Pray Away. (the gay)

[Rawshak]

Smarten up - Churchill was clearly denouncing such activity, in attempt to discredit the Royal Navy's traditions. So yes, I'm in accord with Churchill, such behaviour is a perversion.
I never called you gay, I spoke of your and Skeeper's approach as being equal to those who have bizarre lifestyles and fetishes - both your sentiments seem to align with theirs.
Sodomy is flippin' degenerate and disgusting, and men dressing up like a women is for halloween only.

There's something entirely wrong with your thinking, Rawshak. I don't buy for one second that your feigned compassion, or liberalism, is derived from love at all, it is nothing but licentiousness.

Glad to of educated you about the real world, say bye bye to all that you stand for as progress rolls over your sad opinions.

 

[DNB]

Glad to of educated you about the real world, say bye bye to all that you stand for as progress rolls over your sad opinions.

The world is going to hell in a hand-basket, so, in that respect, you are correct, the depraved will eventually overtake the wholesome and righteous (for the time being).
But, now, allow me to educate you - these specific activities and constructs, that you are promoting and embracing is such an ardent manner, they will eventually devour you.

 

[DNB]

Thanks for the compliment, but undeserved. You perhaps are just another bland Bible believer seemingly - where such is 'just enough'.

You know, you are insanely fixated on the Biblical denunciation of homosexual activity, ...of which, actually, you should be - shame that you're not a Bible believer.
But, as far as all my points against homosexuality are concerned, I never once used a theological argument against it. You, on the other hand, cannot seem to get past that delusion, that is, that the only contention that one has against such behaviour is made from an appeal to the Bible. Both biology and character indict the act.

 

[Mock Turtle]

You know, you are insanely fixated on the Biblical denunciation of homosexual activity, ...of which, actually, you should be - shame that you're not a Bible believer.
But, as far as all my points against homosexuality are concerned, I never once used a theological argument against it. You, on the other hand, cannot seem to get past that delusion, that is, that the only contention that one has against such behaviour, is made from an appeal to the Bible. Both biology and character indict the act.

So you just get it from culture, bad thinking perhaps, obvious feelings, and nothing else? You still come across as a card-carrying Biblical exponent though - even where the literal stuff rubs up against better evidence.

Have you actually looked into the science at all? Like for example the fraternal birth order effect, which has been known for decades, and where you can find the info on this readily enough (but I'll post it anyway). Why would there be any tendency for such to happen if it was purely down to choice?

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2017-12-link-older-brothers-odds-homosexual.htm

"The current study adds to the growing scientific consensus that homosexuality is not a choice, but rather an innate predisposition."

Are Younger Brothers More Likely to Be Gay?

Homosexuality has been a long-standing point of confusion for evolutionary psychologists. This is because it is difficult for a theory that places supreme emphasis on reproductive potential to explain behavior that does not appear to promote this goal. One idea, according to the researchers, is that the Fraternal Birth Order effect reduces sibling rivalry. In other words, the Fraternal Birth Order effect might be nature's attempt to minimize sibling conflict. Alternatively, it might be less about the feminization of younger brothers and more about the masculinization of older brothers.

And perhaps this is an example of, like in so many other species, the males born trying to sabotage the productive capabilities of any other future males born to the same mother - even as to killing them in some animal species.

Fraternal birth order and male sexual orientation - Wikipedia
Biology and sexual orientation - Wikipedia

In simple terms, the developing fetal brain begins in a "female" typical state. The presence of the Y-chromosome in males prompts the development of testes, which release testosterone, the primary androgen receptor-activating hormone, to masculinize the fetus and fetal brain. This masculinizing effect pushes males towards male typical brain structures, and most of the time, attraction to females. It has been hypothesized that gay men may have been exposed to little testosterone in key regions of the brain, or had different levels of receptivity to its masculinizing effects, or experienced fluctuations at critical times. In women, it is hypothesized that high levels of exposure to testosterone in key regions may increase likelihood of same sex attraction. Supporting this are studies of the finger digit ratio of the right hand, which is a robust marker of prenatal testosterone exposure. Lesbians on average, have significantly more masculine digit ratios, a finding which has been replicated numerous times in studies cross-culturally. While direct effects are hard to measure for ethical reasons, animal experiments where scientists manipulate exposure to sex hormones during gestation can also induce lifelong male-typical behavior and mounting in female animals, and female-typical behavior in male animals.

Did you know about this - that we just aren't innately born male or female but go through a process so as to arrive at such? And hence where there might be issues to do with such, and perhaps explaining some homosexuality.

 

[DNB]

So you just get it from culture, bad thinking perhaps, obvious feelings, and nothing else? You still come across as a card-carrying Biblical exponent though - even where the literal stuff rubs up against better evidence.

Have you actually looked into the science at all? Like for example the fraternal birth order effect, which has been known for decades, and where you can find the info on this readily enough (but I'll post it anyway). Why would there be any tendency for such to happen if it was purely down to choice?

