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Is it ok to "judge" others?

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Lycan, Apr 7, 2005.

  1. Fatmop

    Fatmop Active Member

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    I definitely do not believe it is ok to judge others. It's just fine to criticize, as netdoc said, but judgment is a final and unchanging concept. "Rooting out evil in the flock" can not be the job for man - look at the case (fictitious but parallel to reality) of Sonya in Crime and Punishment. Raskolnikov, his family and friends, and the convicts at the gulag recognize her as a beacon of hope and spiritual purity, yet because of her poverty, she was forced to take a socially unacceptable job. Those who judged Sonya, such as Luzhin, were always in the wrong, in part because they thought they knew how to discern good from evil.
    Moral of the story? Don't judge others, even if you have the Bible memorized from cover to cover. You may not know their whole story; you may be completely wrong; and you will almost certainly make yourself and your church look worse.
     
  2. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    Yes, it is a contradiction.
    Matthew 6: 16 - Moreover when ye fast, be not, as the hypocrites, of a sad countenance: for they disfugure their faces, that they may appear unto men to fast. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
    Jesus clearly judges the hypocrites appearance in this verse, for they make it noticable they are fasting.
     
  3. Pah

    Pah Uber all member

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    I'm not so sure that I'm the one blinded.

    If truth is as you say it is, then it falls into a circular error. If your standard of truth is revelation (the hearing of the word) then that too leaves much to be desired. http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/article.php?a=35


    Editted to apologize for continuing this off-topic subject
     
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  4. johnnys4life

    johnnys4life Pro-life Mommy

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    Yeah I judge other people too much. I am really a hypocrite sometimes.
     
  5. prosecutor

    prosecutor Member

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    pah, the truth (the Bible) leaves nothing to be desired since God through it "grants unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness" (2 Peter 1:3).

    Master Vigil, "perhaps" you are the problem.

    Luke Wolf, someone has messed you up my friend. There is no contradiction between Matthew 7:1ff and John 7:24. Your criticism of Jesus is proof of what I said before and that is you do not know the Bible. If you did you would not make such foolish statements.
    Prosecutor
     
  6. Pah

    Pah Uber all member

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    "God grants through it..." - that's exactly the point I addressed in naming revelation as your standard of proof. Along with the uncontested point that the Bible provides circular proof (your quote acknowledges that).

    The Bible says it pertains to all things and you believe this because God revealed it to you. That is the circular error and the reason you make that error is because God revealed it to you You say the circular error is not error because God reveals it to you on a personal basis. That last statement is your standard of prove which is shown in Epistemology http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/article.php?a=35 to be a very weak standard.
     
  7. Fatmop

    Fatmop Active Member

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    "Weak" by logical terms, but a religion that claims over a billion people certainly brings the argument on very strongly.
     
  8. Master Vigil

    Master Vigil Well-Known Member

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    :bonk: You wish don't you. Of course it would be better for YOU if I was the problem. You'd be free of blame and you can be all righteouos and stuff. Get off your high horse, come down here where you belong, and start actually living spiritually. Living spiritually cannot be learned from a book. You have to live with, mingle with, and yes... listen to the spirits, and the spirits of ALL living beings. Have you ever met a buddhist monk? Or an actual shaman? What about a shinto priest? How can you judge them, if you haven't even met them. You judge because you are afraid they are right, and you stick your nose in your little book because it backs up what you are afraid of. Sometimes, we have to face our fears, and it is a VERY liberating experience.
     
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  9. Pah

    Pah Uber all member

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    I think that's another fallacy. Large numbers of people do not confer truth on what they believe - but it is hard to "buck" the publicity camapign.
     
  10. prosecutor

    prosecutor Member

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    Master Vigil, have you met me? Have you spent any time with me? Have you not judged me time and time again? Your so-called "spiritual living" appears to me to include the use of a double standard. I have no fear but of the God whom I serve. Too bad you don't fear Him.
    Prosecutor
     
  11. Master Vigil

    Master Vigil Well-Known Member

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    My judgement is not of you, but of your ideas. I know your ideas, therefore I can judge them. You are judging people, by claiming we are blind, that we are "the problem", etc... Claiming we have no right to judge the bible because we are not christians, is judging us as a person, not our ideas. You didn't even touch our ideas, you dismissed them because "we have no right."
     
  12. Master Vigil

    Master Vigil Well-Known Member

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    And why should I fear something that doesn't exist? I do not fear Tao, or the spirits. They are not meant to be feared. Do you fear the possibility that you are wrong? And perhaps pagans are right? Or what about athiests, or buddhists? What if they are right? Would you still fear your god?
     
  13. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    Why would a loving, merciful god want you to fear him? Is it because hes not concerned if you go to hell or not? If he was concerned about our eternal destination, wouldn't he make it obvious that he is the only true god?
     
  14. Melody

    Melody Well-Known Member

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    Re: Jesus said, "He that is of God heareth the words of God: for this cause ye hear them not, because ye are not of God." (John 8:47)

    I take this to mean that the bible is understandable to the believer but not necessarily to those who aren't.

    I'm not sure that people come to Christ *because* of the bible. Some of us come to Him "in spite of" the bible. :D
     
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  15. prosecutor

    prosecutor Member

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    Master Vigil and Luke Wolf. Both of you need to do a study of the word "fear". To "fear God" is to give Him the reverance and respect due Him. While it also can mean "to be afraid", it is not limited to that meaning. I have no problem with anyone who is critical of the Bible. I do have a problem when one who is Biblically ignorant trying to explain a Bible verse, word or concept. To deny God's very existence is ignorance at its very worst. (Go ahead. Take away a point. Truth is truth and no deduction of points will change that.)

    Melody, read the parable of the sower (Matthew 13; Mark 4; Luke 8). It is the individual "heart" that determines whether a person can understand the Bible or not.
    Prosecutor
     
  16. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    Prosecutor - aren't you judging Master Vigil, Luke wolf, Melody - probably me, after this response ?:confused:
     
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  17. Lycan

    Lycan Preternatural

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    It is only in your opinion that your god exists. Other's that do not share your opinion are no more ignorant than you for claiming your opinion is any more accurate than theirs. You are stating what you perceive to be truth as fact and since in matters of faith there is no way to prove any one person is correct in their belief, it is a very arrogant stance that you display in claiming another's belief is any less valid that your own.
     
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  18. michel

    michel Administrator Emeritus
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    More fruballs.:)
     
  19. Master Vigil

    Master Vigil Well-Known Member

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    And why should I respect or revere something that doens't exist? And like Lycan said so wonderfully, Faith, does not equal truth. There is no ignorance in denying gods existence, no more than denying the invisible pink unicorns existence.
     
  20. prosecutor

    prosecutor Member

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    Michel, yes I am judging the four of you. I am using "righteous judgement." Also are you judging me for judging the four of you? Check-mate!

    The four of you can "fruball youselves to death" if that makes you happy. However each time you comment on the words "judge" or "faith" you prove me correct about your ignorance. Not one of the four of you understand either term. Making such absurd remarks as "Faith does not equal truth" is a case in point. Bible faith always exist as a result of irrefutable evidences. As a matter of fact "faith" at times refers to the entire truth of the Bible. (Jude 3) You folks seem to think that faith can never exist where something is known to be true. Jesus on one occasion said to Thomas, "......be not faithless, but believing.......Because you have seen me, you have believed.....(John 20:27-29). Question: "Was Thomas' faith removed when he saw Jesus had resurrected (truth) or was it established by the evidence (truth)?
    Prosecutor
     
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