Know Thy Self?

[Mr.Advocate]

Know thy self. A mantra that we’ve all heard numerous times, but is self knowledge possible?

Historically philosophy has relied upon introspection to provide an answer. From Thomas Aquinas to Decartes the argument for the existence of the mind has generally followed the following formula.

“To doubt that I have a mind requires me to engage in doubting, and doubting is a mental activity. Therefore, in order to doubt that I have a mind, I must have a mind.”

While this is a sound argument, it does not tell us anything about what the mind is. There is little doubt that we experience something, but can we know with any certainty what it is that we are experiencing?

There are many moments in our lives where we realize that what we think about ourselves is false. Perhaps it’s the thought that we like spinach, until we put this disgusting weed into our mouths. Maybe we’ve even seen this in the behaviour of others, for example I was at a stage hypnotists’ show where he embedded a command into a girl to rub her belly whenever he used the word “silly”. After he used the word “silly” and the girl rubbed her belly he asked her why she did, and she replied that her belly was itchy. I’m sure we can all come up with examples of where we were wrong about our selves. Like the man and woman who think they hate each other, when anyone observing their behaviour can clearly see that they are in love.

The above are examples, as it is up to each of us to recognize this within our selves, but the fact remains that we can be wrong about ourselves. Where the problem arises is that we have no means of knowing which beliefs we hold about ourselves are true and which ones are false. The perceiver can not perceive itself. Therefore, if confident beliefs about your self can sometimes be wrong, and we have no means of knowing which beliefs about ourselves are right and which are wrong, we do not know ourselves.

Ouspensky provided a very interesting idea in “The Fourth Way” and “In Search of the Miraculous”. He separated self into personality and essence. While essence is that which comes from within, personality is that which comes from without. This “personality” fits quite well with behaviourism, in that a person responds to stimuli in a way that either increases or decreases certain behaviour and beliefs. For example, Joe tells a joke and gets a good laugh from his audience who tells Joe that he is funny. All of a sudden Joe begins to think of himself as a funny fellow. In truth Joe may be unable to detect sarcasm, but he now considers himself to be funny. It isn’t until Joe repeats his joke to a different audience and gets slapped upside the head, that Joe begins to question whether he is really funny or not.

Can we then make the argument that it is the essence of our selves through which we come to know the truth? Let’s toss Ouspensky aside and introduce Crowley who wrote in the Book of Lies:

Mind is a disease of semen.
All that a man is or may be is hidden therein.
Bodily functions are parts of the machine; silent,
Unless in dis-ease.
But mind, never at ease, creaketh “I”.
This I persisteth not, posteth not through generations,
Changeth momently, finally is dead.
Therefore is man only himself when lost to himself
in The Charioting.


Now, for those of you who are unfamiliar with Crowley, I’ll help you out by explaining that “The Charioting”, is orgasm. That moment when you spunk one out, and you are lost to your self. This is the Essence known to the Adept. Essence is where mind is not.

So I ask again, is self knowledge possible?

 

[zenzero]

Friend Mr. Advocate,
Personal experience is that it is not about knowing but about unknowing whatever is known.
Yes, the mind itself is the paradox as the door way to no-mind is the mind itself.
The mind knows because it thinks and when the is still there are no thoughts and unknowing happens.
In that state the SELF is no more what is IS.
Love & rgds

 

[Mr.Advocate]

While I agree with your response, I must ask why you’ve responded.

What you have posted is your own knowledge. So if your intent is to un-know, is there something that you are trying to work out within that causes you to post what you know?

 

[Darkwater]

This is a GREAT question & the path to all learning.

It does not matter if you come from a long,long,long line of emotional planks of wood(I am proof of this),everything has the inherent power to *become* greater within it's own image,be equal to a sum greater than it's individual parts.

ok,let's look at the *great* Beast,Crowley(spits)....A shambolic guy,from a shambolic era whose legacy is still with us today generating or attracting *eveil* according to it's design(another story)

Crowley says "as it is above,so it is below,as it is without so it is within" or something along those lines which is a good starting point for any person starting out.....it is a truth,just does not allign to a *greater truth*,although goes some way to elucidate this truth by,perhaps,getting you ready for the long,deep intrinsic stare into the vast within.

