Redefining Religion as Politics

[Audie]

Religion can guide our choices and can set our boundaries, as God only wants our hearts to be loving, truthful, trustworthy and sincere.

The rule of this planet has been given over to men.

The best system would most likely combine both. It would use the guidance of God in shaping the way we interact in this world and out into the universe, how we will eventually interact with other species from other planets.

Regards Tony

Thats not original, someone else made it
up and you parrot it.

There is zero way to know that or check on it,
but its not much of a "god" who made a
quarrelsome competitive creature when he
wants It to be all nice nice nice. And sing kumbaya.

 

[Nakosis]

This doesn't concern you at all?

Question: If AI goes wrong and certain demographics in the US are somehow left behind or neglected, who will be taking responsibility for this? AI could possibly act as a justification and means by which the burden of accountability is taken out of the human political arena ... if not now, in upcoming years.

Not sure it'd be any less threatening with humans running things.

Though I except it to be a period of time for us to gain confidence in AI.

 

[Nakosis]

Thats not original, someone else made it
up and you parrot it.

There is zero way to know that or check on it,
but its not much of a "god" who made a
quarrelsome competitive creature when he
wants It to be all nice nice nice. And sing kumbaya.

How old are you?
Ok, you don't have to answer, but I suspect a bit younger than me.

I just wish I was as smart/wise as you at a much younger age.

Anyhow people start with the premise that God is in charge. Can't really expect much logical thinking to follow from that. Yet in the USA we're mostly only willing to vote for folks professing to be religious. Isn't that scary?

 

[Balthazzar]

Not sure it'd be any less threatening with humans running things.

Though I except it to be a period of time for us to gain confidence in AI.

Maybe it's time to grab our tents and head to the campgrounds of obscurity...until called to further service. This gaining confidence over time thing in the state our world is in and with so much going on nationally, the safety and happiness aspect of American life has taken a backseat to patience and trust in un-tested software in terms of being successful in running our operations, due to fear of human competency to continue our own efforts.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

There is zero way to know that or check on it

Incorrect.

Live the life and peace is not only possible, it is inevitable.

Regards Tony

 

[Balthazzar]

Religion can guide our choices and can set our boundaries, as God only wants our hearts to be loving, truthful, trustworthy and sincere.

The rule of this planet has been given over to men.

The best system would most likely combine both. It would use the guidance of God in shaping the way we interact in this world and out into the universe, how we will eventually interact with other species from other planets.

Regards Tony

Religions can lead to peace, but how often do they? If our hearts are to be loving, truthful and sincere, then life as it is, is required to be acknowledged and our decisions will need to be in accordance with these life realities. As much as I would prefer peace over its opposite, there are very real and legitimate threats who threaten our peaceful positions. We can live the life of peace, hope for peace, pursue peace with all people, and still be met with resistance enough to warrant more violent actions on our parts. Sincerity and truth necessitate accuracy in our positions.

 

[Ebionite]

LLMs are just one aspect of AI, and quite successful even if they have many flaws. I think the experts are expecting to have something a lot better than LLMs in the future.

Do you know of any alternatives to LLMs that are available for public use?

 

[Audie]

How old are you?
Ok, you don't have to answer, but I suspect a bit younger than me.

I just wish I was as smart/wise as you at a much younger age.

Anyhow people start with the premise that God is in charge. Can't really expect much logical thinking to follow from that. Yet in the USA we're mostly only willing to vote for folks professing to be religious. Isn't that scary?

30 something
And yes, scary, we are so directly
affected by the USA, and no way to
forv s to have any influence.

 

[Audie]

Incorrect.

Live the life and peace is not only possible, it is inevitable.

Regards Tony

I didnt even mean that for you but for
lurkarisns about. Your cloud is beyond
reach, i wouldnt try.

You might tho clarify if its you making
up your " facts" or if you let someone else
be in charge of your mind.

 

[Balthazzar]

30 something
And yes, scary, we are so directly
affected by the USA, and no way to
forv s to have any influence.

When asked my age, I stated 17 and then add 68 but divide the apple from the potato soup and you'll know your answer. Nary 2 decades plus 4 minus a few quarter moons to be exact.

