Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

[Greatest I am]

Sure, there are wise judgement calls for ourselves, individually, and then there are judging others and things we are unaware of. We are incapable usually of making wise judgement calls in the first place when our minds are separated and not one with ourselves and the absolute.

One is not seeking nothing. Has nothing to do with being brain dead.

Don't assume. Making judgement calls individually is not foolish, judging others is.

Thank "God" the fictional characters Adam and Eve ate the fruit.

????

I agree with your last which contradicts your position.

A & E chose to have desires and that means they chose to judge between the desires they could attain and what was good and evil.

For us not to judge, is for us to not seek knowledge and wisdom and ignore man's elevation in Eden.

Sure Christians call it a fall but the brighter Jews see our elevation and they were right in the past and are correct even today.

Christians should have usurped the right moral of the myth when they usurped the myth and reversed the moral of the story instead of going with the more intelligent Jewish take.


Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Luke 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Jesus sits at the right side of God. He is to judge us all. If we are to be his brethren then we too must judge what is good and what is evil so as to fight evil.

For evil to grow, all good people need do is nothing and not judging is doing nothing and allowing evil to grow.

Regards
DL

 

[Greatest I am]

That's an example of a very poor judgement, and of a condescending, egotistical nature.

The last adjective I will take. Not the one before.

That is you judging me wrongly.

What is your argument or complaint though?

If humble is good as you say, enjoy the condescension you think I put up. Let it feed that humble feeling you say should be within you.

Lets not get into such a conversation though.

Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

Regards
DL

 

[moriningstar]

The last adjective I will take. Not the one before.

That is you judging me wrongly.

What is your argument or complaint though?

If humble is good as you say, enjoy the condescension you think I put up. Let it feed that humble feeling you say should be within you.

Lets not get into such a conversation though.

Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

Regards
DL

This brings up the question, why is there a need for judgment from a being that created/designed what is to be judge. Such a being could only judge himself and NOT his works.

 

[Unification]

The last adjective I will take. Not the one before.

That is you judging me wrongly.

What is your argument or complaint though?

If humble is good as you say, enjoy the condescension you think I put up. Let it feed that humble feeling you say should be within you.

Lets not get into such a conversation though.

Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

Regards
DL

Most of the bible is about an ego, self, haughty, arrogant, and pride sitting on top of ones own throne, and needing to be humbled and brought low. The eventual crucifixion of ego, the false self. Ego is not the true self.

"small minds discuss people." "Humble is for LOSERS."
There are no such thing as losers. Just those who lack awareness. It's foolish to judge others. We don't know their life or their situation. We could have as easily been born into their circumstances. There are plenty of ways to conquer lies, that is with love and peace, with truth and humility, not judgements or deeming anyone as a loser. The truth hurts but it can be spread in non-condescending and harmful ways.

 

[Greatest I am]

This brings up the question, why is there a need for judgment from a being that created/designed what is to be judge. Such a being could only judge himself and NOT his works.

Correct.

If all that is emanated from a God who was the only thing in the beginning, as we are told he was,

Then any judgement he makes would have to be of what came from him and his great plan.

A real creator God would not be able to condemn anyone because whatever that soul ended as would have to be what God pre-ordained in the first place.

That fact is why Gnostic Christians like me are Universalists. To be otherwise and see a heaven and a hell would mean that those in hell are those that God created for the worst possible end instead of the best possible end and that would make God guilty and not the poorly created souls he goofed on.

Regards
DL

 

[Unification]

????

I agree with your last which contradicts your position.

A & E chose to have desires and that means they chose to judge between the desires they could attain and what was good and evil.

For us not to judge, is for us to not seek knowledge and wisdom and ignore man's elevation in Eden.

Sure Christians call it a fall but the brighter Jews see our elevation and they were right in the past and are correct even today.

Christians should have usurped the right moral of the myth when they usurped the myth and reversed the moral of the story instead of going with the more intelligent Jewish take.


Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Luke 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Jesus sits at the right side of God. He is to judge us all. If we are to be his brethren then we too must judge what is good and what is evil so as to fight evil.

For evil to grow, all good people need do is nothing and not judging is doing nothing and allowing evil to grow.

Regards
DL

Adam(conscious) and Eve(subconscious) would have been robotic and deterministic. Would have lived in a very very limited conscious experience.

It is impossible to evolve consciousness and awareness by theoretical knowledge and knowledge "of." Direct experience and knowing is the way.

When one is placed at the top, there is nowhere to go but down, the fall.

