New Jersey Homosexual Partnerships

[Zeke316]

Maize;
You're barking up the wrong tree... Your fight is with the Scriptures...We make laws for the 'good' of society. .. For over 200 years, the people of this country have made it clear that 'homosexuality' is SIN. Because you want it to be accepted, doesn't make it so.... The God of Creation said it is abhorent behavior. ...Tell it to the Judge.

 

[dolly]

But Tom Delay, one of the house leaderrs (or is it Senate?,) is trying an "end around" He wants to deny jurisdiction to all the courts to hear cases involving the Marriage Act - which Congress can do constitutionally.

Little steps at a time. And I'm sure that if they don't let the marriage amendment pass, they won't allow that to either.


Zeke - it's simple. In the USA, we do (or should) not make laws solely based on someone's religious opinion. We are not a Christian country. Unless you can come up with a valid secular reason why we shouldn't (and I haven't heard of one), then there is no reason to make marriage only for hets.

 

[Zeke316]

Hello Dolly;
Once again...People who perform homosexual and lesbian activity are ordinary people doing inordinate things. [ Sinful]
They are not a special race of people, just sinners who want to ligitimize their particular sin.
When theives get their turn and try to make armed robbery lawful, it won't be because they are a special class of people.
Try selling your theories to the misinformed and don't try to mask your sin and call it freedom of choice.
Blessings

 

[dolly]

Hello Dolly;
Once again...People who perform homosexual and lesbian activity are ordinary people doing inordinate things. [ Sinful]
They are not a special race of people, just sinners who want to ligitimize their particular sin.
When theives get their turn and try to make armed robbery lawful, it won't be because they are a special class of people.
Try selling your theories to the misinformed and don't try to mask your sin and call it freedom of choice.
Blessings

Zeke - I know this stand point. My point is, this is not a Christian state. Not everyone believes in God, or sins, etc. Until you can come up with a reason why homosexual marriages shouldn't be allowed, and that reason has absolutely nothing to do with sin, God, hell, or anything religious, then you have a valid point. Until then, no law should be made that takes away another person's rights just because of an old book.

 

[Zeke316]

If you don't think this is a Christian nation, you may want to check out the Declaration of Independence. ... Also. check out Article 7 of the US Constitution and tell me Who the person "Lord" is as mentioned in that article.

Blessings:

 

[dolly]

If you don't think this is a Christian nation, you may want to check out the Declaration of Independence. ... Also. check out Article 7 of the US Constitution and tell me Who the person "Lord" is as mentioned in that article.

Blessings:

It isn't a Christian country. Deistic, yes (even though it shouldn't be), but Christian, no.

 

[Zeke316]

Hello Dolly;
I among millions of others, disagree with you. ... Do a little study on the Pilgrims and The Charters of the 13 Colonies... Walk into the Capital Rotunda and read all the Scripture overhead. Read Washingtons Farewell Address, and on and on and on...
You will be hard pressed to think that these people had no inclination toward the Christian Faith.
But, hey, who am I to convince someone who's mind is made up.
You remember the old saying..."My mind is made up...don't trouble me with facts".

Blessings;

 

[Ardhanariswar]

inclination towards the christian faith?

the reason why pilgrams left was because of religion.

they wanted to find freedom.

gays have the right in this country to get thier marriages recognized.

plus, being gay is not adultury cuz ur not cheating on your partner.

i support marriage between two loving souls. they have the right for their marriage to be recognized by a SECULAR (i say that agian, SUCULAR) state.


"Gerani;
"Too much of a hassle"...I have a problem with making a living...I need $3,000. per week to allow me the lifestyle I desire. My problem is, I only make $2,000. per week. ..I can make up the difference by selling drugs and that will solve my problem...
My question is, 'Should I start selling drugs'? It will give me the extra money that I need. Or how about if I begin to take property from my employer and selling that? He has more money than I do and he will not miss it.
What do you think I need to do to 'eliminate all these hassles'? "

you lost me, lol.

why should i change? i have a fine life living the way i am. my sexuality does not stop me from getting into heaven. being a good person is all God sees. sexuality is part of the body, and my soul will be free of it. it will fly away to see my Lord.

my sexuality does not stop me from being a good person. unfortunitly you cannot see that.


some people are blinded by material things. this society is soo based on sex. its impossible i tell you! ahaha.

 

[Zeke316]

Gerani;
I agree with you...Your god will allow homosexual conduct and will not penalize you for it. .. .. My God, will not, and has given Christians clear commandments against it. .. We just don't have the same God. The God of the bible has spoken out against the 'homosexual' lifestyle. ..Your god, has not.... By the way, has your god ever said anything and where can I read it?

