Rabbi Friedman - The Soul and the Afterlife: Where Do We Go From Here?

[atanu]

I saw the video linked below.

I liked the clarity, conviction and the commonalities with many aspects of Vedanta. Particularly I liked the concept that life will always be life and death will always be so. In Advaita Vedanta it is said that the 'true' can never become 'untrue'; 'existence' can never become 'non-existence'. And the 'untrue' is never 'true'. So, the question "What happens to life after death?" is meaningless.

While explaining further on soul, the rabbi says that there are two souls in the body. Well, that is also similar to the story of two birds in a tree of Rig Veda and Upanishads. However, apparently the similarity stops there. The Rabbi says that one soul is 'Jewish-Godly' and another 'human'.

My respectful and humble question to Jewish friends on this forum is: Does the rabbi mean that Hindus or Muslims or others lack the godliness? Or that the term 'Jewish soul' is just a way of explaining a-prori knowledge-qualities of god that all men may possess. What is the honest answer?

 

[Tumah]

My respectful and humble question to Jewish friends on this forum is: Does the rabbi mean that Hindus or Muslims or others lack the godliness? Or that the term 'Jewish soul' is just a way of explaining a-prori knowledge-qualities of god that all men may possess. What is the honest answer?

Yes, I believe he does mean that others lack that other soul. Of course the Rabbi was over-simplifying (a lot of) things by calling it a part of G-d, since that's technically impossible. But it is one of the benefits and necessities of being or becoming Jewish.

 

[atanu]

Yes, I believe he does mean that others lack that other soul. Of course the Rabbi was over-simplifying (a lot of) things by calling it a part of G-d, since that's technically impossible. But it is one of the benefits and necessities of being or becoming Jewish.

Thank you. Why it is technically impossible and yet a benefit of being Jewish? If the Jewish soul is not godly then what is the privilege?

 

[Tumah]

Thank you. Why it is technically impossible and yet a benefit of being Jewish? If the Jewish soul is not godly then what is the privilege?

We can't divide G-d up into tiny parts and insert Him into people. That's just not possible. In the theology that espouses these ideas, G-d Himself is so far beyond us, that we don't, we can't even have a name for Him. According to this doctrine, we basically don't discuss G-d Himself at all, because there's nothing that could be said. Instead all discussion and references to G-d are in reality references to G-d's administration of the world. That is what he was talking about when he explained how G-d has these certain qualities and they are also found in the soul. These are qualities that G-d uses to administer the world, not that are found in G-d Himself, and they are also present in the soul because the soul is developed from these qualities. The question between the Jewish soul and the non-Jewish soul, as far as I understand, relates to the purpose which the soul was created. Being Jewish means becoming a conduit for G-d's Will as expressed in the Torah. That requires a connection on the top end, to G-d's Will, to the heavenly spheres where G-d's Will is potentialized, so that they can be manifested in our world. This connection is established because these realms are the source of the Jewish soul. The soul begins manifesting in these realms, eventually returns to these realms, and during it's time on earth, effects these realms. Non-Jew are not expected to keep the expression of G-d's Will we call the Torah, and so do not need to be sourced in these supernal realms.

 

[atanu]

We can't divide G-d up into tiny parts and insert Him into people. That's just not possible. In the theology that espouses these ideas, G-d Himself is so far beyond us, that we don't, we can't even have a name for Him. According to this doctrine, we basically don't discuss G-d Himself at all, because there's nothing that could be said. Instead all discussion and references to G-d are in reality references to G-d's administration of the world. That is what he was talking about when he explained how G-d has these certain qualities and they are also found in the soul. These are qualities that G-d uses to administer the world, not that are found in G-d Himself, and they are also present in the soul because the soul is developed from these qualities. The question between the Jewish soul and the non-Jewish soul, as far as I understand, relates to the purpose which the soul was created. Being Jewish means becoming a conduit for G-d's Will as expressed in the Torah. That requires a connection on the top end, to G-d's Will, to the heavenly spheres where G-d's Will is potentialized, so that they can be manifested in our world. This connection is established because these realms are the source of the Jewish soul. The soul begins manifesting in these realms, eventually returns to these realms, and during it's time on earth, effects these realms. Non-Jew are not expected to keep the expression of G-d's Will we call the Torah, and so do not need to be sourced in these supernal realms.

I will take time to understand this. For now, I have one question. As per Judaism, do non Jewish people have only one soul, the human soul? There is no Godly soul in them?

 

[Skwim]

Not to disparage the rabbi here, but I've always suspected that supposedly true stories like these, almost always coming from a Christian minster or such, are concocted out of thin air. They're just too convenient to be believable. I wouldn't even be surprised if there was a book, The Praise God Source Book of "True" Anecdotes For Sermons and Situations.

.

 

[Tumah]

I will take time to understand this. For now, I have one question. As per Judaism, do non Jewish people have only one soul, the human soul? There is no Godly soul in them?

Well, what I tried to explain earlier was that calling it the "G-dly soul" is a bit of a misnomer and it's just a question of whether you are obligated in Torah Law or not as that is the essential purpose of the other soul.
That being said, I'm not really clear on whether non-Jews only have one soul. I suspect that what the Rabbi was calling the "human soul" is properly called the "animal soul" - of the human type, in Jewish literature. I believe in the course of my studies, I came across mention of another type of non-Jewish soul that became potentialized at the same time as the Jewish one. Although again, I think it's irrelevant since the question of the "Jewish soul" being "G-dly" is in actuality a question of whether one is obligated (or chooses to become obligated via conversion) to follow Torah Law or not.