Freewill and evolved consciousness are the products of experience. The fall from grace was about the need to experience. It was a blessing and a curse. It's a double edged sword when we create separation, divide, pain, and suffering. Comes with freewill, and that's where punishment(consequences come in.) Kind of like tough love, learning the hard way. Learning through experience.

The brain continues to evolve as we focus on new tasks and thought processes. Neuroplasticity, which is the brain's ability to reorganize itself by forming new neural connections based on experience. Every time we learn something, new neural circuits are developed in our brains.

The tree of knowledge is desired to make one wise by our life experiences to teach us our faults and new levels of awareness.

There is seeking true wisdom and knowledge, and then there is seeking egotistical labels and judgements on knowledge "of" good and evil. Assumed knowledge "of" something is never good. What appears to be true, living in our ego's... Usually never is true, no matter how intelligent we perceive ourselves. When the divine marriage of conscious and subconscious occur, and the western and eastern hemispheres of the brain become one at the place of the Pineal single eye, we are no longer blind. Awareness and higher consciousness (the Christ consciousness) is automatic.

Making judgement calls and decisions individually, wouldn't be the same as judging others and labeling things we are unaware of.

The kingdom is within, and we all individually have a tree of knowledge of good and evil in our brains. Dendrites and neurons we create that birth our reality. It's not always going to be pleasant the more separated we are from our own minds and others. That is where the curse comes in.

Then the journey begins of experience that we create for ourselves and others, and our quest for true wisdom and knowledge and true fulfilled life.

It's a double-edged sword. A blessing and a curse.

 

[Greatest I am]

Most of the bible is about an ego, self, haughty, arrogant, and pride sitting on top of ones own throne, and needing to be humbled and brought low. The eventual crucifixion of ego, the false self. Ego is not the true self.

"small minds discuss people." "Humble is for LOSERS."
There are no such thing as losers. Just those who lack awareness. It's foolish to judge others. We don't know their life or their situation. We could have as easily been born into their circumstances. There are plenty of ways to conquer lies, that is with love and peace, with truth and humility, not judgements or deeming anyone as a loser. The truth hurts but it can be spread in non-condescending and harmful ways.

"Most of the bible is about an ego, self, haughty, arrogant, and pride sitting on top of ones own throne, and needing to be humbled and brought low"

Yes. God's ego. Note the 3, sometimes 4 first commandments.

That is God saying that everything is all about him and his inflated ego.

I have a longer piece on judging. Please have a look and see if you would not judge what you see as evil.

-----------------------

For the evils of religion to grow, read any scripture literally.

Any and all harmless beliefs are allowed by Gnostic Christians. We know that any myth can be internalized for good results and as esoteric ecumenists, we enjoy knowledge of all the myths that man has created about Gods.

When there is a victim is when that view changes. Then you see why Christianity annihilated Gnostic Christianity. We do not let the evils of forced literalism go unopposed. To a tyrant like Constantine, we were poison. One of his first commands to his new Church was to kill off the free thinkers and of course, his new tool, his Church, did as bid. It was quite a ride for free thought for the next 1,000 years.

How can a Gnostic Christian, --- and any other free thinking moral person, --- not judge other's morals when seeing someone hurt other because of the same Church's teachings today?

Can you ignore such things if you have decent morals? Impossible. Especially with Islam pulling the same murderous, freedom stifling ****.

We must discriminate and judge constantly. Every law is a compulsion on all of us to judge.

It is my view that all right wing literalists and fundamentals hurt all of us who are moral religionists, --- as well as those who do not believe. Literalists hurt their parent religions --- and everyone else, be he a believer or not. Literalists and the right wing of religions make us all into laughing stocks. Their God of talking animals, genocidal floods and retribution has got to go. So must beliefs in fantasy, miracles and magic. These are all evil.

They also do much harm to their own fellow adherents.

African witches and Jesus

Jesus Camp 1of 3

Death to Gays.

For evil to grow my friend, all good people need do is nothing. Fight literalism when you can. It is your duty to our fellow man.

Regards
DL

 

[Unification]

"Most of the bible is about an ego, self, haughty, arrogant, and pride sitting on top of ones own throne, and needing to be humbled and brought low"

Yes. God's ego. Note the 3, sometimes 4 first commandments.

That is God saying that everything is all about him and his inflated ego.

I have a longer piece on judging. Please have a look and see if you would not judge what you see as evil.

-----------------------

For the evils of religion to grow, read any scripture literally.