Who are you under the surface,what gives you *pleasure*(ahem),what causes you pain?what makes you tick?are you a good person?where have you ever gone*wrong*?is their anything you could have done to be *better*?

Love the Sig .........If anyone betters me then kill me,I accept all challengers....Do you wish that I eat them(any who respond to the challenge) whole,tail first(absorb them) or disentigrate them into tiny pieces into the void(annhiliate)?

Absorbtion is maybe best,annhiliation more fun. (all in love)

http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/image/0811/UndesignatedBubbleFC_kbqmh2546.jpg

Crowley's bubble.

 

[Darkwater]

well done Aquinas on presenting the patently obvious to the retards *in control* during his span.

There is everything that is you(say essence label) & everything that is not you(your universe).seek within.

"as it is within,so it is without"in perfect harmony.& project as such.

 

[Mr.Advocate]

“Who are you under the surface,what gives you *pleasure*(ahem),what causes you pain?what makes you tick?are you a good person?where have you ever gone*wrong*?is their anything you could have done to be *better*?”


There was a point in my life where I would have given the same response, until I posed it against time.

In the 1980’s a biologist was working with the isolated neurons of a sea snail. He chose this particular neuron to study because it is not only of a good size, but because it is nearly identical to a human neuron. Irregardless of what he was doing, there was an incident that eventually led to a huge break through in understanding human memory. Here is what happened.

A single living neuron was isolated. A probe capable of providing an electric shock was touched to the cell. The shock was applied, and the cell fired. This was repeated a few times when the biologist suddenly realized that there was a problem with his equipment. On the last attempt to shock the cell into firing, the electric current was not working, yet the cell fired anyway. So he isolated another cell, touched it with the probe and then shocked it, and it fired. He repeated the procedure, and on the third time simply touched the neuron with the probe without the shock, and sure enough the cell reacted. Not only had the single cell learned what came after the probe touched it, but it retained it in memory and acted upon it. Thus began what we now know as the cellular basis of memory.

While a single cell is capable of memory, a number of connected cells are capable of complex memories. But what does this mean to the philosopher? I’ll paraphrase a well known question of this illusive gent….

Mark buys a brand new Mustang, and drives the **** out of it. He loves his car, even giving it a nickname. He calls it Sally.

Over time he replaces Sally’s parts one by one, until eventually every piece of the Mustang has been replaced with a new part.

Along comes Bill who has been stock piling the parts that Mark has discarded. Bill is a car buff and decides to restore a Mustang from these very parts, eventually piecing together the entire car. He then attempts to register his Mustang, only to find that this car is already registered to Mark. He takes his case to court and asks: Which is the real Mustang Sally?

The human body replaces its own cells every 7 to 10 years. So let’s apply Bills question to your self. Are you the same person you were 10 years ago?

Introspectively, an approach that I find to be flawed, but none the less…

Let’s say that every time your family gets together over the holidays, a particular story about you comes up. It’s a silly story that we need not get into, but it’s one of those things that your family finds humour and sentiment with so they repeat it. One day you find yourself explaining this story to someone unfamiliar with the tale, but none the less you repeat it to a new audience. Is the story that you tell what actually happened or what you recall happening?

In other words, as one cell dies and the memory that it once held is connected in the recollection of a complex memory to a new cell, does the actual memory remain intact, or does the new cell fire in line with what it is being told to do?

Hell, let’s remove time all together and look only upon the now. Can I know what gives me pleasure when I am not now experiencing this pleasure? Can I rely upon my memories of past pleasures to define my self?

At this very moment, what do you “know” of your self? Can you smell it? Can you poke it? Is it a thing, or is it a process? Is it some ethereal soul, or something that is happening?

 

[blackout]

We are an "ever becoming"...
but as we enter into that process
aware, enlightened and inspired
conscious, sentient, and empowered
by from with in that sacred space
we come to Know Our Own Self
in every given moment of that Self "BEcoming".
(as both wave & particle)

We have say in the *matter*,
of who we are ever BEcoming.
We can "trump" our former "conditioning"
though this is a dedicated art
in and of itself.
And one that the Self must ACTively Choose.

Yet it is a MUST for "to thine own Self be true".

"to thine own Self be true"
is the natural progression of
"know ThySelf".

