Is it wrong to advocate homosexuality as a sin?

[Vile Atheist]

Grow up. It was a misconception, it happens get over it.

You seem keen on blaming your misconception on me. Just want to clarify it was no fault of my own.

 

[Jeremiah]

You seem keen on blaming your misconception on me. Just want to clarify it was no fault of my own.

Place the blame entirely on me; I don't care.


At any rate, you assessment is a bit off. The "ickiness" is an effect of; not the root of.

 

[sojourner]

What's so icky???

 

[monta]

This is why the ceiling cat gave us emoticons

 

[sojourner]

For this thread we'd need an emoticon of the "Ambiguously Gay Duo."

 

[Autodidact]

 

[sojourner]

Holy Hermaphrodites!:flirt:

 

[Vile Atheist]

Place the blame entirely on me; I don't care.


At any rate, you assessment is a bit off. The "ickiness" is an effect of; not the root of.

Is "ickiness" not basically the root of the homophobic arguments? In my experience it has been. All others seem to be side arguments to justify their bigotry without actually saying something like "Gays are icky". Could just be me.

 

[J Bryson]

Closeted? what are you trying to be... do you think homosexuality is so attractive... it is impossible for some people to be gay. All due respect.

I was making a joke to Autodidact. Learn to read these posts in context, please.

 

[J Bryson]

Thank you for the correction about San Francisco, i appreciate it. The point i mentioned stands though, you may not accept it but it does happen. Did you say people don't become gay? some do.

That is exactly what I am saying: People do not "become" gay. There are seeming exceptions to this rule, but they have more to do with situations than with gender orientation.

Two examples come to mind immediately. The first is the example of prison/jail, where male-on-male (and very occasional female-on-female) rape has been known to take place. This, however, is more a matter of power and control than it is of attraction. Even those who engage in consensual acts usually consider themselves to be straight, and will exclusively date members of the opposite sex when not in jail, limiting same-gender contacts to times when they have no other options.

The second example is in the world of male prostitution: Young men on the streets will often turn to "survival sex" in order to get by, keep a roof over their heads, stay fed, and feed whatever drug habits they may have picked up. Some are gay, but they generally realize it long before they turn to prostitution. A few others identify as straight, but are willing to play the part in order to keep the money flowing in. Again, though, nobody "becomes" gay in that circumstance.

So again: People do not "become" gay. They may have same-sex contact for any or all of the reasons listed above.

In fact, since you say that it is a choice, let me ask you this: Could you decide to be gay?

 

[Jeremiah]

Is "ickiness" not basically the root of the homophobic arguments? In my experience it has been. All others seem to be side arguments to justify their bigotry without actually saying something like "Gays are icky". Could just be me.

"Is "ickiness" not basically the root of the homophobic arguments?"

No, it is a reaction of condition. If you grew up all your life, told that apples were gross then you would react accordingly. (If you want a comparison then consider the different eating habits of different cultures.)

The "homophobic arguments", themselves are rooted in hate, ignorance & prejudice; everything else is just an excuse.

The prudent question is: How did people become "homophobic" in the first place and why does it continue to perpetuate? Is it an effect of some fundamental flaw in human nature or in our social structure? I personally believe it is a combination of both.

"In my experience it has been."

I know this is a colloquial phrase but, let my point out, that I don't know you and as such this does not do much for validating your premise.

 

[Vile Atheist]

"Is "ickiness" not basically the root of the homophobic arguments?"

No, it is an reaction of condition. If you grew up all you life, told that apples were gross then you would react accordingly. (If you want a comparison then consider the different eating habit of different cultures.)

The "homophobic arguments", themselves are rooted in hate, ignorance & prejudice; everything else is just an excuse.

The prudent question is: How did people become "homophobic" in the first place and why does it continue to perpetuate? Is it an effect of some fundamental flaw in human nature or in our social structure? I personally believe it is a combination of both.

"In my experience it has been."

