Man from Dust

[Thief]

Thief here...I still see it...after all of these years!

So many people still lean on the Creation Narrative as factual.
Even that portion in Genesis Chapter Two, in which Man is raised up from the dust.

Somehow...I seem to be the only person...that holds true...
Man is made of dust...yeah.
But Adam was not the first man.
He was the first Son of God.

 

[Willamena]

In streams of light I clearly saw
the dust you seldom see,
out of which The Nameless makes
a name for one like me.
~Leonard Cohen

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Man from Dust

I died as a mineral and became a plant;
I died as a plant and rose to animal;
I died as animal and I was a man.
Why should I fear?
When was I less by dying?
Yet once more I shall die as man to soar...
With angels blest.
But even from an angel I must pass on:
All except God must perish.
When I have sacrificed my angel soul,
I shall become what no mind ever conceived.

JALALUDDIN RUMI

 

[SoliDeoGloria]

What I find interesting is when it comes to this is from simple Biology classes; The fact that humans have a little bit of every element listed in the periodical table of elements in them.

Sincerely,
SoliDeoGloria

 

[OmarKhayyam]

"What I find interesting is when it comes to this is from simple Biology classes; The fact that humans have a little bit of every element listed in the periodical table of elements in them."

Not if you are healthy.

Elements in the Human Body

 

[ChristineES]

The late Carl Sagan said on the TV show Cosmos that we are made out of "star stuff", which means we are made out of the same stuff the stars, planets etc. Maybe that is what was meant in Genesis.
You never know.

 

[Willamena]

What I find interesting is when it comes to this is from simple Biology classes; The fact that humans have a little bit of every element listed in the periodical table of elements in them.

Even Radium?

 

[Thief]

Thief here....
Let's take a somewhat tighter focus on this topic.

Specifically....Genesis. Real quick...here is the list in Chapter One.
Day One...Light
Day Two... Heaven
Day Three...everything that is green and bears seed.
Day Four...the seasons are set into order....the sun, moon, and stars
Day Five...everything that swims or flies.
Day Six...everything that walks...including Man

Obviously, there are some discussions to make about which items are out of order...some things need be in position before others.
But, we can do that portion later. For now, the list continues.

Day Seven...all is created...God rests...no more will be created.

Chapter Two.
God takes a man and places him into ideal living conditions.
His life is greatly extended, as the conditions allow it to be so.
Nothing will harm him. He is sheltered.

This isolated living is terminal.
Without a mate, the man is doomed to a solitary life.
A deep sleep is administered.
A rib is removed.
The rib is increased to full stature as a woman.

This is the basic structure of Scripture...Chapter One, and the intro of Chapter Two.

I realize there are many types of bibles and other sources.
If you have any objection...now would be the moment to ask for adjustment.
However...the next line of thought has a flow of it's own.
I will continue with my discussion as planned....regardless.

 

[Katzpur]

Man from Dust

I died as a mineral and became a plant;
I died as a plant and rose to animal;
I died as animal and I was a man.
Why should I fear?
When was I less by dying?
Yet once more I shall die as man to soar...
With angels blest.
But even from an angel I must pass on:
All except God must perish.
When I have sacrificed my angel soul,
I shall become what no mind ever conceived.

JALALUDDIN RUMI

Well, in spite of the fact that I don't believe in reincarnation, I really, really, really like that poem! :yes:

 

[Katzpur]

The late Carl Sagan said on the TV show Cosmos that we are made out of "star stuff", which means we are made out of the same stuff the stars, planets etc. Maybe that is what was meant in Genesis.
You never know.

Mormon belief is that we were created out of an incredibly pure and highly refined matter that can best be described as "the light of truth." That sounds a little bit like what Carl Sagan was saying.

 

[Willamena]

Thief here....

Good to know there aren't other people posting as your handle.

Let's take a somewhat tighter focus on this topic.

Specifically....Genesis. Real quick...here is the list in Chapter One.
Day One...Light
Day Two... Heaven
Day Three...everything that is green and bears seed.
Day Four...the seasons are set into order....the sun, moon, and stars
Day Five...everything that swims or flies.
Day Six...everything that walks...including Man

Obviously, there are some discussions to make about which items are out of order...some things need be in position before others.

Like what? Taken symbolically, they could make a fine order.

First day, the light bulb goes off. Second day, we are content with it (go figure!). Day Three, thoughs occur about how things should be; Day Four, we put them in order. Day Five, into our new "life," we emerge on the planet. Day Six: and blinking, step into the light... there's more to see than can ever be seen, more to do than can ever be done...

Day Seven...all is created...God rests...no more will be created.

The Lion sleeps, tonight...

Chapter Two.
God takes a man and places him into ideal living conditions.
His life is greatly extended, as the conditions allow it to be so.
Nothing will harm him. He is sheltered.

Mufasa takes Simba to the top of Pride Rock to survey all his kingdom. Simba notices a dark boundary to the kingdom, beyond which he should never venture.

