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"Karen" or "Becky" are not sexist or racist nor are the equivalent to any racial pejoratives

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Epic Beard Man

Bearded Philosopher
According to Wikipedia:

"Karen is a pejorative term for a white woman seeming to be entitled or demanding beyond the scope of what is normal. The term also refers to memes depicting white women who use their privilege to demand they get their way." Opposite of that, the male version of the word "Ken" is used to signify the use of male white privilege that also goes beyond the behavioral scope of what is deemed to be normal.

Still on Wikipedia, the usages of the word Karen/Ken has been considered sexist which Hadley Freeman of The Guardian wrote that the usages of the meme had become less about describing behavior, than about controlling it and telling women to "shut up," (Freeman, 2020). Jennifer Weiner of the New York Times during the Covid-19 pandemic states that the influence of the meme had silenced her saying "she had had to balance her desire to complain about a nearby man coughing into the open air, hawking and spitting on the sidewalk, with her fear of being called a Karen (Weiner, 2020).

When it comes to racist connotations, many writers have speculated whether the term Karen is a racial or sexist term for white women. Writers have noted that in context, it highlights the significance of white privilege and the troubling history of white women weaponizing their victimhood. We can go no further than looking at two major examples: The story of Emmitt Till and Tulsa Oklahoma Black Wallstreet riots. Both cases where a white woman proclaimed that two young black men did something back then was inappropriate. One was accused of whistling at a white woman (Emmitt Till), the other states that a black man Dick Rowland, a shoeshiner, was accused of assaulting a 17-year-old white elevator operator.

At its core, the comical meme is not the equivalent to the N-word or any historical racial pejoratives that have inflicted physical, psychological, and even spiritual trauma that many people of color have faced. As I've mentioned before here as well as others, the majority of this society at large hate to look in the mirror to see the historical travesty their own privilege has wrought. I think what is more important is to acknowledge behavior and how simple solutions to simple problems have been disregarded for overexaggerated claims which cause the misuse of police resources and emergency services that can be used elsewhere. Calling the police because someone brings a grill to a park that restricts barbecuing does not require immediate police attention especially if the grill is not causing YOU or anyone else harm. Calling the police because you suspect someone is stealing does not warrant you to call the police especially if you aren't for certain there are no security services available and very much especially if you aren't completely certain that you saw them steal.

Because of the weaponization of white privilege, many young black men and other people of color have suffered and died at the hands of people using false accusations because they know society will believe someone of Caucasian descent as opposed to someone of color. Society for decades has conditioned some white women, unfortunately, to use their victimhood to their advantage to dispose of unwanted black men at the hands of a judicial system already causing social disparities. I'm even willing to say even feminism (1st, 2nd, and 3rd waves) have contributed to the weaponization of victimhood. When Kobe Bryant passed, one of the go-to things of his life was the allegation of sexual assault. Although it didn't go to trial it highlights a significant event in his life where he allegedly had sexually assaulted a youg white woman in his hotel room. How many black women, Hispanic women, Asian women, or other women of color have been sexually assaulted? It would appear when it comes to the crimes against women of color the world is silent, but when a white woman speaks of her victimhood the world, most specifically the western world listens and believes without investigation.

(Incoming sensitive remark)

There is a quantifiable history of white women in the United States who have falsely accused men, especially black men of sexual assault, rape, and any other heinous crime. I recall in my past when I was in middle school in Tucson Arizona, a young white girl accused me of touching her when in fact it was a goofy young man who was white (whose name I don't even remember because this was in '93) who was known to be playful and inappropriate. I watched the whole thing unfolded. She turned around and saw me. Mind you, I was 15 maybe 20 feet from her, but somehow my arm had the uncanny ability to stretch across the hall and grab her butt. She accused me, went to the principal and I was interrogated. Knowing that she lied and panicking because she crossed the threshold of fabricating a story, she asked her friends to lie for her. They did because she was popular and I was thus suspended and almost arrested. At the end of the school year, her friends apologized because they were scared but the damage was done. I was only lucky enough to be a 13-year-old to be accused in the '90s and not the '30s. The only question I have regarding the Karens of the world is where does it end?

Reference:

Freeman, Hadley (April 13, 2020). "The 'Karen' meme is everywhere – and it has become mired in sexism". The Guardian. London. Retrieved July 13, 2021

Weiner, Jennifer (April 14, 2020). "Opinion: The Seductive Appeal of Pandemic Shaming". The New York Times. ISSN 0362-4331. Retrieved July 13, 2021.

