Lets contemplate the crucifiction

[Cobol]

Have you ever thought about how bizarre the crucifixion story is? Imagine the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of the universe sitting on his magnificent throne in heaven. He looks down onto earth and says to himself:

• 
  Those evil humans down on earth. I hate what they are doing. All this sin...
  Since I am all-knowing I know exactly what the humans are doing and I understand exactly why they commit each sin. Since I created the humans in my own image and personally programmed human nature into their brains, I am the direct author of all of this sin. The instant I created them I knew exactly what would happen with every single human for all eternity. I am perfect, I know exactly what I am doing. But ignore all that. I hate all these people doing exactly what I perfectly designed them to do and knew they would do from the moment I created them. I HATE IT! I tried killing all the humans and animals once in the flood. That certainly did not fix the problem.
  
  So here's what I am going to do. I will artificially inseminate a virgin. She will give birth to an incarnated version of me. The humans will eventually crucify and kill the incarnated me as a sacrifice to me. That, finally, will make me happy. Yes, sending myself down and having the humans crucify me.

How much sense does this make?

 

[shmogie]

Have you ever thought about how bizarre the crucifixion story is? Imagine the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of the universe sitting on his magnificent throne in heaven. He looks down onto earth and says to himself:

• 
  Those evil humans down on earth. I hate what they are doing. All this sin...
  Since I am all-knowing I know exactly what the humans are doing and I understand exactly why they commit each sin. Since I created the humans in my own image and personally programmed human nature into their brains, I am the direct author of all of this sin. The instant I created them I knew exactly what would happen with every single human for all eternity. I am perfect, I know exactly what I am doing. But ignore all that. I hate all these people doing exactly what I perfectly designed them to do and knew they would do from the moment I created them. I HATE IT! I tried killing all the humans and animals once in the flood. That certainly did not fix the problem.
  
  So here's what I am going to do. I will artificially inseminate a virgin. She will give birth to an incarnated version of me. The humans will eventually crucify and kill the incarnated me as a sacrifice to me. That, finally, will make me happy. Yes, sending myself down and having the humans crucify me.

How much sense does this make?

It makes no sense, like most of your ineffectual tirades. If you had any true knowledge, I am afraid you would be dangerous. As it is you are just funny.

 

[Stevicus]

How much sense does this make?

I never could make much sense out of it either. And why make an instrument of execution the primary symbol of worship? The Romans were pretty bizarre anyway, but crucifixion as a form of capital punishment takes the cake. If Jesus had shown up at another time and place, we might see a gallows or an electric chair on the altar of every church.

 

[SethZaddik]

Have you ever thought about how bizarre the crucifixion story is? Imagine the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of the universe sitting on his magnificent throne in heaven. He looks down onto earth and says to himself:

• 
  Those evil humans down on earth. I hate what they are doing. All this sin...
  Since I am all-knowing I know exactly what the humans are doing and I understand exactly why they commit each sin. Since I created the humans in my own image and personally programmed human nature into their brains, I am the direct author of all of this sin. The instant I created them I knew exactly what would happen with every single human for all eternity. I am perfect, I know exactly what I am doing. But ignore all that. I hate all these people doing exactly what I perfectly designed them to do and knew they would do from the moment I created them. I HATE IT! I tried killing all the humans and animals once in the flood. That certainly did not fix the problem.
  
  So here's what I am going to do. I will artificially inseminate a virgin. She will give birth to an incarnated version of me. The humans will eventually crucify and kill the incarnated me as a sacrifice to me. That, finally, will make me happy. Yes, sending myself down and having the humans crucify me.

How much sense does this make?

The dying and ressurecting demigod myth is as old as Osiris and Tammuz/Dumu-zi.

Tammuz means "Twin Born" and was lover of Isis, who, (some versions of E. of Gilgamesh) also descended into "hell" or the underworld like it is said Jesus (p) did.

Tammuz is also the reason Judah Thomas is called the twin, Tammus or Thomas are definitely descended from the word/god Tammus, it is even the month of Gemini (I think).

