jesus and paul are polar opposites...

[waitasec]

1 cor 6:1-6
1 If any of you has a dispute with another, do you dare to take it before the ungodly for judgment instead of before the Lord’s people? 2 Or do you not know that the Lord’s people will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases? 3 Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life!

luke 6

32 “If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them. 33 And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners do that. 34 And if you lend to those from whom you expect repayment, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners, expecting to be repaid in full. 35 But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. 36 Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.
37 “Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. 38 Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.”


how can anyone reconcile this?

 

[Me Myself]

Jesus was very inclusive when talking. He wanted everyone saved and HE NEVER SAID that only tose who worship him would be saved.

He FORGAVE those who were booing him while walking to the cross, and I am sure most of them NEVER worshipped him.

So I do agree there are a lot of extremely opposite attitudes of Paul and Jesus.

The only one to EVER say faith in Jesus was going to do any good was Paul

 

[9Westy9]

This looks like it could be fun. *Takes a seat*

 

[SageTree]

 

[Charity]

Jesus was very inclusive when talking. He wanted everyone saved and HE NEVER SAID that only tose who worship him would be saved.

He FORGAVE those who were booing him while walking to the cross, and I am sure most of them NEVER worshipped him.

So I do agree there are a lot of extremely opposite attitudes of Paul and Jesus.

The only one to EVER say faith in Jesus was going to do any good was Paul

In a reply to your first point He NEVER SAID that only those who worship him would be saved.....First of all you do have to to believe and accept Jesus, then you would worship Him. You are right when you say most NEVER worshipped Him.

Would you please explain the extreme opposite attitudes of Paul and Jesus?

Didn't many people before the birth of Jesus say He was going to do good things? How about Simeon, and the prophets in the Old Testament? How about John the Baptist, who preached and was the forerunner of Christ? Why would a Christian not have faith in Jesus, He was God in the flesh? Or at least that is the belief of a "Born Again Christian".

Paul came along after the death of Jesus everything he learned was from others, could it be that Paul took the words of the sages and prophets and brought his own opinion into existence. Or did he have knowledge far above others after his conversion on the Damascus Road?

 

[waitasec]

Would you please explain the extreme opposite attitudes of Paul and Jesus?

we can start with OP...

 

[waitasec]

Paul came along after the death of Jesus everything he learned was from others, could it be that Paul took the words of the sages and prophets and brought his own opinion into existence.

:yes:

Or did he have knowledge far above others after his conversion on the Damascus Road?

knowledge that contradicts what jesus taught?

 

[sojourner]

1 cor 6:1-6
1 If any of you has a dispute with another, do you dare to take it before the ungodly for judgment instead of before the Lord’s people? 2 Or do you not know that the Lord’s people will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases? 3 Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life!

luke 6

32 “If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them. 33 And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners do that. 34 And if you lend to those from whom you expect repayment, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners, expecting to be repaid in full. 35 But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. 36 Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.
37 “Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. 38 Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.”


how can anyone reconcile this?

I would hesitate to say that they are "Polar opposites," based upon one contradictory statement. That's nothing more than a gross overgeneralization made without proper exegesis of the texts involved (neither of which have anything to do with each other).
Human beings who are generally in concord with each other can (and do) differ on particular points. Otherwise, we'd all be the same person.

 

[waitasec]

I would hesitate to say that they are "Polar opposites," based upon one contradictory statement. That's nothing more than a gross overgeneralization made without proper exegesis of the texts involved (neither of which have anything to do with each other).

well as far as jesus was concerned:
"38 .... For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.”
seems this was the focus of his massage

Human beings who are generally in concord with each other can (and do) differ on particular points. Otherwise, we'd all be the same person.

tell that to jesus...

 

[Me Myself]

In a reply to your first point He NEVER SAID that only those who worship him would be saved.....First of all you do have to to believe and accept Jesus, then you would worship Him. You are right when you say most NEVER worshipped Him.

Would you please explain the extreme opposite attitudes of Paul and Jesus?

Didn't many people before the birth of Jesus say He was going to do good things? How about Simeon, and the prophets in the Old Testament? How about John the Baptist, who preached and was the forerunner of Christ? Why would a Christian not have faith in Jesus, He was God in the flesh? Or at least that is the belief of a "Born Again Christian".

Paul came along after the death of Jesus everything he learned was from others, could it be that Paul took the words of the sages and prophets and brought his own opinion into existence. Or did he have knowledge far above others after his conversion on the Damascus Road?

Well I am saying Jesus never asked to be worshipped. You won´t find one single verse where he asks this.

You don´t have to worship him for him to forgive you, unless you think when he said "forgive them father, beause they don´t know what they are doing" he said it only to look good on the quote.

