Lost & Jaded - Looking For Advice

[Lehnah]

Hello folks,

I've not posted here in a while as I've become somewhat jaded with my spiritual life. It took me a long time to find the right path, which turned out to be paganism. I read as much as I could, I joined discussion forums (other than this one) and learnt everything available to me. However, about a year ago it just all became a bit, well, depressing.

I'm in Australia and there isn't a huge pagan movement here, although it exists. I jumped into the Aussie pagan scene to try and learn from other Aussie pagans but just found people who were trying to out do each others' paganism, where incredibly "fluffy" and, in some instances, down right horrible. I tried to join a local pagan group but when I had to cancel because I ended up being called in for work they said "well, maybe you should work different days." Just rude.

There is also PAN, the Pagan Association Network who try to promote and educate people about paganism here in Australia. They asked for feedback at one point while I was a member. One suggestion I made was there aren't any events for people who live outside of larger cities to go to. Their response as "well, there aren't as many pagans outside large cities, so we don't put the events on." Well, there might not be as many people but there still are people who WANT those events but can't revel 3 to 4 hours to Sydney or what have you. As an organisation they seem to completely ignore anyone outside of the major cities. Needless to say I didn't bother re-joining once my membership was up for renewal.

The problem was if I was to stay solitary, how would I learn? You need other people to learn, to hear about their experiences and what not, but my experience with the pagan community was nothing to write home about. I wondered if paganism was really for me seeing as the majority (but not all) the people I'd come across were less than friendly. For several months - actually most of this year - I've stopped practising anything pagan.

However, that inner call for spiritual expression started again. I found myself wanting to get back into practising paganism but I was held back by my previous negative experiences. I thought maybe I'd look at other paths but the closest thing I found was Spiritual Not Religious, but really everything that appealed to me was the same as paganism, but without the Gods. However, I DO believe in the Gods so I've come to the conclusion that I am very much Neo-Pagan as my beliefs are somewhat different to traditional paganism.

But still I wonder if I should continue. Without people to learn from how will I evolve as a pagan? I can worship the Gods and so forth on my own, but will that expand my knowledge? All the books I find seem to be 101-type learning books, nothing deeper.

I'm very confused and still having something of a spiritual crisis. I want that spiritual part to be in my life but my experiences with the people and organisations within it have soured it all somewhat. I'm not sure how to move forward.

Has anyone been in this position before and could give some advice, or just some advice in general?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Lehnah]

P.S. Just noticed there is a lot of discussion about Neopaganism VS Paganism on these forums. Just wanted to clarify that I've always felt "Neopaganism" to be someone who identifies as pagan but does not necessarily practice all , if any, of the traditional pagan tapping. For example, I don't cast a circle when I call to the Gods.

Also, I have always identified as Celtic pagan/neopagan. My family's heritage is Scottish Celt and our family can be traced back to before the time of William Wallace and possibly further (not 100% sure yet, still researching). So, in a way, paganism is in my blood. ^_^

 

[NobodyYouKnow]

I am sorry to read of your plight. Yes, there aren't many Pagan resources in Sydney, but I am sure you may have heard about 'Pagans In The Pub' - you could try there. Also, the Theosophical Society has a lot of good reading material about this. In addition, take yourself off to Bundanoon for Brigadoon next year. That's always a very good eye-opener. All the best.

 

[Quintessence]

One thing I would keep in mind is that it isn't reasonable to expect an organization to revolve around you and your life. This applies to any organization, really, not just Neopagan ones. I completely sympathize with organizations like PAN that choose not to run events in certain locations for logistical and financial reasons. Running major events is a big effort, and it's not free; there are very few (if any) Neopagan organizations that have the financial flexibility to afford a loss if they organize at a location where there are not going to be enough attendees to make up for their costs. I also sympathize with any group that wants to consistently meet on a particular day and not change its schedule because of one or two people. Hopefully they routinely take polls to determine if that day is the best for the majority of people interested - I would take polls like that a couple times a year when I was running a discussion group - but no matter what day you pick, some people are inevitably going to be left out. There needs to be give and take, ya know?