 

[Balthazzar]

How old are you?
Ok, you don't have to answer, but I suspect a bit younger than me.

I just wish I was as smart/wise as you at a much younger age.

Anyhow people start with the premise that God is in charge. Can't really expect much logical thinking to follow from that. Yet in the USA we're mostly only willing to vote for folks professing to be religious. Isn't that scary?

It would be a scary thing, to vote based on one professing to hold a religious view as opposed to voting based on national needs, but no one ever suggested that a person need be non threatening to enter a voting booth. With that stated, and with all due respect, I have a feeling you're not one who would enter to cast a vote in that manner. I once decided that I would just vote blue. Then I decided many years later, 8 to be exact, to not vote based on color. I instead, chose to umm ... before I go any further. How old are you? You see, I've learned over the span of my life, some 2 decades and 4 that I'd rather not.,,tell you what I chose, but that was many quarter moons ago. I now vote based on our needs collectively, but then I haven't been able to cast one in some time now. Isn't that scary?

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Which is what religion always has been. World politics and forms of government, which at international levels secures the premise that religion is politics. In North America, we make religion controversial, but no less controversial than other forms of government. Shouldn't religion be defined as a political structure, specifically? We don't shun dialogue about other forms of government in our academic institutions. What makes religion any different?

NO. And no again, and again and again and again.

Relegion is based on absolutely nothing but what some (usually very few) people think that "God wants."

Politics, while too often being about what one or a few strong-men want, can develop into a democracy in which it becomes about what is actually best for people -- as nearly as can be decided.

 

[Balthazzar]

NO. And no again, and again and again and again.

Relegion is based on absolutely nothing but what some (usually very few) people think that "God wants."

Politics, while too often being about what one or a few strong-men want, can develop into a democracy in which it becomes about what is actually best for people -- as nearly as can be decided.

Ok, theocracies don't involve politics, a governing of people or laws of order. Happy? I naturally disagree but see things your way if you're so inclined. It's not politics at all nor are theocracies in league with other world government powers. Religions aren't politics. They are something else. What? I don't know but they obviously don't equate to politics per your NO and no again and again and again and again contribution to what would otherwise be obvious to anyone with half a brain. Not that I'm suggesting you don't have half a brain. I'm certain you do, Thank you for playing.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Ok, theocracies don't involve politics, a governing of people or laws of order. Happy? I naturally disagree but see things your way if you're so inclined. It's not politics at all nor are theocracies in league with other world government powers. Religions aren't politics. They are something else. What? I don't know but they obviously don't equate to politics per your NO and no again and again and again and again contribution to what would otherwise be obvious to anyone with half a brain. Not that I'm suggesting you don't have half a brain. I'm certain you do, Thank you for playing.

Theocracies don't involve politics? Really? Ever heard of Afghanistan, Iran, Mauritania, Saudi Arabia, Vatican City, Yemen? Those are 6 countries in which politics is indistinguishable from religion. And which of them, in your opinion, would rank high on the list of nations with healthy, happy citizens? Where do the place on the "best countries to live in" lists made by the UN or other agencies? (I would have included North Korea, but not entirely sure that the Kims have been officially deified.)

Certainly those theocracies are not "in league with other world government powers," or at least not in the way that international relations between secular countries (the majority on earth) manage such relations.

Oh, yes, religions are "something else." They are -- in my opinion -- about accepting what one has no evidence for as being more important than even that which one knows because of the evidence. To me, a rational (so to many, not "spiritual") person, that is astonishing, but that's just me. (But just a simple example: all the evidence in the world says the Flood did not happen, and that the Ark and animals it carried are utterly impossible. Yet so many people [see Ken Hamm] keep trying to make it realistic -- and failing abysmally.)

But now I'll ask you: what is it that you think should be "otherwise obvious to anyone with half a brain" that I am missing?