 

[Pah]

When asked if parents wanted their children to grow up to participate in 'homosexual' activities...almost all of them said "NO". My question is Why? .. Because nature itself, tells us that this activity is wrong.

God's creation which so many people consider nature has an abundance of homosexual animals including human beings. Three hundred have been scientifically documented. So Zeke, you are just plain wrong and now you are informed. You can not say anymore that homosexuality is unnatural. And I'd ask a question based on your "new" knowledge - do it think it right to disagree with God's creation seeing he made so many homosexuals?

People who perform homosexual and lesbian activity are ordinary people doing inordinate things. [ Sinful]
They are not a special race of people, just sinners who want to ligitimize their particular sin

Like corporate investors that practise greed? Like formerly married Christians who divorce? Like gluttons who are overweight?

It seems the height of hyposcrisy to pick and choose what sin you will be against - what sin you will spend millions of dollars against. Take the beam from your eyes all you Christians who oppose homosexuality.

If you don't think this is a Christian nation, you may want to check out the Declaration of Independence. ... Also. check out Article 7 of the US Constitution and tell me Who the person "Lord" is as mentioned in that article.

You mean this Article VII " The Ratification of the Conventions of nine States, shall be sufficient for the Establishment of this Constitution between the States so ratifying the same." Where is "lord" mentioned?

And the terms "the laws of Nature and of Nature's God" and "they are endowed, by their CREATOR, with certain unalienable Rights" as found in the Declaration of Independance. You think the Deist terms refer to a Christian God? Those terms are more applicable to the gods of the nations from which we stole our land not the God of the Bible.

Do a little study on the Pilgrims and The Charters of the 13 Colonies... Walk into the Capital Rotunda and read all the Scripture overhead

I have, Zeke, I have. Here is what I found. The government of Massachusetts Bay Colony (the Piligrims) was the only theocracy in America. As such it was aberant.

Of the thirteen colonies New Jersey, New York, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, Vermont, Virginia, Deleware, Georgia, and Maryland did not mention God in their first Constitutions. South Carolina added a second constitution in 1778 that did mention God as did Massachusetts constitution in 1780. These are from the documents kept in the Avalon Project at Yale (except for the one from Massachusetts) So Zeke, two out of thirteen do not make a Christian nation. I might add that South Carolina changed their constitution in 1790 (less than three years later) to model the US Constitution. Massachusettes allowed state funds to support churches and that ended in 1831, I believe.

I'm surprised that you would think that architectual details in the Capital Building, soley under the purview of the architect, would make this a Christian nation. They are adornment not policy or law.

 

[Zeke316]

Article 7 says ..."In the year of OUR LORD". Who were they referring to?
Your argument is NOT with me. Your argument is with the God of the bible. Why not convince Him that certain sins are no longer in effect?... ..When He changes His Laws, then I might listen to your plea.
In the meantime, the speed limit is still posted on the highway of life.
Don't get caught speeding. By the way...comparing animal activity to justify human conduct...How about all the carnivours...Do you reccommend we start eating human flesh? After all, the animals do it.
We just have different gods. No problem,....It's not for everybody.

Blessings.

 

[Ardhanariswar]

Gerani;
I agree with you...Your god will allow homosexual conduct and will not penalize you for it. .. .. My God, will not, and has given Christians clear commandments against it. .. We just don't have the same God. The God of the bible has spoken out against the 'homosexual' lifestyle. ..Your god, has not.... By the way, has your god ever said anything and where can I read it?

i believe your God and my God are the same.

i belive that the christian church as perversed the messege of God so they can have all the power. thats why i dont look at christianity as a good path for me to follow.


God sees nothing in no lifestyle except a lifestyle were a person gives, and helps other people.

 

[Runt]

"Done in Convention by the Unanimous Consent of the States present the Seventeenth Day of September in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty seven and of the Independence of the United States of America the Twelfth In witness whereof We have hereunto subscribed our Names..."

The "Year of our Lord" is not a religous reference, but a reference to AD. AD is the abreviation of the latin phrase "Anno Domini", which translates directly as "the Year of our Lord". It is just the way they wrote the date in the time the Constitution was written.

 

[Pah]

Article 7 says ..."In the year of OUR LORD". Who were they referring to?

I quoted the whole of Article VII. You are mistaken and probably confused by the signature block that follows - which is NOT part of Article VII.

In that, it merely refers to the calendar instituted by a pope. You really have scant and erroneous evidence for us being called a Christian Nation.

Your argument is NOT with me. Your argument is with the God of the bible. Why not convince Him that certain sins are no longer in effect?... ..When He changes His Laws, then I might listen to your plea.

It is more probable that your interpretation of his laws are wrong.

