MURDER, GENOCIDE, and ATHEISTS.

[Audie]

lady, I have a minor in American history, your accusation is from sheer ignorance.

VERY minor

And a lot of sheer ignorance.

shmogie said: ↑
The genocide of native Americans had nothing to do with religion and everything to do with manifest destiny.



How many citations does it take to
get through to you?

The Components Of Manifest Destiny < Manifest Destiny - Michael T ...

www.let.rug.nl/usa/essays/.../manifest-destiny/the-components-of-manifest-destiny.ph...
It had a future that was destined by God to expand its borders, with no limit to area or country. All the traveling and expansion were part of the spirit of Manifest Destiny, a belief that it was God's will that Americans spread over the entire continent, and to control and populate the country as they see

VERY minor

And a lot of sheer ignorance.

shmogie said: ↑
The genocide of native Americans had nothing to do with religion and everything to do with manifest destiny.



How many citations does it take to
get through to you?

The Components Of Manifest Destiny < Manifest Destiny - Michael T ...

www.let.rug.nl/usa/essays/.../manifest-destiny/the-components-of-manifest-destiny.ph...
It had a future that was destined by God to expand its borders, with no limit to area or country. All the traveling and expansion were part of the spirit of Manifest Destiny, a belief that it was God's will that Americans spread over the entire continent, and to control and populate the country as they see

 

[shmogie]

Manifest Destiny held that the United States was destined—by God, its advocates believed—to expand its dominion and spread democracy and capitalism across the entire North American continent.

https://www.history.com/topics/westward-expansion/manifest-destiny

That isn´t theological, other than touting the supposed superiority of the European race and its social systems.

Democracy nor capitalism are theological concepts, they are economic.

If you are using a belief that some had to justify what they were doing as making manifest destiny a religious movement, you need to get out some history books and learn how for the average sodbuster, or cavalry soldier, or military leader like Custer and his massacres, the average person in western expansion, felt about what they were doing.

MY Grandmother lived in a soddy with my Grandfather on the Kansas plains, land that was once controlled by N/Aś, I assure you that they never thought about God being involved when they came from England and headed west.

 

[Audie]

Manifest Destiny held that the United States was destined—by God, its advocates believed—to expand its dominion and spread democracy and capitalism across the entire North American continent.

https://www.history.com/topics/westward-expansion/manifest-destiny

We predict that he will never ever concede this point.

 

[Audie]

c.

If you are using a belief that some had to justify what they were doing as making manifest destiny a religious movement, you need to get out some history books and learn how for the average sodbuster, or cavalry soldier, or military leader like Custer and his massacres, the average person in western expansion, felt about what they were doing.

MY Grandmother lived in a soddy with my Grandfather on the Kansas plains, land that was once controlled by N/Aś, I assure you that they never thought about God being involved when they came from England and headed west.

And forgot your own words? Grab them goal posts and run!
shmogie said: ↑
The genocide of native Americans had nothing to do with religion and everything to do with manifest destiny.

 

[charlie sc]

We predict that he will never ever concede this point.

Ignorance is strong in him.

 

[shmogie]

Good quotes, but I need one from out OPster.

So what ? It happened, 4,000 years ago. the rules changes 2,000 years ago.

You are trying to suck me in to a bash Christianity party. Count me out.

I asked questions of you following the original post about atheists and genocide.

You have failed to answer them.

 

[shmogie]

And forgot your own words? Grab them goal posts and run!
shmogie said: ↑
The genocide of native Americans had nothing to do with religion and everything to do with manifest destiny.

Bull, it is what historians do to write history. A wikipedia quote about a general justification does not make manifest destiny a religious movement.

Why are you afraid of the OP ?

 

[Audie]

So what ? It happened, 4,000 years ago. the rules changes 2,000 years ago.

You are trying to suck me in to a bash Christianity party. Count me out.

I asked questions of you following the original post about atheists and genocide.

You have failed to answer them.

Ah, absolute morality changes.

I am not trying to suck you into anything,
other than maybe a simple yes or no
answer about putting your faith in "god's
morality" into action.

You keep running away. I know it is a tough
one,but you are an adult, you can do it.

IF we were back in them old days you speak
of, and you had your God tell you to string me
up, would you do it?

super simple yes or no

 

[Audie]

Bull, it is what historians do to write history. A wikipedia quote about a general justification does not make manifest destiny a religious movement.

Why are you afraid of the OP ?

Why are you so terrified of the possibility that you
could make even a little mistake, and have to concede
it? Go ahead, google "manifest destiny". See for
yourself. Aint just wiki. One after another after
another after another says, "god".

Why are you so afraid of the truth?

But never mind. I want to know if you would
do as God told you, or stick with your own conscience.

Here I am, rope around my neck, there is a tree,
god is saying pull that rope, are you going to defy
god, or pull the rope?

 

[PoetPhilosopher]

Why are you so terrified of the possibility that you
could make even a little mistake, and have to concede
it? Go ahead, google "manifest destiny". See for
yourself. Aint just wiki. One after another after
another after another says, "god".

Why are you so afraid of the truth?

But never mind. I want to know if you would
do as God told you, or stick with your own conscience.