Wikipedia (n.d.): Karen (Slang). Retrieved 7/13/2021 from: Karen (slang) - Wikipedia



 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
Still on Wikipedia, the usages of the word Karen/Ken has been considered sexist which Hadley Freeman of The Guardian wrote that the usages of the meme had become less about describing behavior, than about controlling it and telling women to "shut up," (Freeman, 2020).
It does feel like that when you're called a Karen over requesting someone who isn't distanced or properly wearing a mask to back up.
 

Epic Beard Man

Bearded Philosopher
I'll probably mostly be nodding my head in agreement throughout this entire thread. Here in Illinois, well, I'd like to put it nicely, but... you will see Karens. If anyone doesn't believe me, go work Customer Service in Retail.

I've seen one have a meltdown at Subway because she wanted a roasted Turkey sandwich without the turkey and veggies. LOL. She called the cops on the poor kid because he refused to charge her for a piece of bread. The sheriff arrived, heard the story, and told her to shove it.
 

Earthtank

Active Member
According to Wikipedia:

"Karen is a pejorative term for a white woman seeming to be entitled or demanding beyond the scope of what is normal. The term also refers to memes depicting white women who use their privilege to demand they get their way." Opposite of that, the male version of the word "Ken" is used to signify the use of male white privilege that also goes beyond the behavioral scope of what is deemed to be normal.

Still on Wikipedia, the usages of the word Karen/Ken has been considered sexist which Hadley Freeman of The Guardian wrote that the usages of the meme had become less about describing behavior, than about controlling it and telling women to "shut up," (Freeman, 2020). Jennifer Weiner of the New York Times during the Covid-19 pandemic states that the influence of the meme had silenced her saying "she had had to balance her desire to complain about a nearby man coughing into the open air, hawking and spitting on the sidewalk, with her fear of being called a Karen (Weiner, 2020).

When it comes to racist connotations, many writers have speculated whether the term Karen is a racial or sexist term for white women. Writers have noted that in context, it highlights the significance of white privilege and the troubling history of white women weaponizing their victimhood. We can go no further than looking at two major examples: The story of Emmitt Till and Tulsa Oklahoma Black Wallstreet riots. Both cases where a white woman proclaimed that two young black men did something back then was inappropriate. One was accused of whistling at a white woman (Emmitt Till), the other states that a black man Dick Rowland, a shoeshiner, was accused of assaulting a 17-year-old white elevator operator.

At its core, the comical meme is not the equivalent to the N-word or any historical racial pejoratives that have inflicted physical, psychological, and even spiritual trauma that many people of color have faced. As I've mentioned before here as well as others, the majority of this society at large hate to look in the mirror to see the historical travesty their own privilege has wrought. I think what is more important is to acknowledge behavior and how simple solutions to simple problems have been disregarded for overexaggerated claims which cause the misuse of police resources and emergency services that can be used elsewhere. Calling the police because someone brings a grill to a park that restricts barbecuing does not require immediate police attention especially if the grill is not causing YOU or anyone else harm. Calling the police because you suspect someone is stealing does not warrant you to call the police especially if you aren't for certain there are no security services available and very much especially if you aren't completely certain that you saw them steal.

Because of the weaponization of white privilege, many young black men and other people of color have suffered and died at the hands of people using false accusations because they know society will believe someone of Caucasian descent as opposed to someone of color. Society for decades has conditioned some white women, unfortunately, to use their victimhood to their advantage to dispose of unwanted black men at the hands of a judicial system already causing social disparities. I'm even willing to say even feminism (1st, 2nd, and 3rd waves) have contributed to the weaponization of victimhood. When Kobe Bryant passed, one of the go-to things of his life was the allegation of sexual assault. Although it didn't go to trial it highlights a significant event in his life where he allegedly had sexually assaulted a youg white woman in his hotel room. How many black women, Hispanic women, Asian women, or other women of color have been sexually assaulted? It would appear when it comes to the crimes against women of color the world is silent, but when a white woman speaks of her victimhood the world, most specifically the western world listens and believes without investigation.