... By the way...comparing animal activity to justify human conduct...How about all the carnivours...Do you reccommend we start eating human flesh? After all, the animals do it. ...

The Donner party did it and a soccor team that crashed in high mountaians did it also. Many tribes in Africa and South America and the South Sea Islands and South East Asia did it and, to some extent, still do it. It is natural to eat flesh - all flesh - for nourishment.

So often the other arguement against the nature of animals is that they kill children and that is not fit for humans. A great arguement until a bible reader comes across the many instances where God commanded infanticide. I bet there were also many children that perished in the Flood too. What do ya think?

Now those arguements involve the killing of other human beings. Do you think that homosexuall activity is in the same league as killing? Even though some will argue erronously about the "harm" homosexuality does to society, it doesn't begin to approach the "sin" of cannibalism or infanticide as practised by tribes and the hungry nor by the followers of the God of the Old Testament - now does it?

Those other points, I made - perhaps you didn't get around to them or maybe you have no arguement against them.

 

[Pah]

We just have different gods. No problem,....It's not for everybody.

Blessings.

I agree to that. What I don't agree to is the forcing of beliefs associated with your God on the American public.

 

[Zeke316]

For all you posters who have a problem with the God of the bible having laws prohibiting all sorts of behavior...either agree that God has the sovereign authority to put limits on our behavior or admit that you believe in a god of your own making. ...

About the "Lord" in Article 7, our founding fathers would have struck it from the document if they felt as antagonistic against the God of the Bible, as you all do. .. The fact of the matter is that they quoted from the Scriptures often. They understood that there was a God Who is in control of His creation.

There are many sins identified in the bible. ... We are all guilty of most of them. .. Don't try to justify your particular sin by declassifying it from the list. .. Just fess up and call it what it is... To say obvious sinful practices are not sinful, weakens your argument and destroys your credibility.

 

[Green Gaia]

Maize;
You're barking up the wrong tree... Your fight is with the Scriptures...We make laws for the 'good' of society. .. For over 200 years, the people of this country have made it clear that 'homosexuality' is SIN. Because you want it to be accepted, doesn't make it so.... The God of Creation said it is abhorent behavior. ...Tell it to the Judge.

Zeke, this is a debate. Give your side of the argument and back it up, if you don't wish to do that, then refrain from posting in the debates section. Telling someone to "tell it to the Judge" is not proper debating tactics.

As far as the people of this country making homosexuality a sin, that's debatable. Some people accept it, and some people don't, always have, always will. However, society changes it mind on what is acceptable all the time. 200 years ago in this country it was acceptable for a white man to own a black man, we no longer find that acceptable, then though there is still rampant racism in our country. 100 years ago women were not allowed to vote, but society finally realized that women were equal to men and allowed to vote as well, yet I'm sure you will find those who think this is not so. 50 years ago it was not acceptable, and even against the law, for a white woman to marry a black man, but we have since deemed that practice discriminatory and now you see interracial couples, although you will still hear some people all this horrible and against God's idea of marriage.

Society changes my friend, better get use to it.

 

[Green Gaia]

Hello Dolly;
Once again...People who perform homosexual and lesbian activity are ordinary people doing inordinate things. [ Sinful]
They are not a special race of people, just sinners who want to ligitimize their particular sin.
When theives get their turn and try to make armed robbery lawful, it won't be because they are a special class of people.
Try selling your theories to the misinformed and don't try to mask your sin and call it freedom of choice.
Blessings

Your opinion that homosexuality is a sin is based on your religious beliefs and should therefore not be imposed or forced on the whole society. Armed robbery is unlawful because there is a hurt party involved. Homosexuality hurts no one, and you cannot provide a non-religious reason why it is wrong.

 

[Green Gaia]

If you don't think this is a Christian nation, you may want to check out the Declaration of Independence. ... Also. check out Article 7 of the US Constitution and tell me Who the person "Lord" is as mentioned in that article.

Blessings:

This is not a Christian Theocracy, so you cannot impose or force your beliefs on the population as a whole.

 

[Green Gaia]

Gerani;
I agree with you...Your god will allow homosexual conduct and will not penalize you for it. .. .. My God, will not, and has given Christians clear commandments against it. .. We just don't have the same God. The God of the bible has spoken out against the 'homosexual' lifestyle. ..Your god, has not.... By the way, has your god ever said anything and where can I read it?

There is only one God, (if "God" even exists). Just because you have some old texts that claim to be from God, doesn't make it so AND even if these texts are from God, that doesn't mean you are reading them correctly. If you believe something to be wrong, then don't do it, but others are allowed the freedom, in this country anyway, to live life as they please. "Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness...." does that ring a bell??