Actually, he always reinforced the power of the good people (not himself only). He always said "Your faith has cured you" and he never said "your faith in ME". This is important because people that had faith in him, just had faith that God favored him, so basicaly when they had faith in him they had indirect faith in God. Jesus always said that faith in itself was enough for God to give you what you need. Jesus never said "Ask in my name x or y" the prayer that he taught didn´t include him in the prayer. Why? because he was just a ROLE MODEL. A GOOD ONE, but just a role model. An example of what can humanity become when it "loves God with all it´s heart".

He said himself that people will do much bigger things that the things he did. He said it.

Paul though, talks like he is perfectly insuperable and only if you utter his name he will forgive you. This is something Jesus NEVER taught anywhere in the bible.

The way I see it? He is teaching a lot of hindu kind of concepts in jewish language (because his audience is jewish and thus will understand better a language suited for them)

 

[Charity]

Jesus Christ's death is the central theme of both Old and New Testments. God promised the Christians victory over evil and a Deliverer. The prophet Isaiah gives a clear promise of One who would die for our sins. Jesus himself spoke of the Old Testament prophecies declaring He would suffer.
He specifically said,These are the Scriptures that testify about me" (John 5:39; 12:41. If Gods plan was build on sacrifice and Jesus was that sacrifice then why would a "Christian" not worship or give praise to Jesus, who apparently was more than just a "role Model"

 

[Awoon]

Paul had more Greek philosophy influence then Jesus.

So the question would be, Is Jesus' type of Christianity (which he never heard of), more reasonable then Paul's type of Christianity?

Jesus didn't claim to be a mystical Christ and didn't teach a Crucifixion sacrifice for atonement of sins. Jesus just said quit sinning and you'll stay out of trouble.

 

[Charity]

well as far as jesus was concerned:
"38 .... For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.”
seems this was the focus of his massage



tell that to jesus...

Focus of his massage......I do hope you meant message, I don't think I ever read about Jesus giving a massage but just stuck to "healing"

 

[sojourner]

well as far as jesus was concerned:
"38 .... For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.”
seems this was the focus of his massage

The focus of his massage seems to have been Mary Magdalene's feet.
The focus of his message, however, was "turn your lives around, because God's kingdom has come near."

tell that to jesus...

You don't think Jesus allowed for differences of opinion???
Differences of opinion have always been the foundation of Xy. Consensus, not uniformity, has always been the goal of the community.

 

[sojourner]

Jesus Christ's death is the central theme of both Old and New Testments. God promised the Christians victory over evil and a Deliverer. The prophet Isaiah gives a clear promise of One who would die for our sins. Jesus himself spoke of the Old Testament prophecies declaring He would suffer.
He specifically said,These are the Scriptures that testify about me" (John 5:39; 12:41. If Gods plan was build on sacrifice and Jesus was that sacrifice then why would a "Christian" not worship or give praise to Jesus, who apparently was more than just a "role Model"

I disagree. Grace and salvation are the central themes of the Bible.

 

[Acim]

1 cor 6:1-6
1 If any of you has a dispute with another, do you dare to take it before the ungodly for judgment instead of before the Lord’s people? 2 Or do you not know that the Lord’s people will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases? 3 Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life!

luke 6

32 “If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them. 33 And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners do that. 34 And if you lend to those from whom you expect repayment, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners, expecting to be repaid in full. 35 But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. 36 Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.
37 “Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. 38 Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.”


how can anyone reconcile this?

Christ forgives Paul for what may appear to be imperfect teaching of judgment. Christ loves Paul as Himself.

That's how one can reconcile.

 

[waitasec]

Focus of his massage......I do hope you meant message, I don't think I ever read about Jesus giving a massage but just stuck to "healing"

...
what was the focus of his massage, i mean message?

 

[waitasec]

The focus of his massage seems to have been Mary Magdalene's feet.

The focus of his message, however, was "turn your lives around, because God's kingdom has come near."

turn your lives from what, the ways of the world which would include judging others?

You don't think Jesus allowed for differences of opinion???

no, not really. he pretty much laid out what to do in order to be saved.

Differences of opinion have always been the foundation of Xy. Consensus, not uniformity, has always been the goal of the community.

how? jesus and paul didn't give their followers room to interject their opinion from what i gather.
can you provide a passage that supports this sense of democracy?

 

[waitasec]

Christ forgives Paul for what may appear to be imperfect teaching of judgment. Christ loves Paul as Himself.

That's how one can reconcile.

that doesn't work for me.

 

[sojourner]

turn your lives from what, the ways of the world which would include judging others?

That would depend on the location of the quote. Where does the quote come from?

no, not really. he pretty much laid out what to do in order to be saved.

Did he? Because Jesus was talking in terms of Israel, not individuals.

how? jesus and paul didn't give their followers room to interject their opinion from what i gather.

Really?
Both Jesus and Paul were great advocates of love, which, by its nature includes room for individual expression.