Now if Judah Thomas the Apostle and brother of Jesus (p) is called the twin, but never said to BE anyone's twin, what is the point.

Ancient authors borrowed from even more ancient myths to create the death and ressurection story of Jesus (p), and they could probably not resist leaving a clue as is done many times in the Bible.

"Weeping for Tammuz" is condemned in the OT because Tammuz is a foreign idol, but Hebrew women do it anyway.

They also weep for "the twin" of Tammuz in the Gospels, Jesus (p).

Likewise, Jesus is said to have ressurected and descended to hell where Tammuz was when Ishtar went to rescue him.

Tammuz is the source of the traditions of Christmas also, even the date, the birthday and ressurection of all sun gods were at where Christmas and Easter are now.

 

[Lorgar-Aurelian]

It makes no sense, like most of your ineffectual tirades. If you had any true knowledge, I am afraid you would be dangerous. As it is you are just funny.

did anyone notice he didn't actually refute what was said?

 

[Deeje]

Have you ever thought about how bizarre the crucifixion story is? Imagine the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of the universe sitting on his magnificent throne in heaven. He looks down onto earth and says to himself:

You're not only a mind reader but you can read the mind of God....how amazing!

• 
  Those evil humans down on earth. I hate what they are doing. All this sin...
  Since I am all-knowing I know exactly what the humans are doing and I understand exactly why they commit each sin. Since I created the humans in my own image and personally programmed human nature into their brains, I am the direct author of all of this sin. The instant I created them I knew exactly what would happen with every single human for all eternity. I am perfect, I know exactly what I am doing. But ignore all that. I hate all these people doing exactly what I perfectly designed them to do and knew they would do from the moment I created them. I HATE IT! I tried killing all the humans and animals once in the flood. That certainly did not fix the problem.

If that is your take on Genesis, then no wonder you don't get it.
Did you ever hear the saying "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing"? Can I just state here that what you have said betrays not even a little knowledge and yet you judge.

• 
  So here's what I am going to do. I will artificially inseminate a virgin. She will give birth to an incarnated version of me. The humans will eventually crucify and kill the incarnated me as a sacrifice to me. That, finally, will make me happy. Yes, sending myself down and having the humans crucify me.

How much sense does this make?

That makes no sense at all.....because none of it is true. It is the musing of a mind alienated from God and twisting scripture to make it appear as if the Creator is inferior to antitheists. I think he just might be laughing at this twisted bit of nonsense as much as I am.

Is there any point in correcting you?

 

[SethZaddik]

You're not only a mind reader but you can read the mind of God....how amazing!

If that is your take on Genesis, then no wonder you don't get it.
Did you ever hear the saying "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing"? Can I just state here that what you have said betrays not even a little knowledge and yet you judge.



That makes no sense at all.....because none of it is true. It is the musing of a mind alienated from God and twisting scripture to make it appear as if the Creator is inferior to antitheists. I think he just might be laughing at this twisted bit of nonsense as much as I am.

Is there any point in correcting you?

People who run around criticising others for asking rational questions, claiming they don't understand while having previously remarked against the same person for trying to be a mind reader don't come across as ones who understand anything, like that this is a good thread, this person didn't display anything that leads to a logical conclusion that comprehension is at all an issue.

I think you were just made to feel something you didn't like and wanted ill thought out payback, but that is just a guess.

What is not a guess is you are not impressive whatsoever and just made yourself look ridiculous.

 

[SethZaddik]

You're not only a mind reader but you can read the mind of God....how amazing!

If that is your take on Genesis, then no wonder you don't get it.
Did you ever hear the saying "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing"? Can I just state here that what you have said betrays not even a little knowledge and yet you judge.



That makes no sense at all.....because none of it is true. It is the musing of a mind alienated from God and twisting scripture to make it appear as if the Creator is inferior to antitheists. I think he just might be laughing at this twisted bit of nonsense as much as I am.

Is there any point in correcting you?

I bet you can't accurately correct a thing he said.