Here I am, rope around my neck, there is a tree,
god is saying pull that rope, are you going to defy
god, or pull the rope?

In a sense, it's times like this when you realize what people are like. By their answer to this question.

I'd tell God to take a hike to the center of the Earth.

And I swear it on my mother's grave.

 

[Audie]

In a sense, it's times like this when you realize what people are like. By their answer to this question.

I'd tell God to take a hike to the center of the Earth.

And I swear it on my mother's grave.

Yeah, it is sad. I was kind of forming what I thought was
a friendship with the guy, and then boom out comes this
foaming rant against people like me. I cannot be friends
with such a person.

As for telling that god to take a hike, well, I'd hope so.
It would show you have a conscience.

Actually, I do not think anyone ever has gotten
any message and that there is no god to be giving
any.

I hope a person who feels he is getting a message
would keep that in mind!!!!!

 

[PoetPhilosopher]

Yeah, it is sad. I was kind of forming what I thought was
a friendship with the guy, and then boom out comes this
foaming rant against people like me. I cannot be friends
with such a person.

As for telling that god to take a hike, well, I'd hope so.
It would show you have a conscience.

Actually, I do not think anyone ever has gotten
any message and that there is no god to be giving
any.

I hope a person who feels he is getting a message
would keep that in mind!!!!!

Friendship takes understanding and sacrifice. It has to be two-way when it comes to such understanding and sacrifice. So I understand.

 

[shmogie]

You aren't using the same tactics because you aren't being factual and inferring things without a good basis.


No. My concept of a ranting hateful Christian or troll applies here.


You aren't defending, you're attacking.

So, tell me, what isn´t factual about the statement that atheist government leaders have committed the most massive genocides in history ?

What am I inferring by stating that fact ?

What do atheists infer when they continually cite the failings and murders committed by alleged Christians ?

What is being inferred is the result of your thinking, and you don´t like it, not my problem, the facts stand.

 

[shmogie]

Friendship takes understanding and sacrifice. It has to be two-way when it comes to such understanding and sacrifice. So I understand.

It isn´t a rant about anyone, nor did

 

[PoetPhilosopher]

It isn´t a rant about anyone

There exists a difference of opinion between us then. To me, you took her views, threw them in a pit, and burned them along with a great portion of the forum's, all to satisfy personal revenge-seeking of a Straw Man you had.

 

[sooda]

Bud, my agenda is to defend Christians from scurilous attacks and to show the hypocrisy of the attackers.

You fly around like a fly and snipe.

You have a problem with me, spill it.

Lets talk about your pseudo intellectualism and your religion.

Are you up for it ? If not, shut up.

You can talk about pseudo-intellectualism and believe in Noah's flood and that Jonah was swallowed by a fish?

Are you kidding me?

 

[shmogie]

It isn´t a rant about anyone, nor did

Sorry, hit the wrong button. I said nothing about you or anyone like you. I stated a fact about atheist national leaders and a quote from someone who believes there is a connection between atheism and mass murder.

I am amazed that atheists can take real nasty shots at Christians and feel perfectly justified, yet and their beliefs, and feel justified, and yet are crushed about some facts about atheists.

Why is that ?

Why do you take it so personally ? If I took everything said about Christians personally I would be an emotional wreck,

If friendship means that the belief structures of one cannot be discussed, yet the belief structure of the other can be freely attacked then it is valueless.

You are seeing and internalizing things that simply are not there.

 

[shmogie]

There exists a difference of opinion between us then. To me, you took her views, threw them in a pit, and burned them along with a great portion of the forum's, all to satisfy personal revenge-seeking of a Straw Man you had.

Really ? How is that, by stating historical fact ? Were her views the same as those who promulgated the the massacres ? Did I say they were ?

MY beliefs get savaged every day on this forum, and I have been here for years, I don take it personally

 

[charlie sc]

So, tell me, what isn´t factual about the statement that atheist government leaders have committed the most massive genocides in history ?

What am I inferring by stating that fact ?

The only event you vaguely described are bogus. Some of the names you mentioned were deists and the cults they were in followed deistic writings and well as atheistic. Their goals had theistic thoughts and directives in mind and you forgot to mention The Cult of the Supreme Being. So, when you say, "atheist government leaders have committed the most massive genocides in history," it sound extremely ill-informed if the only examples you gave where horse ****. So, your rant is not only factually wrong but extremely opinionated based on wrong information. I don't mind if you say an atheist did this or that, but at least get your history straight.

What do atheists infer when they continually cite the failings and murders committed by alleged Christians ?

It's extremely, and I emphasise extremely, easy to infer murders and genocides because of Christianity. Christianity is an ideology, whereas atheism is an idea. Christianity has a caboodle of nonsense packed in it and is used indirectly and directly for tons and tons of behaviour.

What is being inferred is the result of your thinking, and you don´t like it, not my problem, the facts stand.

Nope.

 

[PoetPhilosopher]

You are seeing and internalizing things that simply are not there.

I still don't see any reason to give a benefit of a doubt given a certain "Pretend Man" comment awhile back. Anything short of an apology or an "I was wrong" from you, and I just consider your statements a strong argument for me to become an atheist (which I wasn't).

I think you should answer Audie's question. She seemed to ask in honesty.