Both must be grabbed with total Zeal,
because quite frankly,
conditioning... BROAD"casting"...
is very powerful, and there is backlash
for laying it low,
in favor of your own PERSONAL vision.

 

[Darkwater]

“Who are you under the surface,what gives you *pleasure*(ahem),what causes you pain?what makes you tick?are you a good person?where have you ever gone*wrong*?is their anything you could have done to be *better*?”


There was a point in my life where I would have given the same response, until I posed it against time.

In the 1980’s a biologist was working with the isolated neurons of a sea snail. He chose this particular neuron to study because it is not only of a good size, but because it is nearly identical to a human neuron. Irregardless of what he was doing, there was an incident that eventually led to a huge break through in understanding human memory. Here is what happened.

A single living neuron was isolated. A probe capable of providing an electric shock was touched to the cell. The shock was applied, and the cell fired. This was repeated a few times when the biologist suddenly realized that there was a problem with his equipment. On the last attempt to shock the cell into firing, the electric current was not working, yet the cell fired anyway. So he isolated another cell, touched it with the probe and then shocked it, and it fired. He repeated the procedure, and on the third time simply touched the neuron with the probe without the shock, and sure enough the cell reacted. Not only had the single cell learned what came after the probe touched it, but it retained it in memory and acted upon it. Thus began what we now know as the cellular basis of memory.

While a single cell is capable of memory, a number of connected cells are capable of complex memories. But what does this mean to the philosopher? I’ll paraphrase a well known question of this illusive gent….

Mark buys a brand new Mustang, and drives the **** out of it. He loves his car, even giving it a nickname. He calls it Sally.

Over time he replaces Sally’s parts one by one, until eventually every piece of the Mustang has been replaced with a new part.

Along comes Bill who has been stock piling the parts that Mark has discarded. Bill is a car buff and decides to restore a Mustang from these very parts, eventually piecing together the entire car. He then attempts to register his Mustang, only to find that this car is already registered to Mark. He takes his case to court and asks: Which is the real Mustang Sally?

The human body replaces its own cells every 7 to 10 years. So let’s apply Bills question to your self. Are you the same person you were 10 years ago?

Introspectively, an approach that I find to be flawed, but none the less…

Let’s say that every time your family gets together over the holidays, a particular story about you comes up. It’s a silly story that we need not get into, but it’s one of those things that your family finds humour and sentiment with so they repeat it. One day you find yourself explaining this story to someone unfamiliar with the tale, but none the less you repeat it to a new audience. Is the story that you tell what actually happened or what you recall happening?

In other words, as one cell dies and the memory that it once held is connected in the recollection of a complex memory to a new cell, does the actual memory remain intact, or does the new cell fire in line with what it is being told to do?

Hell, let’s remove time all together and look only upon the now. Can I know what gives me pleasure when I am not now experiencing this pleasure? Can I rely upon my memories of past pleasures to define my self?

At this very moment, what do you “know” of your self? Can you smell it? Can you poke it? Is it a thing, or is it a process? Is it some ethereal soul, or something that is happening?

I love this analogy.....when I started out in Astral,I would get leg cramps flying to the sun & was scared of diving in when I finally reached it,having too much to lose on this plane as I would surely die........nevertheless I finally plucked up the courage & dived into the light.

In these very early days of travel(I would previously only *bask*) I used to get the weird experience of flying towards my higher power,only to find myself being sent in the opposite direction,with far more velocity than before & aided with some knowledge from somewhere.I was out again before I knew I was even in.This was explained to e as *bearclaw* astral & was actually a manouvre to be practiced & get good at,which I did.

As I progressed & began to notice things,suddenly the superfast speeds which took me to the sun seemed unbelievably slow,like watching a slug move towards something,turn very slowly in a wide arc back from where it was going,all unbelievably slow....

What did the slug say when it travelled on the back of the tortoise?

*Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee*

Back to your sea snails,nothing ever dies only resonates at a different level of energy which we cannot usually perceive except through GOD*label*(be the god-be your own team!)

Imho the snail would return to it's snail oversoul with the phantastic news of it's great *discovery* & try to relate it to the other snail oversoul who would maybe think it quite mad?