Any and all harmless beliefs are allowed by Gnostic Christians. We know that any myth can be internalized for good results and as esoteric ecumenists, we enjoy knowledge of all the myths that man has created about Gods.

When there is a victim is when that view changes. Then you see why Christianity annihilated Gnostic Christianity. We do not let the evils of forced literalism go unopposed. To a tyrant like Constantine, we were poison. One of his first commands to his new Church was to kill off the free thinkers and of course, his new tool, his Church, did as bid. It was quite a ride for free thought for the next 1,000 years.

How can a Gnostic Christian, --- and any other free thinking moral person, --- not judge other's morals when seeing someone hurt other because of the same Church's teachings today?

Can you ignore such things if you have decent morals? Impossible. Especially with Islam pulling the same murderous, freedom stifling ****.

We must discriminate and judge constantly. Every law is a compulsion on all of us to judge.

It is my view that all right wing literalists and fundamentals hurt all of us who are moral religionists, --- as well as those who do not believe. Literalists hurt their parent religions --- and everyone else, be he a believer or not. Literalists and the right wing of religions make us all into laughing stocks. Their God of talking animals, genocidal floods and retribution has got to go. So must beliefs in fantasy, miracles and magic. These are all evil.

They also do much harm to their own fellow adherents.

African witches and Jesus

Jesus Camp 1of 3

Death to Gays.

For evil to grow my friend, all good people need do is nothing. Fight literalism when you can. It is your duty to our fellow man.

Regards
DL

We are no different there. All the scriptures have an internalized, gnostic meaning.

We can fight literalism without fighting people. We fight the doctrine and lies, never the human. We fight the conditioning of the mind with truth, love, and peace.

"God" has no ego. We give "God" an ego and religion kills "God."

 

[Greatest I am]

Adam(conscious) and Eve(subconscious) would have been robotic and deterministic. Would have lived in a very very limited conscious experience.

It is impossible to evolve consciousness and awareness by theoretical knowledge and knowledge "of." Direct experience and knowing is the way.

When one is placed at the top, there is nowhere to go but down, the fall.

Freewill and evolved consciousness are the products of experience. The fall from grace was about the need to experience. It was a blessing and a curse. It's a double edged sword when we create separation, divide, pain, and suffering. Comes with freewill, and that's where punishment(consequences come in.) Kind of like tough love, learning the hard way. Learning through experience.

The brain continues to evolve as we focus on new tasks and thought processes. Neuroplasticity, which is the brain's ability to reorganize itself by forming new neural connections based on experience. Every time we learn something, new neural circuits are developed in our brains.

The tree of knowledge is desired to make one wise by our life experiences to teach us our faults and new levels of awareness.

There is seeking true wisdom and knowledge, and then there is seeking egotistical labels and judgements on knowledge "of" good and evil. Assumed knowledge "of" something is never good. What appears to be true, living in our ego's... Usually never is true, no matter how intelligent we perceive ourselves. When the divine marriage of conscious and subconscious occur, and the western and eastern hemispheres of the brain become one at the place of the Pineal single eye, we are no longer blind. Awareness and higher consciousness (the Christ consciousness) is automatic.

Making judgement calls and decisions individually, wouldn't be the same as judging others and labeling things we are unaware of.

The kingdom is within, and we all individually have a tree of knowledge of good and evil in our brains. Dendrites and neurons we create that birth our reality. It's not always going to be pleasant the more separated we are from our own minds and others. That is where the curse comes in.

Then the journey begins of experience that we create for ourselves and others, and our quest for true wisdom and knowledge and true fulfilled life.

It's a double-edged sword. A blessing and a curse.

As a Gnostic Christian and esoteric ecumenist I can likely agree with most of the internal and personal issues you bring up.

I do not agree with a few things.

I E . "When one is placed at the top, there is nowhere to go but down, the fall."

To think that any mind is on top that does not have the knowledge of good and evil, is quite foolish.

Man is better off with a moral sense than without it.

To gain it is an elevation, not a fall. The Jews were right and Christians and you are wrong.

----------------------------

Original Sin—Ayn Rand Lexicon

From John Galt's speech, in Atlas Shrugged.

