you're off another tangent. everlasting life doesn't equate to stopping. it's a transformation of one state of matter to another state of matter. energy changing form.
we were discussing sacrifce and selflessness
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Overcoming and Perfecting
- Thread starter Fool
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we were discussing sacrifce and selflessness
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
It's not my christianity. It's just what the bible actually says. I can't change what it says just quote it and hope you read the verses as christians here hope non-christians read theirs. Probably one out of ten people read it. But, in this case, it seemed appropriate because saying christianity doesnt teach sacrifice goes against all christian denominations.
If you are christian, you can believe in the bible however you want. People who are not christian can see the bible for what it is without the personal bias interpreting what they think is there that isn't really there.
If your life isn't your highest value, of course sacrifice wouldn't make sense. Jesus thought otherwise. But then, I dont know if many follow jesus. I am closer to catholic views on that because they don't take their lives as in suicide but they do sacrifice themselves by sharing in jesus passion in the Eucharist. They understand that christianity has to do with not only jesus teachings (his life) and not only jesus salvation (his resurrection) but his death (his sacrifice) as well.
But everyone is at different levels of growth in sacrifice or charity of the highest value. Not many people find it easy to give a million dollars when they know they need it to keep shelter over their head. Sacrifice comes in many forms. Jesus taught it through his own life.
That's in the bible.
Has nothing to do with me.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
What you are talking about is Buddhism. Christianity does not teach that. Sacrifice in Christianity is different than that of Buddhism. The Buddha, like you, dont even call it sacrifice.
But, my point is, you quoted the bible, so I'm going off the bible nothing more.
no it's the way you sieve it through your mind. all data is like anything outside of self, it's sieved through the mind. it also reflects "your" understanding as your ideas of a christian are reflected by "your" understanding
nope, the idea isn't exclusive to buddhism, in the OT and the NT
John 3:15
That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
and
Daniel 12:2
And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
It's reflected on my experience and understanding (and a whole lot of studying). Without the experience, I would know nothing about Christianity and be just like many people here talking against it.
Christianity is about jesus life (his teachings of mercy), his death (teachings of charity and giving), and resurrection (teachings of life in heaven).
Most christians call this christ's Passion.
It is expressed by saying he is the "Sacrificial Lamb of God."
With the verses I quoted to support it.
It's not an opinion. It's verbatim teachings from scripture and the core of christian teachings. Beyond that, it's up for grabs. I have nothing to do with it personally.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Sacrifice is not an end to life. It means giving yourself up like christ to live forever with god. Please read the verses I gave you. These just backs it up.
again i never said it wasn't based on your experience. i actually put "your" in quotation marks. it has to work the same way for everyone for it to be truthful. the truth, like justice, isn't partial to persons, or forms.
you keep speaking for christians, are you christian?
the book of revelation was written for jews; if you wish to be specific. jesus didn't call them christians
Revelation 2:9
I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are t
Revelation 3:9
Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
Love is god. God isn't exclusively selfish at the expense of others
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
I did practice christianity; so, I had an intimate experience as a christian. Like I said, you quoted the bible so I went off the bible.
I personally do not believe I have to die to myself in order to give. However, that is what christianity teaches. To take jesus death out is really telling a lot of people they are not saved. They need his sacrifice in order to live everlasting life.
I am not against christianity. I just don't agree with its teachings. But this is so point blank that its hard not to defend it by facts regardless of how I feel about it personally.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
That's not what sacrifice is.
It's the highest form of charity. Giving yourself for another person. There is nothing more to it.
Charity begins at home but it doesn't end there. Do unto others as you would have done unto you. What you do unto the least of these, any of these, you do unto me.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
They would not be christians if they did not believe jesus lived, died, and was resurrected (regardless of how they translate his resurrection).
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Jesus did this through his life, death, and resurrection. In the Bible it is called the sacrifical offering (verses already quoted). It is commenced during the lord's supper in the gospels. It was lived by christ through his dialogue and actions with the apostles. It is carried out by the apostles after jesus death. Paul says "I am crucified with Christ, nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me. And the life which I now live in the flesh, I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me." Galations 2:20.
Regardless if its symbolism or actual Crucifixion of the flesh (meaning repentance), this is a form of sacrifice.
I dont know any christians who do not believe jesus sacrificed himself for their sins.
the personality doesn't survive. the bible tells you that. you're confusing resurrection with the idea of regeneration.
man lives once and then the judgment. he who overcomes the 1st death, the 2nd has no power over him. that is resurrection. the 2nd death is the physical. the 1st is the personality, or ego
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
This has nothing to do with sacrifice. I dont know what you believe about resurrection but most christians believe in resurrection. So, that's what you believe. I've never been in any denomination that called resurrection by any other name but what it is. JW have different definitions than Baptist but they both believe he was resurrected...and so on and so forth.
I'm talking about sacrifice. It is the highest form of charity and giving. Giving yourself for another person to live. You can translate that as giving food to the homeless. You can translate that as a mother dying to save her child from drowning. The definition is the same.
Anything extra depends on the person.
most? i explained it has to work ONE WAY for everyone; otherwise it's prejudicial and god is not a respecter of persons
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
All forms of christianity has to do with christ life, death, and resurrection. That's case closed unless they are not christians in any sense of the word.
A handful of christians I know believe that their salvation is symbolic. All the christians I know say they know christ saved them.
All christian denominations believe in some form of sacrifice.
You mention giving. That is a form of sacrifice.
Some people say communion. That is a form of sacrifice.
Catholics give charity. That's a form of sacrifice.
Saints gave their life. That's a form of sacrifice.
Jesus gave his life and scarified his own life in death. That is a form of sacrifice.
A mother saving her child by dying is sacrifice just as my sacrificing my last one dollar bill to get home to someone who needs it more than me is sacrifice.
It's not idolotry or anything like that. It just means giving something you own of higher value for someone else. That's it.
What christian denomination has no form of giving in it?
christ isn't exclusively jesus.
colossians 3:11
Christ is All and in ALL.
blasphemy against the Holy Spirit isn't forgivable because it is the denial of the very Spirit within self.
romans 8:11
But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.
we reap what we sow.
work out your own salvation with fear and trembling
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