 

[SethZaddik]

It makes no sense, like most of your ineffectual tirades. If you had any true knowledge, I am afraid you would be dangerous. As it is you are just funny.

My, sensitive huh?

Why make it personal? Why insult this person?

It doesn't make you anything. Good at least, anything good.

 

[Cobol]

It makes no sense, like most of your ineffectual tirades. If you had any true knowledge, I am afraid you would be dangerous. As it is you are just funny.

I'm actually dead serious, and your just upset because of the absurdity of the story, and of course, the resurrection. If Jesus died, there’s no miraculous resurrection, and if there’s a resurrection, there’s no sacrifice through death. Miracle or sacrifice—you can’t have it both ways. The gospels don’t say that he died for our sins but that he had a rough couple of days for our sins.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Have you ever thought about how bizarre the crucifixion story is? Imagine the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of the universe sitting on his magnificent throne in heaven. He looks down onto earth and says to himself:

• Those evil humans down on earth. I hate what they are doing. All this sin...
  Since I am all-knowing I know exactly what the humans are doing and I understand exactly why they commit each sin. Since I created the humans in my own image and personally programmed human nature into their brains, I am the direct author of all of this sin. The instant I created them I knew exactly what would happen with every single human for all eternity. I am perfect, I know exactly what I am doing. But ignore all that. I hate all these people doing exactly what I perfectly designed them to do and knew they would do from the moment I created them. I HATE IT! I tried killing all the humans and animals once in the flood. That certainly did not fix the problem.
  So here's what I am going to do. I will artificially inseminate a virgin. She will give birth to an incarnated version of me. The humans will eventually crucify and kill the incarnated me as a sacrifice to me. That, finally, will make me happy. Yes, sending myself down and having the humans crucify me.

In the first place, where are the verses or passages to back up what is said ^ above ^.

Satan and the rest of the angels were created sinless.
Adam and Eve were created sinless.
To me, they were drawn out by their own wrong desires - James 1:13-15

God's main attributes or qualities are: love, justice, mercy, and wisdom.
So, we can all display those qualities to varying degrees.

Unlike us, Satan, Adam and Eve were perfect in the sense they could only sin on purpose, Not by mistake.
God forces No one to obey Him. So, by gifting us to be free-will persons, then we (Not God) chooses to obey or Not obey. Disobedience leads to death as Adam returned to dust - Genesis 3:19

Since we can Not resurrect oneself or another we need someone who can do that for us.
According to Scripture, Jesus can and will - Revelation 1:18
Jesus can because humanly perfect Jesus remained faithful to his God until his death.
God did Not send Himself to Earth. God sent the already existing heavenly Jesus to Earth.
Jesus is the beginning of the heavenly creation by God according to Revelation 3:14 B
God sent His heavenly Son (Not Himself) to Earth to undo the damage Satan and Adam brought upon us.

Noah and family survived the Flood by obeying God.
The Earth was filled with violence according to Genesis 6:11
So, if God had Not taken the Flood action the wicked would have killed off all the righteous ones, and we simply would Not be here today.[/quote][/QUOTE]

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Have you ever thought about how bizarre the crucifixion story is? Imagine the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of the universe sitting on his magnificent throne in heaven. He looks down onto earth and says to himself:

• 
  Those evil humans down on earth. I hate what they are doing. All this sin...
  Since I am all-knowing I know exactly what the humans are doing and I understand exactly why they commit each sin. Since I created the humans in my own image and personally programmed human nature into their brains, I am the direct author of all of this sin. The instant I created them I knew exactly what would happen with every single human for all eternity. I am perfect, I know exactly what I am doing. But ignore all that. I hate all these people doing exactly what I perfectly designed them to do and knew they would do from the moment I created them. I HATE IT! I tried killing all the humans and animals once in the flood. That certainly did not fix the problem.
  
  So here's what I am going to do. I will artificially inseminate a virgin. She will give birth to an incarnated version of me. The humans will eventually crucify and kill the incarnated me as a sacrifice to me. That, finally, will make me happy. Yes, sending myself down and having the humans crucify me.