This isolated living is terminal.
Without a mate, the man is doomed to a solitary life.
A deep sleep is administered.
A rib is removed.
The rib is increased to full stature as a woman.

Simba is tempted by fate, and brings into the story his soul-mate to accompany him, to make his efforts meaningful. (*pinned ya!*)

....the intro of Chapter Two.

Oh! I know the next chapters, then... Simba travels alone and outcast into the void and at its end discovers friends he didn't know were possble. Death; ressurection; renewed spirit and a return to the Pride Lands.

 

[Thief]

Thief here...seriously folks.
A large number of people regard Genesis as the 'real' thing.

This line of thought is actually a critique of what Jews and Christians
hold as literal truth.

This will be easier for all if you might be inclined to sway your thinking to a more...pro or con approach.
Of course, any rebuttal is welcome, but a rebuttal should be aimed at supporting the literal narrative, or not.

My approach will be a simple...straight forward...what if we DO take it literally.

 

[Zardoz]

...
This line of thought is actually a critique of what Jews and Christians
hold as literal truth...

Literal on this topic needs some clarification.

If you ask if Man as an organism was created out of dust that is one thing, however if you ask if one individual Man, Adam, was created out of dust that's another thing entirely. Yes, this sounds confusing, if you want you can check out my thread over in my DIR forum on this very subject:

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/messianic-judaism/77771-creation-man.html

While there you may as well also check out my other Creation thread:

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/messianic-judaism/77231-understanding-creation.html

I only ask that you do not debate there, it's a DIR forum after all, discuss here.

 

[zenzero]

Friend katzpur,

Well, in spite of the fact that I don't believe in reincarnation, I really, really, really like that poem!

That is more about evolution which even islam rejects.

LOve & rgds

 

[Thief]

Thief here...Hey Zardoz...
I haven't read your reference yet... but I can see we may have the same line of thought.
Let's see if that's true.

On Day Six...Man was made. In that verse the word 'man' is not a singular item. It is a proper noun used by people of that time, to refer to all men as a whole...'mankind'. (homo sapiens was termed centuries later).
If the word 'mankind' had been used...we would not be having this discussion now.
Man was made..male and female..and turned loose on the earth...to multiply...and subdue it. There are no names...no restrictions...no law...no boundaries.

On Day Seven...nothing more is created. God rests.

Chapter Two, is actually Day Eight.
The book doesn't say so.
But it should not have been needed to say so. It's obvious.
The Six Days of Creation are done. Day Seven...done.
What happens in Chapter Two is a separate event altogether.

Apparently...(and yes I can do this)...God is not yet...satisfied.
So He takes a man...which He made out of dust...and places Him into ideal living conditions.
The Man develops well...more so than his wandering counterparts...but his situation is confined solitude.
So he is given anesthesia, and his rib is taken. That's surgery.
The rib is increased to full stature. That's cloning.
That the clone will be female, is done in process. Genetic engineering.
Adam was given his twin sister for a bride.
She looked like him....but not quite....no navel.

All of this is manipulation...not the creative process.
That Adam was made of dust...does not make him unique.
What makes him unique...he is the first chosen Son of God.
YOU are also made of dust.
From the moment of conception your mother ate for two.
Everything she ate, came up from the ground and became you.
Back to the ground you will go.

 

[Katzpur]

That is more about evolution which even islam rejects.

It doesn't sound like evolution to me, but that's beside the point. It's this line I loved:

I shall become what no mind ever conceived.

It ties in beautifully with my own theology.

 

[Free4all]

On Day Six...Man was made. In that verse the word 'man' is not a singular item. It is
On Day Seven...nothing more is created. God rests.

Chapter Two, is actually Day Eight.
The book doesn't say so.
But it should not have been needed to say so. It's obvious.
The Six Days of Creation are done. Day Seven...done.
What happens in Chapter Two is a separate event altogether.

On the seventh day, we find that the six times repeated expression "the evening and the morning" is omitted.
The seventh day is endless because it typifies the seventh millennial period (Rev. 20:1-6) which goes right out into eternity. As surely as the final "morning" begins with the Advent (Matt 13:43) the day cannot have an "evening and a morning" for that would imply another day to follow. But no other day follows! For eternity starts in Rev. 20, at verse 10(Matt 4:2, Matt. 13:43, Rev. 20:7, Rev. 21,22) Yet another reason that the PRE-millennial system of biblical interpretation is correct.

 

[Thief]

Thief here...if you would please...the topic is man made of dust.

The time constraints listed in Genesis can be discussed, but that discussion will not show if you think of Adam as a product of evolution...or an immediate effort made by hand.

That any man is made of dust...does not single him out...as unique.

 

[painted wolf]

Isn't it funny how some religions have no problem with man being made of dust... but then mock evolution by falsely claiming that it involved "lightning striking a mud puddle" ?

The irony... :jiggy:

wa:do

 

[OmarKhayyam]

I regard it as more ignorance. Irony suggest a knowledge they do not have and do not WISH to have.