What is the nature of the guilt that your teachers call his Original Sin? What are the evils man acquired when he fell from a state they consider perfection? Their myth declares that he ate the fruit of the tree of knowledge—he acquired a mind and became a rational being. It was the knowledge of good and evil—he became a moral being. He was sentenced to earn his bread by his labor—he became a productive being. He was sentenced to experience desire—he acquired the capacity of sexual enjoyment. The evils for which they damn him are reason, morality, creativeness, joy—all the cardinal values of his existence. It is not his vices that their myth of man’s fall is designed to explain and condemn, it is not his errors that they hold as his guilt, but the essence of his nature as man. Whatever he was—that robot in the Garden of Eden, who existed without mind, without values, without labor, without love—he was not man.

Man’s fall, according to your teachers, was that he gained the virtues required to live. These virtues, by their standard, are his Sin. His evil, they charge, is that he’s man. His guilt, they charge, is that he lives.

Regards
DL

 

[Unification]

"Most of the bible is about an ego, self, haughty, arrogant, and pride sitting on top of ones own throne, and needing to be humbled and brought low"

Yes. God's ego. Note the 3, sometimes 4 first commandments.

That is God saying that everything is all about him and his inflated ego.

I have a longer piece on judging. Please have a look and see if you would not judge what you see as evil.

-----------------------

For the evils of religion to grow, read any scripture literally.

Any and all harmless beliefs are allowed by Gnostic Christians. We know that any myth can be internalized for good results and as esoteric ecumenists, we enjoy knowledge of all the myths that man has created about Gods.

When there is a victim is when that view changes. Then you see why Christianity annihilated Gnostic Christianity. We do not let the evils of forced literalism go unopposed. To a tyrant like Constantine, we were poison. One of his first commands to his new Church was to kill off the free thinkers and of course, his new tool, his Church, did as bid. It was quite a ride for free thought for the next 1,000 years.

How can a Gnostic Christian, --- and any other free thinking moral person, --- not judge other's morals when seeing someone hurt other because of the same Church's teachings today?

Can you ignore such things if you have decent morals? Impossible. Especially with Islam pulling the same murderous, freedom stifling ****.

We must discriminate and judge constantly. Every law is a compulsion on all of us to judge.

It is my view that all right wing literalists and fundamentals hurt all of us who are moral religionists, --- as well as those who do not believe. Literalists hurt their parent religions --- and everyone else, be he a believer or not. Literalists and the right wing of religions make us all into laughing stocks. Their God of talking animals, genocidal floods and retribution has got to go. So must beliefs in fantasy, miracles and magic. These are all evil.

They also do much harm to their own fellow adherents.

African witches and Jesus

Jesus Camp 1of 3

Death to Gays.

For evil to grow my friend, all good people need do is nothing. Fight literalism when you can. It is your duty to our fellow man.

Regards
DL

"God" wouldn't be a him or an individual. Loving life, and loving others, BEING, and conscious experience of love, peace, oneness is loving "God." It's all about life.

 

[Kolibri]

(Ha)satan is a Christian creation and doesn't exist outside of the Christian bible. Second point, an all-knowing all-powerful god that sets in motion a history that he designs and then condemns others for is a mental case.....at best.

This brings up the question, why is there a need for judgment from a being that created/designed what is to be judge. Such a being could only judge himself and NOT his works.

The problem here is the incorrect belief of many of the Reformation churches that God had a plan at all, and thus predestined everyone. This basic falsehood has skewed everything - placing the blame on Jehovah for fating all the ills in the world.

But Jehovah is not a God of plans. He is a God of purpose.

"This was so that now, through the congregation, there might be made known to the governments and the authorities in the heavenly places the greatly diversified wisdom of God. This is according to the eternal purpose that he formed in connection with the Christ, Jesus our Lord." - Ephesians 3:10,11

To illustrate: A person may desire to travel to a specific destination. Getting to that destination then becomes his goal, or purpose. He may have different options with regard to the means of transportation and the routes he can take. As he travels along his chosen route, he may be confronted with unexpected weather conditions, traffic congestion, and road closures, requiring him to take an alternate route. Yet, no matter what adjustments he needs to make, he will still have accomplished his goal when he arrives at his destination.

Jehovah never intended for man to leave the Garden of Eden but to expand it.

"And God went on to create man in his image, in God's image he created them; male and female he created them. Further, God blessed them, and God said to them: 'Be fruitful and become many, fill the earth and subdue it, and have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and every living creature that is moving on the earth." - Genesis 1:27,28

That is still his purpose, but due to mis-use of free will, God is working out his stated purpose along an alternate route. By the end of the 7th day (God's day of rest from creative works) that purpose stated in Genesis 1:28 will be the reality.

 

[Greatest I am]

We are no different there. All the scriptures have an internalized, gnostic meaning.