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2017-12-link-older-brothers-odds-homosexual.htm

"The current study adds to the growing scientific consensus that homosexuality is not a choice, but rather an innate predisposition."

Are Younger Brothers More Likely to Be Gay?

Homosexuality has been a long-standing point of confusion for evolutionary psychologists. This is because it is difficult for a theory that places supreme emphasis on reproductive potential to explain behavior that does not appear to promote this goal. One idea, according to the researchers, is that the Fraternal Birth Order effect reduces sibling rivalry. In other words, the Fraternal Birth Order effect might be nature's attempt to minimize sibling conflict. Alternatively, it might be less about the feminization of younger brothers and more about the masculinization of older brothers.

And perhaps this is an example of, like in so many other species, the males born trying to sabotage the productive capabilities of any other future males born to the same mother - even as to killing them in some animal species.

Fraternal birth order and male sexual orientation - Wikipedia
Biology and sexual orientation - Wikipedia

In simple terms, the developing fetal brain begins in a "female" typical state. The presence of the Y-chromosome in males prompts the development of testes, which release testosterone, the primary androgen receptor-activating hormone, to masculinize the fetus and fetal brain. This masculinizing effect pushes males towards male typical brain structures, and most of the time, attraction to females. It has been hypothesized that gay men may have been exposed to little testosterone in key regions of the brain, or had different levels of receptivity to its masculinizing effects, or experienced fluctuations at critical times. In women, it is hypothesized that high levels of exposure to testosterone in key regions may increase likelihood of same sex attraction. Supporting this are studies of the finger digit ratio of the right hand, which is a robust marker of prenatal testosterone exposure. Lesbians on average, have significantly more masculine digit ratios, a finding which has been replicated numerous times in studies cross-culturally. While direct effects are hard to measure for ethical reasons, animal experiments where scientists manipulate exposure to sex hormones during gestation can also induce lifelong male-typical behavior and mounting in female animals, and female-typical behavior in male animals.

Did you know about this - that we just aren't innately born male or female but go through a process so as to arrive at such? And hence where there might be issues to do with such.

Are you joking? First of all, there are studies out the yin-yang that will support a myriad of different views. That goes without saying.
Point is, we don't need to get so esoteric about the issue - all life as we know it, subsists solely by the principle of male and female (barring the remote exceptions of single-celled creatures).
This is an intrinsic principle that cannot be denied or altered. Thus, this determines normality and healthy behaviour.

Yes, I agree with you, within my limited knowledge of this matter, that some are born either androgynous, imbalanced in hormones/testosterone/estrogen, mixed or confused genitalia, etc..
Theses are the rare exceptions, and therefore, do not establish the rules. I cannot imagine the pain and confusion that must go through the person's mind that suffers from either one of these, or any, preconditioned anomalies. I cannot imagine the pain, and I denounce any ridicule or abuse that may be laid upon them for this uncontrollable and unwanted condition. But, again, I do not consider this to be something to embraced, the peculiar behavioural patterns that come alongside such a phenomenon must be curbed.
We can argue all day if people who have anger issues are born that way, or delusions of grandeur, or any other mental condition - we make attempts to desist such behaviour associated with these predispositions, we don't endorse these acts.

The problem here, with the most part of pro-LGBTQ people, is that you feel just because you can't tangible detect the harm, that such behaviour is therefore benign on all accounts.
I disagree, lustful, perverted and abnormal desires do invariably affects one's character.

 

[Mock Turtle]

Are you joking? First of all, there are studies out the yin-yang that will support a myriad of different views. That goes without saying.
Point is, we don't need to get so esoteric about the issue - all life as we know it, subsists solely by the principle of male and female (barring the remote exceptions of single-celled creatures).
This is an intrinsic principle that cannot be denied or altered. Thus, this determines normality and healthy behaviour.

Yes, I agree with you, within my limited knowledge of this matter, that some are born either androgynous, imbalanced in hormones/testosterone/estrogen, mixed or confused genitalia, etc..
Theses are the rare exceptions, and therefore, do not establish the rules. I cannot imagine the pain and confusion that must go through the person's mind that suffers from either one of these, or any, preconditioned anomalies. I cannot imagine the pain, and I denounce any ridicule or abuse that may be laid upon them for this uncontrollable and unwanted condition. But, again, I do not consider this to be something to embraced, the peculiar behavioural patterns that come alongside such a phenomenon must be curbed.
We can argue all day if people who have anger issues are born that way, or delusions of grandeur, or any other mental condition - we make attempts to desist such behaviour associated with these predispositions, we don't endorse these acts.

The problem here, with the most part of pro-LGBTQ people, is that you feel just because you can't tangible detect the harm, that such behaviour is therefore benign on all accounts.
I disagree, lustful, perverted and abnormal desires do invariably affects one's character.

You are the one who is obviously joking - by just dismissing science over your preferred beliefs. Bye!