How much sense does this make?

It doesn't make sense. I would have phrased it differently as not to insult anyone who believes in it.

I honestly don't understand why a god would create humans with whom he knows everything about, create "free will" though an ultimatum to believe in him, watch sinners sin after trying to resolve the issue by the flood, make himself human to come down to teach others (as human he can be among sin), let people kill his flesh, so others can have confidence they will have eternal life in the father.

It doesn't make sense but why does it bother you?

 

[Cobol]

It doesn't make sense but why does it bother you?

I don't see how any grown adult can believe such nonsense.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I don't see how any grown adult can believe such nonsense.

To simplify it, it means Christians want to change their lives to new.

They repent and "crucify" their sins (misdeeds/transgressions) on the cross "carry their cross" just as jesus (and in jesus and through jesus)

Live the life jesus lived. After christians repent, they have confidence and reassurance they will be resurrected just as christ to be with the father.

It's not a "crucifixion" story. It's' sacrificial story. Letting someone else take your burdens so you can be lifted spiritually and commune with god.

Your post is like Christians posts in concept, basically. They quote scripture upon scripture but to actually understand what jesus actually taught you'd have to understand what jesus actually did. To understand and experience that, it's logical. Whether it makes sense is a judgement call on the person. But I understand getting rid of the old to start a new life.

Layman's terms.

Try to see beyond the words and find the meaning. Nod your disagreement and move on.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I'm actually dead serious, and your just upset because of the absurdity of the story, and of course, the resurrection. If Jesus died, there’s no miraculous resurrection, and if there’s a resurrection, there’s no sacrifice through death. Miracle or sacrifice—you can’t have it both ways. The gospels don’t say that he died for our sins but that he had a rough couple of days for our sins.

There is No gospel verse saying Jesus died for our sins, but as John 1:29 wrote that Jesus takes away the sin of the world. The world of mankind being sinners in that No matter how hard we try we can't stop sinning by mistake.
Gospel writer John also wrote 1 John 3:5 for Jesus to take away our sins.
Thus being imperfect we can Not resurrect oneself or another so we need someone who can resurrect us.
According to Scripture, to me, Jesus can and will because sinless Jesus died a faithful death - Revelation 1:18
Satan challenges all of us at Job 2:4-5 that to touch our ' flesh ' ( loose physical health ) and we would Not serve God.
Both Job and Jesus proved Satan a liar and so can we.

 

[idav]

Have you ever thought about how bizarre the crucifixion story is? Imagine the all-powerful, all-knowing creator of the universe sitting on his magnificent throne in heaven. He looks down onto earth and says to himself:

• 
  Those evil humans down on earth. I hate what they are doing. All this sin...
  Since I am all-knowing I know exactly what the humans are doing and I understand exactly why they commit each sin. Since I created the humans in my own image and personally programmed human nature into their brains, I am the direct author of all of this sin. The instant I created them I knew exactly what would happen with every single human for all eternity. I am perfect, I know exactly what I am doing. But ignore all that. I hate all these people doing exactly what I perfectly designed them to do and knew they would do from the moment I created them. I HATE IT! I tried killing all the humans and animals once in the flood. That certainly did not fix the problem.
  
  So here's what I am going to do. I will artificially inseminate a virgin. She will give birth to an incarnated version of me. The humans will eventually crucify and kill the incarnated me as a sacrifice to me. That, finally, will make me happy. Yes, sending myself down and having the humans crucify me.

How much sense does this make?

In the context of the entire bible it makes more sense cause thats basically what the old testament says would happen after humans cannot seem to stick to gods covenants. Of course the God of the Old Testament did seem to want its people doing sacrifices, some sort of thing for blood. Christianity taking it further to mean God himself sacrificing himself doesn't make as much sense, Jesus never really said he was God but did hint of a profound connection with the father. To me the forgiveness came from Jesus asking the father to forgive them for sacrficing your son, OT God would have just turned the sun black and that would been all she wrote, it doesn't appear to me that the forgiveness is coming from the father but people are merely finding favor through Christ.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Likewise, Jesus is said to have ressurected and descended to hell where Tammuz was when Ishtar went to rescue him.
Tammuz is the source of the traditions of Christmas also, even the date, the birthday and ressurection of all sun gods were at where Christmas and Easter are now.