And I should also point out that I am not a kabbalist, and this entire discussion is about kabbalistic doctrine. I have read a handful or so of texts which is where I have the bit of knowledge that I do, but I'm by no means an expert. And there's also a lot of background here that is missing that will likely make all this difficult to correctly relate to.

 

[Tumah]

Not to disparage the rabbi here, but I've always suspected that supposedly true stories like these, almost always coming from a Christian minster or such, are concocted out of thin air. They're just too convenient to be believable. I wouldn't even be surprised if there was a book, The Praise God Source Book of "True" Anecdotes For Sermons and Situations.

.

I don't know. Become a clergy member of a modest sized house of worship for 15 or 20 years and see what happens. It can't be that hard. Lots of people that you wouldn't think are suited for clergy seem to be doing it.

 

[dybmh]

My respectful and humble question to Jewish friends on this forum is: Does the rabbi mean that Hindus or Muslims or others lack the godliness? Or that the term 'Jewish soul' is just a way of explaining a-prori knowledge-qualities of god that all men may possess. What is the honest answer?

The simple answer is, No. The Rabbi ( Manis ) Freidman does not mean that Hindus or Muslims lack godliness.

Manis Freidman is a describing Chabad Chassidus. I spent over ten years deeply involved in the Chabad community. I know their philosophy very well, and I can say for certain that Chabad Chassidus does not teach that non-Jews lack godliness. But it is completely natural for someone to listen to this lecture and come to that conclusion.

Before explaining more about this; it's important to keep this in mind: More is not always better. More is just more. Sometimes less is better.

The Jewish Soul is an additional a layer/dimension of the Soul. It's called a Neshamah. The Neshamah's primary purpose: Mitzvahs. The Jewish Soul recognizes, processes, and utilizes Jewish Commandments. That's really the easiest way of looking at it. And if you review the video, this concept is spoken about briefly towards the end. The benefit of having one, is being able to connect with the divine through executing the Commandments for Jewish people that are in the Torah ( aka the Mitzvot ). But it's not necessarily fun. It can be fun. But it's also a lot of work and a big responsibility if a person takes it seriously.

But that's just the Jewish Soul.

Every person has a Godly soul, and every person has a Human soul according to Chassidus. Chabad Chassidus usually uses the words Godly soul and Animal Soul as opposed to Godly Soul and Human Soul. It makes sense, doesn't it? Sometimes people behave like animals. Sometimes, they behave like Angels. All people do this. Beyond this, Jewish people have an additional layer/dimension, the Jewish Soul. These 3 souls together are called Nefesh, Ruach, and Neshamah. Every human being has a Nefesh and Ruach. Jewish people have a Neshamah as well. But more does not mean better, because along with the Neshamah comes a whole host of rules that non-Jewish people can completely ignore. That's the theory at least.

The Nefesh represents the Animal Soul ( Manis called it the Human soul. I think he was being polite. ) The Ruach is the Godly soul ( that is my understanding ). This Ruach is the breath of life that is "breathed into Adam's nostrils" in the Genesis story. Every single human being has this Ruach. Hindus, Muslims, everyone. That's what Chabad Chassidus teaches. It's not necessarily Kaballah; it's different.

 

[atanu]

The simple answer is, No. The Rabbi ( Manis ) Freidman does not mean that Hindus or Muslims lack godliness.

Manis Freidman is a describing Chabad Chassidus. I spent over ten years deeply involved in the Chabad community. I know their philosophy very well, and I can say for certain that Chabad Chassidus does not teach that non-Jews lack godliness. But it is completely natural for someone to listen to this lecture and come to that conclusion.

Before explaining more about this; it's important to keep this in mind: More is not always better. More is just more. Sometimes less is better.

The Jewish Soul is an additional a layer/dimension of the Soul. It's called a Neshamah. The Neshamah's primary purpose: Mitzvahs. The Jewish Soul recognizes, processes, and utilizes Jewish Commandments. That's really the easiest way of looking at it. And if you review the video, this concept is spoken about briefly towards the end. The benefit of having one, is being able to connect with the divine through executing the Commandments for Jewish people that are in the Torah ( aka the Mitzvot ). But it's not necessarily fun. It can be fun. But it's also a lot of work and a big responsibility if a person takes it seriously.

But that's just the Jewish Soul.

Every person has a Godly soul, and every person has a Human soul according to Chassidus. Chabad Chassidus usually uses the words Godly soul and Animal Soul as opposed to Godly Soul and Human Soul. It makes sense, doesn't it? Sometimes people behave like animals. Sometimes, they behave like Angels. All people do this. Beyond this, Jewish people have an additional layer/dimension, the Jewish Soul. These 3 souls together are called Nefesh, Ruach, and Neshamah. Every human being has a Nefesh and Ruach. Jewish people have a Neshamah as well. But more does not mean better, because along with the Neshamah comes a whole host of rules that non-Jewish people can completely ignore. That's the theory at least.

The Nefesh represents the Animal Soul ( Manis called it the Human soul. I think he was being polite. ) The Ruach is the Godly soul ( that is my understanding ). This Ruach is the breath of life that is "breathed into Adam's nostrils" in the Genesis story. Every single human being has this Ruach. Hindus, Muslims, everyone. That's what Chabad Chassidus teaches. It's not necessarily Kaballah; it's different.

I can understand the point about ‘more’. Similar happens with the so called caste system of Hinduism. The concept of caste comes from ‘varna’ — the color of veil. Deeper the color of veil over a soul, more ignorant of existence of soul that living being will be. The varna depends on spiritual maturity accrued over lifetimes of pure work and study. Human beings are categorised into four varna classes and the vocations-educational paths of the classes vary. The so called Brahmin caste (supposed to be the head of the divine) is supposed to have punishingly arduous duties. It is easy to fall from this position. So, more is not easy.