As I am connected to all parts of me which have moved on to another resonation,& hope to continue remanifesting eternal(in love)...I feel connected to the sea snail big time,I can relate entirely to his experience & feel gratitude that this feeling has been reciprocated back to sea-snail kind.

You have simply pierced the veil of pleasure,to reveal that pleasure is an illusion,all is love.

If you can identify this,accept this & love it you are well on the way to ecstatic self love(these 3 steps are also the *grieving process*,by the way-identify your loss fully & unequivocably(in love),accept this(in love) & love yourself(in love) )

Allign yourself with the universe so as all your neurons are firing perfectly to enable your spiritual body to perform in accordance with it's true nature according to your dna,in love.

Then don't talk about it as people will think you crazy,though it should be talked about,in great love.

You have got to start somewhere,when you finally listen to your *emotions*,*perceptions*,*intuitions*,*experience*...what your heart can perceive before your head can conceive & thousands of other labels.

Be greater in your own image.

 

[Mr.Advocate]

Greetings Ultraviolet,

I’m not sure that you understood what it was that I was pointing out.

The self is unknowable. The perceiver can not perceive itself.

What is said below the Abyss is nonsense, and what is said above it is only lies.
There is no becoming.

Allow me to explain: Time is a human construct. There is no future, though we can make attempts to predict the future, this does not denote knowledge of the future.

Memory is what we call the past, and memory is fallible. You can be no more sure that you know the past than you can know the future. There is only the now.

In the now, there is no becoming, there is only existence, and your illusions of becoming are based upon memory which you can not determine from dreams.

So can we “trump our conditioning”?

Will is a decision between two or more conflicting desires. In order for us to prove that will exists, we must be able to show that if we had chosen a different path then the one we did, that the results would be different. Can you do such a thing?

Can you prove that your choice was the act of an individual will, or the culmination of conditioned stimuli? If you can I’d be most exited to present it to the bulk of philosophical work which for thousands of years has been unable to prove the existence of will.

“Becoming” is a false school that presupposes that there is something inherently wrong or lowly of the human condition that must be corrected. This is the farthest possible approach from the left hand path that you could possibly get. The creative force that elevates man to god or beast exists in both the Magus and the lowliest of dullards on earth. It is not something that you become, it is something that you recognize, and in that does not change the vessel in which it already exists.

Indulge!

 

[stacey bo bacey]

Ok, I've only told one other person that I do this but whatever, it's not that big of a deal to me anymore.

Sometimes, whenever I just happen to be feeling weird and catch myself in the mirror, I will just look at myself. I mean stare. A lot of thoughts go through my mind at first, like: what am I looking at? How am I looking at myself? Look at my eyes, my eyes are looking at me. I am this, this thing staring back at me. How can I be this thing? How is this happening? What exactly is happening?

Usually at that point, after asking myself those questions over and over in my mind, my thoughts stop and I get tunnel vision. Everything except my face is a blur of white or gray. And I just stare at myself without thinking. I'll move my face closer to the mirror because if I move, I exist and the closer I move to the mirror, the closer I will be to...I don't know?

It takes some effort to snap out of it...it's like being in a dream and trying to wake up. You want to do it but it takes a push.

I am pretty weird. Whatever, I don't care! (And no, whenever I do this I am not on anything illegal).

 

[zenzero]

Friend stacey bo bacey,

For your information; that is a meditative technique where you have to look in the mirror till you find the mirror to be blank!

Love & rgds

 

[stacey bo bacey]

Friend stacey bo bacey,

For your information; that is a meditative technique where you have to look in the mirror till you find the mirror to be blank!

Love & rgds

What? No ****? Cool! At least there are other people out there doing the same!!

Thanks for the info.

 

[zenzero]

Friend Mr. Advocate,

While I agree with your response, I must ask why you’ve responded.

Please note that have stated

Personal experience is that it is not about knowing but about unknowing whatever is known.

The words for your information used is personal experience not personal knowledge.
If, however both appear same and not to make any sense then you know your signature line.

Love & rgds

 

[Darkwater]

Greetings Ultraviolet,

I’m not sure that you understood what it was that I was pointing out.

The self is unknowable. The perceiver can not perceive itself.

What is said below the Abyss is nonsense, and what is said above it is only lies.
There is no becoming.

Allow me to explain: Time is a human construct. There is no future, though we can make attempts to predict the future, this does not denote knowledge of the future.

