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Problems With Religion
- Thread starter A. Ben-Shema
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A. Ben-Shema
Active Member
I have previously explained (in another thread) this common error in comprehending the name / title: ISRAEL as referring to an ethnic group / race of people!
It is very important to understand the original / Spiritual meaning of Israel. Originally the word / title meant one who sees God from three Hebrew root words: ish (= a man / intelligent being); raeh (= seeing / 'vision'); and el (= God / Supreme Spirit) as recognized by Philo Judaeus and others.
This is further confirmed by its initial use as a name / title for Jacob after his face to face vision of God (GEN.32:28-30). The term Israelites originally referred to ALL Spiritual Seers / Gnostics / 'Mystics' not a racial / ethnic group of people.
Thus are they (genuine 'Israelites' / 'Gnostics') truly called chosen and beloved of God.
Peace & Love
xexon
Destroyer of Worlds
rojse,
You, won't.
Once this connection is made, the seeker is then tasked with the problem of translating what they are experiencing inside of themselves to the outside world.
Often the translations are rough in the beginning until they adjust to this new perspective. And they have to be careful of who they reveal themselves to, as many will not understand, and may take offense of their claims of wide ranging divine perception.
The best you can do is judge the tree by the fruit it produces. As your own perceptions are still in a limited state, you have to be careful not to jump to conclusions based on what you think such a person is supposed to be like.
x
You, won't.
Once this connection is made, the seeker is then tasked with the problem of translating what they are experiencing inside of themselves to the outside world.
Often the translations are rough in the beginning until they adjust to this new perspective. And they have to be careful of who they reveal themselves to, as many will not understand, and may take offense of their claims of wide ranging divine perception.
The best you can do is judge the tree by the fruit it produces. As your own perceptions are still in a limited state, you have to be careful not to jump to conclusions based on what you think such a person is supposed to be like.
x
xexon
Destroyer of Worlds
I have previously explained (in another thread) this common error in comprehending the name / title: ISRAEL as referring to an ethnic group / race of people!
It is very important to understand the original / Spiritual meaning of ‘Israel’. Originally the word / title meant “one who sees God” – from three Hebrew root words: ’ish (= a ‘man’ / ‘intelligent being’
This is further confirmed by its initial use as a name / title for Jacob after his “face to face” vision of God (GEN.32:28-30). The term ‘Israelites’ originally referred to ALL ‘Spiritual Seers’ / ‘Gnostics’ / 'Mystics' – not a racial / ethnic group of people.
Thus are they (genuine 'Israelites' / 'Gnostics') truly called ‘chosen’ and ‘beloved of God.’
Peace & Love
I have a friend who also says this, although he uses the term jew instead of Israelite.
I agree with it wholeheartedly.
Of course, this really short-sheets those who call themselves jews by today's standard, doesn't it?
x
Booko
Deviled Hen
We wouldn't, because at that point, they would be as Infinite as God is, and just as incomprensible from our finite view.
Sonic247
Well-Known Member
The Jewish prophets told of the coming messiah and how God would be the God of the whole earth and that's what happened. He called Abraham alone, then Israel alone, then Jesus alone who died for the sins of the world, the Christianity went out into the entire world.
sojourner
Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
You'll have a difficult time showing that "Israel" as used in the OT, means anything other than the kin-group of Jacob, which became a nation with kings, like all the other nations.I have previously explained (in another thread) this common error in comprehending the name / title: ISRAEL as referring to an ethnic group / race of people!
It is very important to understand the original / Spiritual meaning of Israel. Originally the word / title meant one who sees God from three Hebrew root words: ish (= a man / intelligent being); raeh (= seeing / 'vision'); and el (= God / Supreme Spirit) as recognized by Philo Judaeus and others.
This is further confirmed by its initial use as a name / title for Jacob after his face to face vision of God (GEN.32:28-30). The term Israelites originally referred to ALL Spiritual Seers / Gnostics / 'Mystics' not a racial / ethnic group of people.
Thus are they (genuine 'Israelites' / 'Gnostics') truly called chosen and beloved of God.
Peace & Love
xexon
Destroyer of Worlds
Thats because the OT was written by jews. The spiritual definition was overlooked by them because they chose the the more earthly definition.
This could have been a simple misunderstanding, but most likely it is a product of willful intent. As we know by their own account in the OT, the jews were a willfull people and often went against "God's " law.
There is no reason to doubt that this didn't work it's way(at least in part) into the writings of the OT and later Christianity.
The only true kinship that matters are those who "see" God and give sight to the blind around them. One candle lighting another.
The jews have based their lineage on blood kin alone.
Rather than being God's chosen people, they're just ordinary people.
Thats a hard drop for people of Judeo/Christian belief to accept.
x
This could have been a simple misunderstanding, but most likely it is a product of willful intent. As we know by their own account in the OT, the jews were a willfull people and often went against "God's " law.
There is no reason to doubt that this didn't work it's way(at least in part) into the writings of the OT and later Christianity.
The only true kinship that matters are those who "see" God and give sight to the blind around them. One candle lighting another.
The jews have based their lineage on blood kin alone.