All that aside, I also definitely sympathize with the desire to participate in local group activities but not having an outlet. I've had that outlet in the past, but I don't right now and it can often feel like there's something missing. Community is an important part of most religions, but given the scattered nature of our demographics, much of our community ends up online. I will note, however, that working with a community really isn't necessary for deepening one's personal religious path. Although I've been part of community groups - both online and in person - such groups have always been a supplement, not the driver of the evolution of my path. I was never one of those people who had much interest in joining a coven or a grove to learn that group's way of doing things to the letter. I wanted to build my own theology and build my own religion, and that meant doing the majority of the work myself.

On that front, there are two things that would serve you well in forging on your own: strong research skills and strong foundational skills. By strong research skills, I don't mean "google it," I mean really knowing where to find information relevant to what you are interested in. When I was starting off, I never limited myself to what was in the "New Age" section of the bookstore because I immediately recognized they are often poor sources. You need to consult primary sources and materials written by subject specialists or experts. This often requires a visit to an academic library, but at a bare minimum, you should be looking outside of the 133's in your public library and in other sections that pertain directly to the subject you're researching (i.e., the 292's for mythology, 398's for folktales, 550's for earth sciences, 635's for gardening). I have a more extensive primer on evaluating sources of information and researching for a workshop I did once - if I can still dig it up on my hard drive I can post it up here. All that aside, do take advantage of the online community, bearing in mind that much of it is coming from average people that don't have much subject expertise.

By foundational skills, I mean some really basic "witchy" skills that just about everybody uses routinely in their paths because they have multiple applications. What people regard as foundational skills will vary, but I include: meditation, journeywork, and energy work. Sometimes also divination, but it is best to know the first three before doing divination. These are all things you can learn on your own, but some would find guidance from a group useful. For meditation in particular, you will be able to find non-Neopagan groups to draw from. I suggest checking out several, because my experience with meditation groups was different for each group. Also try networking with the New Age community and general occult communities; they're a different stripe, but we often share common practices and can learn from each other.

The last suggestion I have is to see if you can find a Unitarian Universalist fellowship. Each fellowship is different, but they are excellent at assisting people in following their own paths because they're non-creedal. I've been an on-and-off member of various fellowships, and the resources and community they provide is great. Many have meditation circles, some have nature-based groups, women's spirituality groups, environmentalist groups, etc. And given they have a physical location, they've got more flexibility to adjust to your time schedule; any time the building is open, you can pop in and read something in their library or chat with the minister. I wish we had more places like this in our own Neopagan community, but unfortunately there is significant opposition to us having physical buildings, both from our own members and from outsiders. I'm hoping to see that change in my lifetime so people have a place to go.

 

[Lehnah]

Yes, there aren't many Pagan resources in Sydney, but I am sure you may have heard about 'Pagans In The Pub' - you could try there.

I don't mean to be rude, but did you read my post. I'm NOT in Sydney. I'm about 3.5 hours drive from there.

One thing I would keep in mind is that it isn't reasonable to expect an organization to revolve around you and your life.

Well, yes, I understand that and I'm not suggesting they should. However, the blatant disregard and palming-off or people who aren't in major cities is quite rude, IMO. Same with the local group, as if I should DARE to work on the day they met.

I've not "googled it" for info (great phrase) for some time. I have many pagan books on my shelf and have read some of the more researched ones, such as Adler's Drawing Down the Moon. I have the Kindle app on my tablet so I've been trying to find some good books via that as well.

Most of the "witchy" skill you mention I have done/ do. It's not really a problem of practice, but more of community, I guess. From almost the first day I entered it (had one REALLY good experience at a PAN Witches' Night) I've felt very much an outsider. It feels like the Australian pagan community is incredibly cliquey and somewhat unwelcoming of newcomers. This may be just because I've happened to have experiences that I've not found pleasant. That isn't to say I don't know nice/ pleasant pagans. I do, but the movers and shakers of the community - PAN and the woman that ran that local group - seem unpleasant.

