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If Trump cannot provide evidence of Illegal Obama Wiretap?

If Trump cannot provide any reasoning for his claim, should congress proceed with an investigation?

  • Yes

    Votes: 10 47.6%

  • No

    Votes: 11 52.4%
  • Total voters
    21
leibowde84

leibowde84

Veteran Member
If the Trump Administration cannot provide evidence supporting his claim of "fact" that "Obama Illegally wiretapped Trump Tower in NYC", should the congressional investigation be stopped?

Trump claimed that this wasn't just a likelihood, but a "fact". One would assume that he based this serious criminal allegation on some kind of evidence, yet he has, thus far, refused to provide any to congress. He has the ability to ask the Justice Department and/or FBI for any information they might have but has refused to do so. So, at this point, why should congress investigate something just because the President requests it without any reasoning to back up? I am very interested in understanding this issue from another point of view.

Just to be clear, I am referring to Trump's specific claim, not surveillance in general. This would only apply to Obama having ordered a wiretap illegally of the Trump campaign specifically, per Trump's own very specific allegation of criminal activity.
 
leibowde84

leibowde84

Veteran Member
Trump made a specific criminal allegation against his predecessor. If he based this on evidence or reasoning of some kind, isn't it his responsibility as the President and the accuser to provide some kind of support? I've heard the lame excuse of people taking Trump too literally, but it was his choice to make a very specific allegation and then refuse to provide his reasoning/evidence that led him to his conclusion?

To me, it seems obvious that it was merely a dishonest diversion. Now, it's biting him in the a** because it is taking attention away from the Health Care bill.
 
leibowde84

leibowde84

Veteran Member
A Greased Scotsman said:
His as yet unevidenced claims sound potentially libellous.
Click to expand...
I couldn't agree more. It's hard to prove libel in the US, but he claimed it as fact, not a suspicion. He has been asked to provide evidence or retract his claim, and, knowing Trump, I think the latter is impossible. I can't think of a time when he actually apologized for anything. I just hope that he is held accountable for once.
 
jonathan180iq

jonathan180iq

Well-Known Member
Do you remember the conversation that you and I had a while ago about feeding this Troll who just so happens to be Commander In Chief? This is what I was talking about.

The entire nation is on alert because of a f*cking Tweet that this grumpy old man fired off early one morning... There have already been hundreds of hours paid into this distraction by reporters, Congressmen, pundits, and forum-goers alike - all because of a thing that someone said on Twitter.

Really let the absurdity of it all sink in...

We are talking about a Congressional investigation into a non-event started by someone's online conspiracy theory ramblings...

People like Trump can be mitigated by simply giving them the attention that they deserve - none.
 
Stevicus

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
leibowde84 said:
If the Trump Administration cannot provide evidence supporting his claim of "fact" that "Obama Illegally wiretapped Trump Tower in NYC", should the congressional investigation be stopped?
Click to expand...

I'm not sure. If I understood it correctly, Trump's accusation was based on something reported in Breitbart, so perhaps that would be the place to start the investigation. They could question the reporter and ask them to reveal their sources. Courts have sometimes compelled reporters to reveal their sources, sometimes by putting them in jail for contempt until they comply.
 
Skwim

Skwim

Veteran Member
All Trump has to do is provide his source, which would save a lot of needles time and expense, but, of course, right now he sees his best course of action to be the long stall, just like turning over his taxes, in the hope it will all go away.

.
 
Kemosloby

Kemosloby

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
It doesn't seem too relevant at this time, since Obama is gone and Trump is president.
 
fantome profane

fantome profane

Anti-Woke = Anti-Justice
Premium Member
If there is no evidence forthcoming there needs to be a statement from the President stating clearly that there is no evidence of any wrongdoing on the part of Barack Obama. It is not acceptable for the President of the United States to make an accusation like this and then just go silent on it. This needs to be clarified, one way or the other.
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
Revoltingest said:
If there were wrongful acts, then this might warrant prosecution or legislation.
Click to expand...
That isn't a question. There definitely was a wrongful act. The question is who did it.
Either Obama illegally ordered a wiretapping of Trump Tower, and Trump has evidence of it OR Trump accused a political opponent of a felony act with no evidence. One of these is true!
The first will require a pretty extensive investigation to ascertain the facts. Trump Tower may have been wiretapped, but not by the government. There are lots of possibilities, including the Russians keeping tabs on their investment. Proving that Obama was involved in wiretapping would require a big investigation.
But the other investigation could be over in a couple of days. Trump produces the evidence for his accusation against Obama.
It's been long enough for Trump to do that if he had any. I don't think he does, I think he was lying. That is the investigation I think most important. Did Trump have evidence before he made the accusation, or was he lying for some reason? He has plenty of reasons to lie. His incompetence in office is becoming increasingly obvious, and a big lie to get his supporters talking about how he is the victim would be a typical strategy for him.
Tom
 
Revoltingest

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
columbus said:
That isn't a question.
Click to expand...
I know....I wasn't asking one.
There definitely was a wrongful act. The question is who did it.
Either Obama illegally ordered a wiretapping of Trump Tower, and Trump has evidence of it OR Trump accused a political opponent of a felony act with no evidence. One of these is true!
The first will require a pretty extensive investigation to ascertain the facts. Trump Tower may have been wiretapped, but not by the government. There are lots of possibilities, including the Russians keeping tabs on their investment. Proving that Obama was involved in wiretapping would require a big investigation.
But the other investigation could be over in a couple of days. Trump produces the evidence for his accusation against Obama.
It's been long enough for Trump to do that if he had any. I don't think he does, I think he was lying. That is the investigation I think most important. Did Trump have evidence before he made the accusation, or was he lying for some reason? He has plenty of reasons to lie. His incompetence in office is becoming increasingly obvious, and a big lie to get his supporters talking about how he is the victim would be a typical strategy for him.
Tom
Click to expand...
Either or both Trump & Obama could be lying.
I don't know if we'll ever know.
 
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