Rather than being God's chosen people, they're just ordinary people.
Thats a hard drop for people of Judeo/Christian belief to accept.
x
sojourner
Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
But the point was that the name "Israel" is misconceived. How could it be misconceived? It's the name the Jews gave to themselves, and they had an idea of what the meaning of that name was. Their name. Their concept. Their understanding. Their propagation of that in the OT. And we don't get to hijack that just because we feel that we're "more enlightened" than they are.
A. Ben-Shema
Active Member
Originally the name (actually a 'title') ISRAEL was given by the Lord only to Jacob, because he had become a 'Knower' of God (i.e. a Gnostic) through his "face to face" Vision (this is the root meaning of Israel = one who sees God). This name/title is applicable to all who have the Visionary Experience of God. I would guess that Jacob and others who had such experience would gather together and call themselves Israelites (i.e. Seers or Gnostics).
But, just as many today (and at all times) have loosely (and falsely) used the term Gnostic to refer to themselves, so too, did many Jews falsely use the honourific 'title' Israel as a name to refer to themselves. So, eventually, the name became a common title for the race.
Originally, they probably knew the meaning of the title, but after their Babylonian exile much of their language was forgotten. There are, in fact, many ancient Hebrew words which are now not understood correctly. Anyone who has studied the language will confirm this fact. The English language, too, has changed greatly over the last several hundred years. Words change meaning because they are used incorrectly. The word 'awful', for instance, now means something quite different to its original meaning (= wonderful / amazing).
Peace & Love
CheeryKiara
New Member
I would have to say we have so many different sects because Christianity is so huge. The only requirement to be a Christian is to beleive Christ is the savior of the world, which many people do. But God has made us free agents, which means we have a right to choose whether we want to believe in a loving God, a vengeful God, or even a God at all.
The only other religion I can think of comparing the numbers of christianity to is Islam. There are about 1.5 billion muslims out there, and people seem to think they are much more in line with one another than Christianity. I disagree wholeheartedly with this. I've had many muslim friends (many more than the average American, at least) and every single one of them disagreed on a fundamental level with one another. Sure, in the Middle East they all go to the same mosque and get preached at from the same book, but take away the theocracies and bring 'em over to a country where you can say whatever you want out loud, and they duke it out with each other just as much as the next christian.
Other than that, I think Buddhism is the next most populated, and buddhism has so many different sects (and can be interpreted so many different ways) all I can help but wonder is - why would you single out christians? Any free human with an opinion is going to bicker with the next human con opinion. It doesn't mean we're not onto something. Maybe it just means we need one another to figure the truth out.:drool:
The only other religion I can think of comparing the numbers of christianity to is Islam. There are about 1.5 billion muslims out there, and people seem to think they are much more in line with one another than Christianity. I disagree wholeheartedly with this. I've had many muslim friends (many more than the average American, at least) and every single one of them disagreed on a fundamental level with one another. Sure, in the Middle East they all go to the same mosque and get preached at from the same book, but take away the theocracies and bring 'em over to a country where you can say whatever you want out loud, and they duke it out with each other just as much as the next christian.
Other than that, I think Buddhism is the next most populated, and buddhism has so many different sects (and can be interpreted so many different ways) all I can help but wonder is - why would you single out christians? Any free human with an opinion is going to bicker with the next human con opinion. It doesn't mean we're not onto something. Maybe it just means we need one another to figure the truth out.:drool:
xexon
Destroyer of Worlds
Religion has been turned into a sporting event, with the different teams competing against one another.
Their strength is not spiritual strength, but one of who can recruit the most members. Power from sheer numbers is what they seek.
I doubt if Jesus or Mohammad or Buddha will endorse anything they're offering.
Sects mean division. Division only comes from blindness.
x
Their strength is not spiritual strength, but one of who can recruit the most members. Power from sheer numbers is what they seek.
I doubt if Jesus or Mohammad or Buddha will endorse anything they're offering.
Sects mean division. Division only comes from blindness.
x
A. Ben-Shema
Active Member
Yes, I agree with your statements. ALL religions fall short of the ONE Spiritual Truth of God. The very Experience and Knowledge of God. This is why they cannot reveal God. This is why they are of no use. They are actually worse than that - for they actually fool people into believing that they will be Saved!
Peace & Love
A. Ben-Shema
Active Member
I'm lost again - whose name are you referring to?
A. Ben-Shema
Active Member
Yes, and don't forget, the more members, the more the collection box will contain!
Peace & Love
Booko
Deviled Hen
You define the meaning of "chosen people" like no Jew I know.
You're using a Christian definition, or should I say, misunderstanding.
Booko
Deviled Hen
Interesting you make such a sweeping generalization, when some of "religion" doesn't believe there are "teams", competing or otherwise, and when there are no divisions.
Perhaps a bit more study is in order, because your statement is clearly based on incomplete and inaccurate information.
Booko
Deviled Hen
A. Ben-Shema
Active Member
Nice colours!
Do they mean anything? 'cos the words don't mean much!What do you think all religions promise, if not some 'type' of SALVATION? (please try to see beyond the mere word - s a l v a t i o n)
Peace & Love
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