 

[NobodyYouKnow]

I don't mean to be rude, but did you read my post. I'm NOT in Sydney. I'm about 3.5 hours drive from there.

I am very sorry, I must not have read your post thoroughly.

I used to live in Goulburn, about 2 hrs drive from Sydney, and still managed to get into Sydney for events and such, but 3.5 hours is a bit far to travel...still, it's a bit much to expect such services to exist in a country town or remote area.

In regards to everything else, Quintessence has also provided some very nice advice, I would go with that.

I'm sorry if I cannot help you out more, I am a Hindu now (and there's not much here for Shaiva Hindus either - although I now live in Sydney, and there's a temple nearby)...

There aren't many Aussie Pagans on here anyway and I was replying to your thread rather than seeing it left to rot. All the best with it anyway. Again, I apologise.

 

[Lehnah]

still, it's a bit much to expect such services to exist in a country town or remote area.

See, I completely disagree with that. I don't think people should be left-out just because of where they live. PAN knows there are people in rural (and rural doesn't equal remote. I live just outside of Newcastle, it's not exactly a small place) areas that are interested in such events. Even ONE a year would be great. I know plenty of other similar groups (although not pagan) who do just that.

 

[NobodyYouKnow]

See, I completely disagree with that. I don't think people should be left-out just because of where they live. PAN knows there are people in rural (and rural doesn't equal remote. I live just outside of Newcastle, it's not exactly a small place) areas that are interested in such events. Even ONE a year would be great. I know plenty of other similar groups (although not pagan) who do just that.

We both know know that Australia is such a vast and sparsely populated place outside major cities and towns - like Morisset...

I don't know what you expect an organisation to do to cater to your individual requirements.

I realise you aren't being rude, but you do come off sounding like a 'no, that won't won't work' kind of person...I was only trying to help, but I see I have hindered more than helping, so I shall leave it for others to reply - I should have left it alone at the outset.

I hope others can provide you with the answers you are looking for.

:bb:

 

[Quintessence]

Well, yes, I understand that and I'm not suggesting they should. However, the blatant disregard and palming-off or people who aren't in major cities is quite rude, IMO. Same with the local group, as if I should DARE to work on the day they met.

I wasn't there, so I can't say how rude they were or weren't being because of your rural status, but if they were, that isn't cool. Some groups have an intrinsic stance of being open and welcoming, but others don't. I don't know which category these groups fall into either; it could be you caught them on a rough day or they didn't understand that this is a sensitive or important issue to you. If you live in a place with a community, you can take it for granted and not understand the challenges of finding one if you're far away from others. But this is just me giving people the benefit of the doubt instead of assuming they're all jerks; it could be they're all jerks, though. >_>;

There's always the possibility of starting your own discussion/events group. Or maybe if you live on a farmstead, invite those city folks to experience the "real" pagan lifestyle (we all remember the etymology of the word 'pagan' right? In some respects you've got more claim to it than us city slickers.... lulz). I'd think they'd relish the chance to host an event out in the wilds; most events that happen around where I live are at nature preserves. Granted they're not three and a half hours from a major metro area (there is no such thing in my state), but still. Go do the nature-based thing and commune with the land spirits, silly city Pagans! You could probably teach them a thing or two...

 

[Fireside_Hindu]

There's always the possibility of starting your own discussion/events group.

I second this. If there's no path, make your own!:yes: You don't have to be an expert yet, it can simply be a call out to get together at first. Sometimes just know you have a community is enough to make you feel more connected. And sometimes you won't know there is a community unless you actually see it gathered in a room. So why not post flyers or - Do they do a meetup.com thing in Australia? If not, start a Facebook Page.

Best of luck! And hang in there.

:camp: