr., nor do I use any fancy letters before or after my name.

I do believe its worthless. It contributes nothing to humanity.
Write a story about God(s) and fill it with some mythical acts, magical tricks and put it in front of some uneducated population who are facing much hardships; market it wisely and a new religion will be formed.
Just imagine - after a few 100 years, people are investing money and time on this to get a degree in this believing the whole story and mythical acts to the true!!!

What I have to say is this "religious degree" is against the very purpose of education.
 

morphesium

Active Member
Well, considering what I'm going for, I can be involved in:

- Education
- Social Work
- Non-profit
- Writing
- Leadership
- Counseling

Among other things. A degree doesn't have to teach one surgery or rocket science in order to be "useful" or worthwhile.
You can get all this and much better through proper education. So why is it to be "religious". Religious degrees sell much more than these - prepare your mind to be unscientific, irrational, and often decrease your morality.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
I read an article a while back (trying to find the link) that talked about how a "religious degree" is basically worthless. It went on to point out that bible colleges or "universities" charge outrageous tuition fees, make you research the same crap you already knew from growing up in church, they are biased toward their particular beliefs and in the end give you a piece of paper that grants you a title for your name.

That same degree does not teach you to perform surgery, become an engineer, an architect, a musician, a mechanic, or how to properly flip burgers at McDonald's. It is only good in religious circles, and in particular, your own religion/denomination. Those that hold such degrees and insist on being called "Dr." are a joke...like this guy:


The irony is that I hold a Th.D. as well as a D.D., with the latter being honorary for work that I did. However, I do NOT go by the title of Dr., nor do I use any fancy letters before or after my name.


Sometimes I wonder exactly why there was a paradigm shift from simply being referred to as Pastor, Reverend, Sister, Brother, Bishop etc. to that of Doctor, PhD etc just to affront a more academic designation as opposed to someone involved specifically in spiritual matters.

While I agree to the worthlessness of many theological degrees, there are values still to be noted like the study of archeology and psychology for which recognised accreditation validates the degree affording at least some weight in that regard.
 

lovesong

:D
Premium Member
Even though I am a religious studies major myself I can see your point. It is a little useless on its own. But I do know it can be quite useful when paired with another major (in my case, psychology), and at very least, it's fun!
 

jeager106

Learning more about Jehovah.
Premium Member
Only worth it if you are going to a program that leads to a position in an established church. If you do that, it works out well -- otherwise, not so much.

"a position in an established church."

Poor wages and little if any benefits.
Not worth the price of the education.
That is only an opinion of mine however.
My degrees are in Engineering (manufacturing technology) and Human Resources.
Those got me a job in supervision with G.M. after I was disabled from police work.
Police work was far easier than being management in a U.A.W. plant!
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ in wages + overtime.
I worked over the summer shut down ( when they change over to the new model year )
and in one week made $7 grand! That was 25 years ago!
I wish I had been young enough to put in 25 years. I'd be sitting pretty well healed
now.
My cousin was in supervision, did 30 years, and his home and vehicles are all
paid for and he wants for nothing.
As it is I collect my civil service pension and a bit of social security.
$60 K annually and NO taxes isn't a bad retirement income.
I EARNED it.
Not bad for a disabled old ex-cop.
 

Neo Deist

Th.D. & D.Div. h.c.
Wait, are we talking about degrees in religion or degrees in theology? These are very different things.

Yes, theology and divinity/ministry are different things.

Many of the programs for theology actually entitle you to Dr. by way of a Ph.D. or Th.D. (depending on the university). It holds the same weight as a degree in philosophy.

Divinity and Ministry degrees are the jokes that the article refers to. You can buy these for about $25 online, and they hold the same weight as getting one from a university for thousands more. D.D. (Doctorate of Divinity) is normally an honorary degree awarded by an institution or church, and the recipient should not use the title of Dr. in their name. Many do though, in an effort to boost their position, book sales, etc.
 

jeager106

Learning more about Jehovah.
Premium Member
"Of all the degreed professionals in America, the two lowest paid professions are in this order; pastor and teacher.

From:http://www.patheos.com/blogs/christ...ge-pastor-salaries-in-united-states-churches/"

Pastors (ministers etc.) often hold some sort of degree in consoling services also thus
they can do marriage consoling, and family consoling for which they do not get
paid.
Part of the job.
There may be exceptions however.
Now T-V evangelist can make mega bucks fleecing those addicted to such things.
Faith healing anyone?
Let's pass a basket of rattlesnakes around.:eek::eek:
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
I read an article a while back (trying to find the link) that talked about how a "religious degree" is basically worthless. It went on to point out that bible colleges or "universities" charge outrageous tuition fees, make you research the same crap you already knew from growing up in church, they are biased toward their particular beliefs and in the end give you a piece of paper that grants you a title for your name.

I don't see that, actually. Take Catholicism and going into priesthood. In the Church there are no Bibles as some protestant Churches I'm used to. Half the Catholics I met don't even know personally what is in their Bible a part from the Church. When they go to a university, then they are studied in what they did not know. They study the Bible.