According to Scripture, the day Jesus died (Not the day God resurrected Jesus) the dead Jesus descended to hell.
Not to some non-biblical hell but the Bible's hell which is the grave for the sleeping dead - Acts of the Apostles 2:27
Jesus did Not resurrect himself, rather his God resurrected him - Acts of the Apostles 3:15; Ephesians 1:20

Jesus taught from the old Hebrew Scriptures:
Both teach the dead are in an unconscious sleep-like state:
- John 11:11-14; Psalms 115:17; Psalms 146:4; Daniel 12:2; Daniel 12:13; Ecclesiastes 9:5
So, while dead in biblical hell (grave) Jesus knew nothing but sleep.
Just as we are Not aware of the passing of time while asleep, the dead know nothing.

I think Tammuz might be the non-biblical source for the " T " with a lowered cross bar.
There is Nothing in Scripture to indicate that the pole or post Jesus died on had a cross bar.
The Romans often did mass executions. To fashion a cross bar would have been a lot of un-necessary work.
Whereas the pagans often wore a " T " in honor of Tammuz and fused that symbol into a so-called Christianity.

The only date Jesus instructed to remember was the day of his death - Luke 22:19 - Not resurrection.
That death day would be on the Jewish calendar month of Nisan the 14th day.
So, as an anniversary does Not always fall on a Friday, then the day of Jesus' death would Not always come on a Friday. That means the anniversary day of God resurrecting Jesus would Not always fall on a Sunday.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I never could make much sense out of it either. And why make an instrument of execution the primary symbol of worship? The Romans were pretty bizarre anyway, but crucifixion as a form of capital punishment takes the cake. If Jesus had shown up at another time and place, we might see a gallows or an electric chair on the altar of every church.

First of all, to me, it is important to recall that Jesus said MANY would come ' in his name ' but prove false.
Genuine ' wheat ' Christians would grow together with the fake ' weed/tares ' Christians.

Yes, why would anyone make an instrument of execution the primary symbol of worship!
Who would fashion a miniature of the gun used to shoot a loved one, or the gun used to shoot Pres. Kennedy.
Who would paint a picture of it and hang it on the wall.
Who would kiss a representation of such a gun, yet people will kiss a cross.

The Romans often had mass executions. So, the idea of fashioning a cross beam or cross bar seems wrong.
They would have simply used an upright pole or stake with No cross bar because to add such a cross beam or bar would have been a lot of un-necessary work especially without modern-day tools.

For ' wheat ' Christians as 2 Corinthians 5:7 says that Christians walk by faith Not by sight. (Not by sighted objects )

 

[Deeje]

People who run around criticising others for asking rational questions, claiming they don't understand while having previously remarked against the same person for trying to be a mind reader don't come across as ones who understand anything, like that this is a good thread, this person didn't display anything that leads to a logical conclusion that comprehension is at all an issue.

It was the way it was worded, not the questions themselves. No one minds answering sincere inquiries. But to hold something up to ridicule whilst expecting believers to answer nicely is not reasonable.

I think you were just made to feel something you didn't like and wanted ill thought out payback, but that is just a guess.

What is not a guess is you are not impressive whatsoever and just made yourself look ridiculous.

Do you want answers or are you too looking for excuses to ditch a God who has been misrepresented to you?

I bet you can't accurately correct a thing he said.

Would it make any difference to you?

The way he worded the OP was more like an attack not an inquiry. Attack elicits defense.

Do you really want to know the truth....or are you content with "a little knowledge" like the OP, leading to all the wrong conclusions?

Try asking nicely....you'll be amazed at the difference in the response.

 

[Kenny]

How much sense does this make?

None whatsoever!!!

It's the fallacy in your foundational statement that makes it completely senseless.