We can fight literalism without fighting people. We fight the doctrine and lies, never the human. We fight the conditioning of the mind with truth, love, and peace.

"God" has no ego. We give "God" an ego and religion kills "God."

Again, on esoteric thinking we have little to argue about. You are preaching to the wrong guy as I do not need it. Mind you, I do not mind you keeping it up if you have the lurkers in mind.

--------------

You cannot separate a man from his belief.

What you debate against in these places is not literalism. Literalism cannot debate. A human who is a literalist is who you address as you speak of the issue and he will take it personal regardless of how impersonal you make the language.

You are trying to think like a Christians who says they love the gay people but cannot condone them when they do or act like what a gay person acts like. That, to me is not being honest.

Regards
DL

 

[Greatest I am]

Jehovah never intended for man to leave the Garden of Eden but to expand it.

"And God went on to create man in his image, in God's image he created them; male and female he created them. Further, God blessed them, and God said to them: 'Be fruitful and become many, fill the earth and subdue it, and have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and every living creature that is moving on the earth." - Genesis 1:27,28

That is still his purpose, but due to mis-use of free will, God is working out his stated purpose along an alternate route. By the end of the 7th day (God's day of rest from creative works) that purpose stated in Genesis 1:28 will be the reality.

Yet that reproducing reality as scriptures show, cannot be attained without eating from the tree of knowledge which is what creates the desire to reproduce. Without it, A & E were too stupid to know they were naked and that is why they do not reproduce till after Gen 3 even though as you show they were told to way back in Gen 1.

As to the miss-use of free will, are you saying that to learn what one must know to reproduce a miss-use of free will when the outcome is to reproduce as commanded to do?

Regards
DL

 

[Greatest I am]

"God" wouldn't be a him or an individual. Loving life, and loving others, BEING, and conscious experience of love, peace, oneness is loving "God." It's all about life.

Only if you ignore post 67 which you did not comment on.

Until you do, we will not chat much as you ignore the harder questions.

Regards
DL

 

[Unification]

As a Gnostic Christian and esoteric ecumenist I can likely agree with most of the internal and personal issues you bring up.

I do not agree with a few things.

I E . "When one is placed at the top, there is nowhere to go but down, the fall."

To think that any mind is on top that does not have the knowledge of good and evil, is quite foolish.

Man is better off with a moral sense than without it.

To gain it is an elevation, not a fall. The Jews were right and Christians and you are wrong.

----------------------------

Original Sin—Ayn Rand Lexicon

From John Galt's speech, in Atlas Shrugged.

What is the nature of the guilt that your teachers call his Original Sin? What are the evils man acquired when he fell from a state they consider perfection? Their myth declares that he ate the fruit of the tree of knowledge—he acquired a mind and became a rational being. It was the knowledge of good and evil—he became a moral being. He was sentenced to earn his bread by his labor—he became a productive being. He was sentenced to experience desire—he acquired the capacity of sexual enjoyment. The evils for which they damn him are reason, morality, creativeness, joy—all the cardinal values of his existence. It is not his vices that their myth of man’s fall is designed to explain and condemn, it is not his errors that they hold as his guilt, but the essence of his nature as man. Whatever he was—that robot in the Garden of Eden, who existed without mind, without values, without labor, without love—he was not man.

Man’s fall, according to your teachers, was that he gained the virtues required to live. These virtues, by their standard, are his Sin. His evil, they charge, is that he’s man. His guilt, they charge, is that he lives.

Regards
DL

Not original sin or an original fall for mankind. All humans are individually responsible for the conscious thoughts they dwell on.

An individual fall through experience and separation. Conscious fracture. At the bottom, there is nowhere to go but up. You'd have to convince me that Eden was the bottom and that Adam wasn't whole before separating. At the top, there is nowhere to go but down. We learn through experience.

Sin means to miss the mark.

We all fall before rising. It's part of learning through experience. It's life.

IE:
For me, it is evil to call anyone a loser or judge anyone.
For you, it is good to call people losers and judge people.

There is a difference between knowing good and evil and having knowledge "OF" good and evil.

When a mind is separated, it cannot make rational judgements usually. It lives in the ego and deception, and cannot properly decipher right from wrong, it is slow to recognize and be aware, blasphemy of the "Holy Spirit" is this.

When a mind is whole, automatic awareness of environment internally and externally is wisdom and knowledge. Christ-consciousness. One becomes one with the absolute and sees life for how it truly is and others as themselves and as an extension of oneself.