However, I agree that they are bias towards their own religion. That's basically the point of the degree, though.

It's just like American Sign Language Interpretation. I wanted to go through a degree in that and was half way done when I hit a pit hole*. You can get up to a MA and I'm surprised not a Dr. based on all the work, expense, and license we need to get every year to keep our profession. Yet, if I took my future degree across to Mc Donalds, they'd tell me "I'm over qualified" or "this degree doesn't hold any thing that relates to managerial positions you're asking for Ma'am."

So, I have to use the degree within Deaf Studies, language, social psychology, psychology, social work, education, etc. All of these (like @lovesong was saying about combination) are a good combination with the degree needed to fulfill the position.

I also found out recently, they'd rather future interpreters get a general degree in Deaf studies or similar not an interpreting degree. (Instead of a Christian theology degree, get a "Abrahamic degree" I made that up to compare) so you have more options.

Its still work, effort, time, and expense. So I wouldn't see why one wouldn't want to hold their Dr. title as per their hard work has brought them.

Now that I think of it, I know ten years or so from now, we would need a Dr. to get an interpreting licenses. First we didn't need a degree, then an A.S., now a B.A. In four years I think they said they are going up to M.A. for some reason. People still work without going up that far. It depends on how you use the degree not the degree itself. Unless you are going into professions like medicine, that's more specific. A Dr. Professor at a university probably has just as much hard effort as the doctor and most definitely the interpreter.

It just depends on how the degree is used and where one can use it, theology or otherwise.

That same degree does not teach you to perform surgery, become an engineer, an architect, a musician, a mechanic, or how to properly flip burgers at McDonald's. It is only good in religious circles, and in particular, your own religion/denomination. Those that hold such degrees and insist on being called "Dr." are a joke...like this guy:

It depends on how you are using the degree. If you are taking the degree to get a position in Horticulture or go down the street to be a U.S. Congressman, then no, the degree title won't work but in the U.S. a lot of times just having a B.A. will get you in and then the job will pay for whatever you need in relation to your position.

If it's in ones own religion, then a Doctorate in one's own religion doesn't sound off. If you are comparing it to a doctor with a PH in medicine, that's different.

Does Dr Studies in theology have internship? I notice the medicine, interpreting, archaeology, and so forth all have internships towards their masters or doctorates.​

Divinity and Ministry degrees are the jokes that the article refers to. You can buy these for about $25 online, and they hold the same weight as getting one from a university for thousands more. D.D. (Doctorate of Divinity) is normally an honorary degree awarded by an institution or church, and the recipient should not use the title of Dr. in their name. Many do though, in an effort to boost their position, book sales, etc.

Another question. I know over here you have to have a degree by an accredited university and the government checks to see if you were a student at that school and got your degree there. So, if I bought a $25.00 degree online, it would mean nothing position wise.

I don't know about other religious Doctorates. I do know a priest rightfully earned their doctorates. My interpreting teacher wanted people to call her by Dr. She got upset when people didn't.

I think it's about how much work and training one puts into a profession. Being a pastor and priest shouldn't be any different than a doctor of medicine or interpreting. They are a specialist within their own group.

Eh. Just my thoughts.
 

StarryNightshade

Spiritually confused Jew
Premium Member
You can get all this and much better through proper education. So why is it to be "religious".

It's simple really.

1.) I think learning of these things allows one to fully see the complexities of religion; which is something, whether one likes it or not, that is a rich and full part of our culture (the US/the west).

2.) I ultimately want to work with an interfaith/ecumenical group or in some other kind of non-profit. maybe even be a chaplain. So it makes sense to get this kind of degree.

Religious degrees sell much more than these - prepare your mind to be unscientific, irrational, and often decrease your morality.

Tell that to the countless people who want to help others, learn beyond what they have known, and wish to be challenged. Very much like me and and many others who are attending school for this degree. In the year I have been going to seminary, I have never met a more dedicated group of people who wish to bring change to the world or want to help others. Additionally, my classes do anything but affirm what I already believe and challenge said beliefs on a regular basis. I still believe what I believe, but I now have a deeper understanding as to why.

Your rhetoric circa 2007 is boring. Try harder.
 

idav

Being
Premium Member
I read an article a while back (trying to find the link) that talked about how a "religious degree" is basically worthless. It went on to point out that bible colleges or "universities" charge outrageous tuition fees, make you research the same crap you already knew from growing up in church, they are biased toward their particular beliefs and in the end give you a piece of paper that grants you a title for your name.

That same degree does not teach you to perform surgery, become an engineer, an architect, a musician, a mechanic, or how to properly flip burgers at McDonald's. It is only good in religious circles, and in particular, your own religion/denomination. Those that hold such degrees and insist on being called "Dr." are a joke...like this guy:


The irony is that I hold a Th.D. as well as a D.D., with the latter being honorary for work that I did. However, I do NOT go by the title of Dr., nor do I use any fancy letters before or after my name.
Are you trying to say degrees in general are worth something.
 
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