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Religions can lead to peace, but how often do they? If our hearts are to be loving, truthful and sincere, then life as it is, is required to be acknowledged and our decisions will need to be in accordance with these life realities. As much as I would prefer peace over its opposite, there are very real and legitimate threats who threaten our peaceful positions. We can live the life of peace, hope for peace, pursue peace with all people, and still be met with resistance enough to warrant more violent actions on our parts. Sincerity and truth necessitate accuracy in our positions.

Justice must be part of any peace process. What is needed, is consultation on a global scale, like the United Nations, but Vetoed votes not acceptable, and power given to the international body to enact, enforce and police the decisions made.

Regards Tony

 

[Balthazzar]

Theocracies don't involve politics? Really? Ever heard of Afghanistan, Iran, Mauritania, Saudi Arabia, Vatican City, Yemen? Those are 6 countries in which politics is indistinguishable from religion. And which of them, in your opinion, would rank high on the list of nations with healthy, happy citizens? Where do the place on the "best countries to live in" lists made by the UN or other agencies? (I would have included North Korea, but not entirely sure that the Kims have been officially deified.)

Certainly those theocracies are not "in league with other world government powers," or at least not in the way that international relations between secular countries (the majority on earth) manage such relations.

Oh, yes, religions are "something else." They are -- in my opinion -- about accepting what one has no evidence for as being more important than even that which one knows because of the evidence. To me, a rational (so to many, not "spiritual") person, that is astonishing, but that's just me. (But just a simple example: all the evidence in the world says the Flood did not happen, and that the Ark and animals it carried are utterly impossible. Yet so many people [see Ken Hamm] keep trying to make it realistic -- and failing abysmally.)

But now I'll ask you: what is it that you think should be "otherwise obvious to anyone with half a brain" that I am missing?

I myself prefer our secular type but the politics involved in those regions stem from those particular powers and are about the way and who is going to govern over the people. I never suggested anything to the tune of being desirable places to live. I did mention the league of government world powers of the earth, which these regions are part of. Different than our secular type, they are but they are no less political than our own governing entities. Your flood comment is moot. Ken Hamm in this discussion is moot. If you're looking for realistic, then pay attention to the conflicts, then tell me religion isn't politics or a world government power.

Edit: The religious laws instituted in those regions equate to policies. The conflicts are typically power plays for governance of the territories. Religiously (culturally) fueled they may be, but this all classifies as political. The obvious defined.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I didnt even mean that for you but for
lurkarisns about. Your cloud is beyond
reach, i wouldnt try.

You might tho clarify if its you making
up your " facts" or if you let someone else
be in charge of your mind.

We all have the power to make our own choices.

Our capacity of mind depends on where we focus it.

Regards Tony

 

[Balthazzar]

Justice must be part of any peace process. What is needed, is consultation on a global scale, like the United Nations, but Vetoed votes not acceptable, and power given to the international body to enact, enforce and police the decisions made.

Regards Tony

It's already somewhat like this. There's Nato, the European Union, Foreign ministry, etc. that operate under coalition type premises, yet each one varies from the others. What I do know is that these "alliances" operate in the larger international arena and affect our policies to some extent here in the states. The nature of coalitions, alliances, and the price of working together to meet the demands of the larger community involve greater cooperation than they once did, particularly due to the growing hostilities in other areas who feel threatened by the efforts made to improve our foreign relations. Policing isn't how I think it works, but it does involve the protection of our assets and shared interests.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

It's already somewhat like this. There's Nato, the European Union, Foreign ministry, etc. that operate under coalition type premises, yet each one varies from the others. What I do know is that these "alliances" operate in the larger international arena and affect our policies to some extent here in the states. The nature of coalitions, alliances, and the price of working together to meet the demands of the larger community involve greater cooperation than they once did, particularly due to the growing hostilities in other areas who feel threatened by the efforts made to improve our foreign relations. Policing isn't how I think it works, but it does involve the protection of our assets and shared interests.

I see we have to think and act globally. As if the earth is one country and mankind its citizens.

We do have a way to go to acheive this.

I see an age, in a distance future, where that will be universal thought and action.

Regards Tony

 

[Audie]

We all have the power to make our own choices.

Our capacity of mind depends on where we focus it.

Regards Tony

Focus on the capacity to admit you just
make things up.