Thinking one is "good" and "moral" is a mistake if we are separated of mind.

"The Jews were right and the Christians and you are wrong." A perfect example. A perfect example of a lower mind judging and labeling. They are human beings that have assigned labels to themselves based off of doctrine and religion that separates and divides the two. Strip away the labels that create divide and judgements which you love to make and assume, and the Jew label vanishes and and Christian label vanishes and they both become human beings and no different from each other. Having knowledge "of" these labels is evil, it indirectly creates division and separation based on religious conditioning and doctrine. They are both human beings. It's your "Jew" and "Christian" labels your ego assigns that causes separation and divide between the two.

 

[Unification]

Again, on esoteric thinking we have little to argue about. You are preaching to the wrong guy as I do not need it. Mind you, I do not mind you keeping it up if you have the lurkers in mind.

--------------

You cannot separate a man from his belief.

What you debate against in these places is not literalism. Literalism cannot debate. A human who is a literalist is who you address as you speak of the issue and he will take it personal regardless of how impersonal you make the language.

You are trying to think like a Christians who says they love the gay people but cannot condone them when they do or act like what a gay person acts like. That, to me is not being honest.

Regards
DL

Again, perfect example of knowledge "of" good and evil.

You are assigning me to and labeling me as a Christian and assuming. I take nothing personal. Another assumption and label of the lower mind.

Homosexual is a label your ego judges and applies to a human being. This is knowledge of "good" for you.

For me, I don't assign or label, I see them as me, and a human being. Anything else, would be evil to me.

 

[Thief]

Only God who equated sin with dying.

Regards
DL

Nay...that we make acquisition of knowledge and then die....
doesn't mean the tow events are related in consequence to each other.

One just happens to follow the other.

You could die without learning anything.
Some do.

and God seems to have some room for forgiveness.
Sin can separate you from God....but it might not.

 

[ChristineES]

No, it it is not a sin to seek knowledge in my faith. I am continually "seeking knowledge" (learning stuff). I love to learn. If I stopped learning, what would be the purpose of living?

 

[Kolibri]

Yet that reproducing reality as scriptures show, cannot be attained without eating from the tree of knowledge which is what creates the desire to reproduce. Without it, A & E were too stupid to know they were naked and that is why they do not reproduce till after Gen 3 even though as you show they were told to way back in Gen 1.

As to the miss-use of free will, are you saying that to learn what one must know to reproduce a miss-use of free will when the outcome is to reproduce as commanded to do?

Regards
DL

The desire to reproduce was not resultant of the eating of the tree of knowledge of good and bad.
That is an assumption. What they experienced after eating was shame. They sensed that somehow they were now unclean.
Remember Jesus is our other example of a perfect man. Are you saying he did not have a sex drive?

What about Jesus saying that Adam and Eve were essentially married by God prior to them eating from the forbidden tree? (Mt 19:4-6)
Sex between married individuals is promoted as something clean in the scripture. Married men are even told to lust after their wives.

May your own fountain (or "water source.") be blessed,
And may you rejoice with the wife of your youth,
A loving doe, a graceful mountain goat. (or "ibex.")
Let her breasts satisfy (or "intoxicate.") you at all times.
May you be captivated by her love constantly.
- Proverbs 5:18,19

The fact that Adam and Eve did not have children till after they were kicked out of the Garden is by no means proof that they did not have sex before eating of the forbidden tree.

 

[psychoslice]

I am guessing that Christians would prefer to be blind and in ignorant bliss for eternally instead of having a shorter life being able to think and be aware of all the aspects of life.

Christians are conditioned to see the world as evil while Gnostic Christians look at reality in our way Universalist way.

Jesus said, "If those who attract you say, 'See, the Kingdom is
in the sky,' then the birds of the sky will precede you. If they
say to you, 'It is under the earth,' then the fish of the sea will
precede you. Rather, the Kingdom of God is inside of you, and it is
outside of you. [Those who] become acquainted with [themselves]
will find it; [and when you] become acquainted with yourselves, [you
will understand that] it is you who are the sons of the living
Father. But if you will not know yourselves, you dwell in poverty
and it is you who are that poverty."

Here is a mind exercise. Tell me what you see when you look around. The best that can possibly be or an ugly and imperfect world?

Candide.
"It is demonstrable that things cannot be otherwise than as they are; for as all things have been created for some end, they must necessarily be created for the best end.”

Regards
DL

Nicely said, and I seem to agree with all you say, hey!, that's great, someone who talks my language lol.