(Incoming sensitive remark)

There is a quantifiable history of white women in the United States who have falsely accused men, especially black men of sexual assault, rape, and any other heinous crime. I recall in my past when I was in middle school in Tucson Arizona, a young white girl accused me of touching her when in fact it was a goofy young man who was white (whose name I don't even remember because this was in '93) who was known to be playful and inappropriate. I watched the whole thing unfolded. She turned around and saw me. Mind you, I was 15 maybe 20 feet from her, but somehow my arm had the uncanny ability to stretch across the hall and grab her butt. She accused me, went to the principal and I was interrogated. Knowing that she lied and panicking because she crossed the threshold of fabricating a story, she asked her friends to lie for her. They did because she was popular and I was thus suspended and almost arrested. At the end of the school year, her friends apologized because they were scared but the damage was done. I was only lucky enough to be a 13-year-old to be accused in the '90s and not the '30s. The only question I have regarding the Karens of the world is where does it end?

Reference:

Freeman, Hadley (April 13, 2020). "The 'Karen' meme is everywhere – and it has become mired in sexism". The Guardian. London. Retrieved July 13, 2021

Weiner, Jennifer (April 14, 2020). "Opinion: The Seductive Appeal of Pandemic Shaming". The New York Times. ISSN 0362-4331. Retrieved July 13, 2021.

Wikipedia (n.d.): Karen (Slang). Retrieved 7/13/2021 from: Karen (slang) - Wikipedia



Actually the very first sentence of your post proves your title is wrong. "Karen" is actually racist. Not that I care one way or the other but, let's not act like it is not
 

PoetPhilosopher

Veteran Member
I've seen one have a meltdown at Subway because she wanted a roasted Turkey sandwich without the turkey and veggies. LOL. She called the cops on the poor kid because he refused to charge her for a piece of bread. The sheriff arrived, heard the story, and told her to shove it.

I've seen 400 pound women go into a bakery that's really popular in my area and request the bakery's very prized, but limited to a certain number each morning, Pumpkin muffins. They'll come in and order 4, but be told there's only 3 available, and they'll start yelling about how, like, there won't be enough Pumpkin muffins for them and their one or two kids.
 

Epic Beard Man

Bearded Philosopher
It does feel like that when you're called a Karen over requesting someone who isn't distanced or properly wearing a mask to back up.

I can understand the hesitation. Unfortunately, the social backlash is the result of abusing emergency services and making mountains out of molehills. The irony of it all is if I complain I'm the angry black man if the pitch or tone of my voice is slightly elevated.
 

Epic Beard Man

Bearded Philosopher
Actually the very first sentence of your post proves your title is wrong. "Karen" is actually racist. Not that I care one way or the other but, let's not act like it is not

Ok, prove it. You've postulated a claim you don't care about so care enough to substantiate your claim.
 

Earthtank

Active Member
I've seen 400 pound women go into a bakery that's really popular in my area and request the bakery's very prized, but limited to a certain number each morning, Pumpkin muffins. They'll come in and order 4, but be told there's only 3 available, and they'll start yelling about how, like, there won't be enough Pumpkin muffins for them and their one or two kids.

At the beginning of your post i thought you were going to be talking about this fat chick

 

Epic Beard Man

Bearded Philosopher
I've seen 400 pound women go into a bakery that's really popular in my area and request the bakery's very prized, but limited to a certain number each morning, Pumpkin muffins. They'll come in and order 4, but be told there's only 3 available, and they'll start yelling about how, like, there won't be enough Pumpkin muffins for them and their one or two kids.

400 pound with two kids? OMG how?
 

Epic Beard Man

Bearded Philosopher
Given that I have a couple of friends who are named "Karen", using that name pejoratively bugs the crap out of me.

I think it is more coincidental than intentional. I get it that those are your friends but what should bug you more is the historical truth that in this country, innocent people were falsely accused and died.
 

SomeRandom

Still learning to be wise
Staff member
Premium Member
According to Wikipedia:

"Karen is a pejorative term for a white woman seeming to be entitled or demanding beyond the scope of what is normal. The term also refers to memes depicting white women who use their privilege to demand they get their way." Opposite of that, the male version of the word "Ken" is used to signify the use of male white privilege that also goes beyond the behavioral scope of what is deemed to be normal.

Still on Wikipedia, the usages of the word Karen/Ken has been considered sexist which Hadley Freeman of The Guardian wrote that the usages of the meme had become less about describing behavior, than about controlling it and telling women to "shut up," (Freeman, 2020). Jennifer Weiner of the New York Times during the Covid-19 pandemic states that the influence of the meme had silenced her saying "she had had to balance her desire to complain about a nearby man coughing into the open air, hawking and spitting on the sidewalk, with her fear of being called a Karen (Weiner, 2020).