Memory is what we call the past, and memory is fallible. You can be no more sure that you know the past than you can know the future. There is only the now.

In the now, there is no becoming, there is only existence, and your illusions of becoming are based upon memory which you can not determine from dreams.

So can we “trump our conditioning”?

Will is a decision between two or more conflicting desires. In order for us to prove that will exists, we must be able to show that if we had chosen a different path then the one we did, that the results would be different. Can you do such a thing?

Can you prove that your choice was the act of an individual will, or the culmination of conditioned stimuli? If you can I’d be most exited to present it to the bulk of philosophical work which for thousands of years has been unable to prove the existence of will.

“Becoming” is a false school that presupposes that there is something inherently wrong or lowly of the human condition that must be corrected. This is the farthest possible approach from the left hand path that you could possibly get. The creative force that elevates man to god or beast exists in both the Magus and the lowliest of dullards on earth. It is not something that you become, it is something that you recognize, and in that does not change the vessel in which it already exists.

Indulge!

Mr A,

Once you master the abyss,a Karmic excercise,you become fully aware of yourself & the Universe...your relationship to it and can begin to perceive others....FIRST YOU MUST CLIMB OUT,know thyself & seek out your entire line,your oversoul..

Forget about measuring the rotations of our wee rock around the sun.....duration is much more & the strands of time can be manipulated,perceived,recognised & adjusted.A *dam in* time may return,where it is they in the here & now trying to contact or be in touch with us before long.

Remote viewing by a group of experienced master's or a fully empowered & enlightened individual has went on forever.This is where future events can be predicted & the past revealed in *herstory*,opposed to 1 dimensional phoney invented *history* which does not stand up to the rigours of close scrutiny & examination of the facts & leads people to remain ignorant,which suits some purposes.

Many have successfully predicted the future & acted accordingly by spiritual methods.

You define becoming rather well,*overcoming* programming of peers,parents & religious groups or whatever by educating yourself properly in the AG(After Google)Age.Better answers,better questions,better information...is here for everyone & you shall be judged by what you can create,not that which you can destroy

Happy New Year anyway.

 

[Darkwater]

What? No ****? Cool! At least there are other people out there doing the same!!

Thanks for the info.

Eh,I've seen some of your photo's Stacey,you are very attractive..Some of the Shekinha Babes have piercing's,usually at the suggestion of a visitor to the temple...any idea why you got yours?have you any other's as well as the visible one?

I don't give over so easy as to begin to disappear,although my image in the mirror changes from time to time.

Great Love,

DW

 

[stacey bo bacey]

Eh,I've seen some of your photo's Stacey,you are very attractive..Some of the Shekinha Babes have piercing's,usually at the suggestion of a visitor to the temple...any idea why you got yours?have you any other's as well as the visible one?

I don't give over so easy as to begin to disappear,although my image in the mirror changes from time to time.

Great Love,

DW

Why I got my piercings? I dunno...I wonder if there is a subconscious reason! I usually get ones that I think will look bad ***.

I have 3 holes in each ear and I used to have my cartilage, neck and tongue pierced but those are all gone now.

 

[Darkwater]

Cool,any idea of the deity you are most attracted to/do attract?

I don't understand cartilidge?tongue is maybe understandable,Neck is scarey,says to me violence of some sort?..........you wild thing you.

I never question or judge the female of the temple,just wonder why they are never realised enough not to meet the deity on the level,they are all there purely to succumb in one way or another to a deity without asking any questions,as such never get past the foyer in order to progress...I assume they obtain power from interaction without question,taking instructions,a form of *happiness* just not the lasting kind(?).

I have only been to one Oversoul party,one Shekina Babe in particular I was wanting to combine,unify & unite herself(as I thought she should)....it was a dreadfully weepy affair,too much for me....her whole line took way more punishment than anyone ought to reasonably have.

They all drew strength from the *misery* of the ages,which was kinda explained to me.

Have you ever tried to link with your sub-conscious?if so,how are you doing?

All the best,

Andy

For the record she(the Shekina Babe) had always politely declined any suggestions of piercing's by visiting Pantheon members,or of those deity who had set themselves up in the foyer for whatever reason.She was answerable & bound only to one,the Shekinah.