I know this is a colloquial phrase but, let my point out, that I don't know you and as such this does not do much for validating your premise.

I'll accept that.

And I did a pretty ***** job of "validating my premise" if I added "I could be wrong".

 

[HouseofIsrael]

I don't understand how anyone can make an intelligent argument against homosexuality. What people do in the privacy of their own homes - so long as it doesn't hurt anyone - is nobody else's business.

I do not think it's this simple as it sounds.

 

[HouseofIsrael]

But why did you think rape was relevant to the discussion? You're the one who raised the issue, so you must have thought it significant.

My point, rather simple, is that homosexual rape is no more an argument against homosexuality than heterosexual rape is an argument against heterosexuality.

Rape is rape i agree, but in my view raping someone of the same sex is taken more terribly because of sexual orientation.

 

[HouseofIsrael]

That is exactly what I am saying: People do not "become" gay. There are seeming exceptions to this rule, but they have more to do with situations than with gender orientation.

Two examples come to mind immediately. The first is the example of prison/jail, where male-on-male (and very occasional female-on-female) rape has been known to take place. This, however, is more a matter of power and control than it is of attraction. Even those who engage in consensual acts usually consider themselves to be straight, and will exclusively date members of the opposite sex when not in jail, limiting same-gender contacts to times when they have no other options.

The second example is in the world of male prostitution: Young men on the streets will often turn to "survival sex" in order to get by, keep a roof over their heads, stay fed, and feed whatever drug habits they may have picked up. Some are gay, but they generally realize it long before they turn to prostitution. A few others identify as straight, but are willing to play the part in order to keep the money flowing in. Again, though, nobody "becomes" gay in that circumstance.

So again: People do not "become" gay. They may have same-sex contact for any or all of the reasons listed above.

In fact, since you say that it is a choice, let me ask you this: Could you decide to be gay?

To the point that was, but whoh! still a little steep in regards to my argument that people are gay by choice. But to answer your question, could i decide to become gay? the answer is yes -i certainly could and it's a choice people make everyday for the reasons you beautifully outline.

 

[J Bryson]

To the point that was, but whoh! still a little steep in regards to my argument that people are gay by choice. But to answer your question, could i decide to become gay? the answer is yes -i certainly could and it's a choice people make everyday for the reasons you beautifully outline.

My point is that these people are not gay. Performing an act of gay sex with a person does not automatically make you gay anymore than posting something on this forum makes me an IT expert.

If you can "choose" to be gay, then my suspicion is that you are already gay or bisexual, and have not come to terms with this fact.

 

[J Bryson]

I do not think it's this simple as it sounds.

I don't see why it wouldn't be.

 

[Vile Atheist]

I do not think it's this simple as it sounds.

Yes, yes it is. Why would it be any of your business if they aren't hurting anyone? How is it any more or less moral than heterosexuality? Who does it hurt? What are the consequences of it?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

No, it is a reaction of condition. If you grew up all your life, told that apples were gross then you would react accordingly. (If you want a comparison then consider the different eating habits of different cultures.)

My mom use to tell me I wouldn't like certain foods. And recently I have discovered that I actually do like them.

To the point that was, but whoh! still a little steep in regards to my argument that people are gay by choice. But to answer your question, could i decide to become gay? the answer is yes -i certainly could and it's a choice people make everyday for the reasons you beautifully outline.

That's interesting. Most straight people I know can't even begin to imagine being with someone of the same sex, as most gays I know don't want to think about being with someone of the opposite. Myself, the thought of being with a guy just kinda makes me think "eeewwww."
But, you can keep saying it is a choice all you want, but science will beg to differ. It has even been discovered that certain areas of a gay person's brain develops similiar to the opposite sex. It has been noted that a gay man's brain will show activity when presented with a stimulus that would get a straight female's brain going, and vice versa.

 

[Vile Atheist]

If gay marriage is legalized, all of our children will be converted to Gaydom and Satan will win!








....Sorry lol. I can never resist