When it comes to racist connotations, many writers have speculated whether the term Karen is a racial or sexist term for white women. Writers have noted that in context, it highlights the significance of white privilege and the troubling history of white women weaponizing their victimhood. We can go no further than looking at two major examples: The story of Emmitt Till and Tulsa Oklahoma Black Wallstreet riots. Both cases where a white woman proclaimed that two young black men did something back then was inappropriate. One was accused of whistling at a white woman (Emmitt Till), the other states that a black man Dick Rowland, a shoeshiner, was accused of assaulting a 17-year-old white elevator operator.

At its core, the comical meme is not the equivalent to the N-word or any historical racial pejoratives that have inflicted physical, psychological, and even spiritual trauma that many people of color have faced. As I've mentioned before here as well as others, the majority of this society at large hate to look in the mirror to see the historical travesty their own privilege has wrought. I think what is more important is to acknowledge behavior and how simple solutions to simple problems have been disregarded for overexaggerated claims which cause the misuse of police resources and emergency services that can be used elsewhere. Calling the police because someone brings a grill to a park that restricts barbecuing does not require immediate police attention especially if the grill is not causing YOU or anyone else harm. Calling the police because you suspect someone is stealing does not warrant you to call the police especially if you aren't for certain there are no security services available and very much especially if you aren't completely certain that you saw them steal.

Because of the weaponization of white privilege, many young black men and other people of color have suffered and died at the hands of people using false accusations because they know society will believe someone of Caucasian descent as opposed to someone of color. Society for decades has conditioned some white women, unfortunately, to use their victimhood to their advantage to dispose of unwanted black men at the hands of a judicial system already causing social disparities. I'm even willing to say even feminism (1st, 2nd, and 3rd waves) have contributed to the weaponization of victimhood. When Kobe Bryant passed, one of the go-to things of his life was the allegation of sexual assault. Although it didn't go to trial it highlights a significant event in his life where he allegedly had sexually assaulted a youg white woman in his hotel room. How many black women, Hispanic women, Asian women, or other women of color have been sexually assaulted? It would appear when it comes to the crimes against women of color the world is silent, but when a white woman speaks of her victimhood the world, most specifically the western world listens and believes without investigation.

(Incoming sensitive remark)

There is a quantifiable history of white women in the United States who have falsely accused men, especially black men of sexual assault, rape, and any other heinous crime. I recall in my past when I was in middle school in Tucson Arizona, a young white girl accused me of touching her when in fact it was a goofy young man who was white (whose name I don't even remember because this was in '93) who was known to be playful and inappropriate. I watched the whole thing unfolded. She turned around and saw me. Mind you, I was 15 maybe 20 feet from her, but somehow my arm had the uncanny ability to stretch across the hall and grab her butt. She accused me, went to the principal and I was interrogated. Knowing that she lied and panicking because she crossed the threshold of fabricating a story, she asked her friends to lie for her. They did because she was popular and I was thus suspended and almost arrested. At the end of the school year, her friends apologized because they were scared but the damage was done. I was only lucky enough to be a 13-year-old to be accused in the '90s and not the '30s. The only question I have regarding the Karens of the world is where does it end?

Reference:

Freeman, Hadley (April 13, 2020). "The 'Karen' meme is everywhere – and it has become mired in sexism". The Guardian. London. Retrieved July 13, 2021

Weiner, Jennifer (April 14, 2020). "Opinion: The Seductive Appeal of Pandemic Shaming". The New York Times. ISSN 0362-4331. Retrieved July 13, 2021.

Wikipedia (n.d.): Karen (Slang). Retrieved 7/13/2021 from: Karen (slang) - Wikipedia


I liken it to “Karen” being a mild insult whereas slurs are deeply and inherently derogatory in nature. To the point where even “reclaimed” slurs are iffy at best.
 

George-ananda

Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
Premium Member
Now imagine if we created a name like 'Latisha' for black women that wanted to falsely blame their life's altercations on white people?
 
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Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
I thought I was black panther, now I'm stretch armstrong
So, do you need that gel stuff replaced like on Robot Chicken? Do your bones break when hit or do you get an imprint of the object that slowly fades out? Does stretching like that hurt?:p
I liken it to “Karen” being a mild insult whereas slurs are deeply and inherently derogatory in nature. To the point where even “reclaimed” slurs are iffy at best.
I'd just prefer an ol' fashioned "*****."
And, I would say atheist has had a fairly decent amount of success, as it did also use to imply, per the definition, immorality and indecency. And not all that long ago you didn't even want to be called a heterosexual, because that was a pervy thing.
But, personally, I think using names is crude. Like using Ralph to mean vomit.
 
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