If Jesus Died...

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

Law is not from God, but from Satan

Satan didn’t make the taboo.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

History shows that most humans, when given the same choices as Adam and Eve, still chose Satan and law, once again

So do you when you complain about grace.

 

[Dimi95]

Then how is Cain the first murderer? Murder wasn’t a sin yet.

How so?

Genesis 3
Then the Lord said to Cain, “Why are you angry? Why is your face downcast? If you do what is right, will you not be accepted? But if you do not do what is right, sin is crouching at your door; it desires to have you, but you must rule over it.”

James 1
"but each person is tempted when they are dragged away by their own evil desire and enticed.Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death."

1 Corinthians 15
"For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man.For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. "

 

[YoursTrue]

@Colt Elijah does not die at this time, nor does he go into the invisible spirit realm, but is transferred to do something on the earth. John 3:13 - This is shown b Elisha not holding any period of mourning for his master. And some years after his ascension in the windstorm Elijah is still alive and active as a prophet, this time to the king of Judah. 2 Chronicles 21:12-15. I hope you see that.

 

[Colt]

@Colt Elijah does not die at this time, nor does he go into the invisible spirit realm, but is transferred to do something on the earth. John 3:13 - This is shown b Elisha not holding any period of mourning for his master. And some years after his ascension in the windstorm Elijah is still alive and active as a prophet, this time to the king of Judah. 2 Chronicles 21:12-15. I hope you see that.

Elijiah had already translated to heaven. It reads “a writing from Elijah” which would have come from his successor Elisha.

And when the sons of the prophets which were to view at Jericho saw him, they said, The spirit of Elijah doth rest on Elisha. And they came to meet him, and bowed themselves to the ground before him.

But Jehoshaphat said, Is there not here a prophet of the LORD, that we may inquire of the LORD by him? And one of the king of Israel's servants answered and said, Here is Elisha the son of Shaphat, which poured water on the hands of Elijah.

 

[nPeace]

Oh, this was just a vision??????????!!!

2 Kings 2:1-18​

New King James Version​

Elijah Ascends to Heaven​

2 And it came to pass, when the Lord was about to take up Elijah into heaven by a whirlwind, that Elijah went with Elisha from Gilgal. 2 Then Elijah said to Elisha, “Stay here, please, for the Lord has sent me on to Bethel.”

No. This was a vision...

You say Elijah eventually died after the special assignments that you added? He actually reappears at the Transfiguration according to the scripture.​

​

Matthew 17
New International Version​

The Transfiguration​

17 After six days Jesus took with him Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. 2 There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. 3 Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus.​

​

4 Peter said to Jesus, “Lord, it is good for us to be here. If you wish, I will put up three shelters—one for you, one for Moses and one for Elijah.”​

(Matthew 17:9) . . .As they were descending from the mountain, Jesus commanded them: “Tell the vision to no one until the Son of man is raised up from the dead.”

If you didn't know, now you do.

The account in 2 Kings 2, is an event of a man being taken up into the sky.
However, that does not matter. What matters is what Jesus said.
(John 3:13) . . .Moreover, no man has ascended into heaven but the one who descended from heaven, the Son of man.

You have a choice... Take it or leave it.
If you leave it, then talking about what Jesus said, makes no sense, does it.
Rejecting what Jesus said, is the same as having nothing to do with Jesus, and vica versa.
(John 10:26) But you do not believe, because you are not my sheep.
John 8:31, 32

It also means being a child of Satan, and listening to that one.

• (John 8:43-47) 43 Why do you not understand what I am saying? Because you cannot listen to my word. 44 You are from your father the Devil, and you wish to do the desires of your father. That one was a murderer when he began, and he did not stand fast in the truth, because truth is not in him. When he speaks the lie, he speaks according to his own disposition, because he is a liar and the father of the lie. 45 Because I, on the other hand, tell you the truth, you do not believe me. 46 Who of you convicts me of sin? If I speak truth, why is it that you do not believe me? 47 The one who is from God listens to the sayings of God. This is why you do not listen, because you are not from God.”
• (John 12:48-50) 48 Whoever disregards me and does not receive my sayings has one to judge him. The word that I have spoken is what will judge him on the last day. 49 For I have not spoken of my own initiative, but the Father who sent me has himself given me a commandment about what to say and what to speak. 50 And I know that his commandment means everlasting life. So whatever I speak, I speak just as the Father has told me.”

So, it's really up to you, if you will hold on to your belief, and reject Jesus, and the rest of the scriptures. Or accept these, and let go of the false teaching, you hold to so vigorously.

 

[Colt]

Wow. A writing from Elijah, is from a man that succeeded him, and is alive, but his name cannot be mentioned in relation to the letter. Wow.

Now the twisting begins. 2 P3ter 3:16
Colt. You have let me down. Honestly.
The apostle Paul got it right. Romans 3:4
It's no wonder people are leaving "Christianity" in droves, and more atheists are being born.

The dishonest manipulation that indoctrinated you won't work on me. The scripture says Elijiah was taken up to heaven, I don't have to desperately twist that and add speculation that going to heaven means he was sent off on a special mission somewhere else. On balance the Biblical commentaries on this issue are on my side.

 

[Colt]

No. This was a vision...

You say Elijah eventually died after the special assignments that you added? He actually reappears at the Transfiguration according to the scripture.​

​

Matthew 17​

New International Version​

The Transfiguration​

17 After six days Jesus took with him Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. 2 There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. 3 Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus.​

​

4 Peter said to Jesus, “Lord, it is good for us to be here. If you wish, I will put up three shelters—one for you, one for Moses and one for Elijah.”​

(Matthew 17:9) . . .As they were descending from the mountain, Jesus commanded them: “Tell the vision to no one until the Son of man is raised up from the dead.”

If you didn't know, now you do.

The account in 2 Kings 2, is an event of a man being taken up into the sky.
However, that does not matter. What matters is what Jesus said.
(John 3:13) . . .Moreover, no man has ascended into heaven but the one who descended from heaven, the Son of man.

You have a choice... Take it or leave it.
If you leave it, then talking about what Jesus said, makes no sense, does it.
Rejecting what Jesus said, is the same as having nothing to do with Jesus, and vica versa.
(John 10:26) But you do not believe, because you are not my sheep.
John 8:31, 32

It also means being a child of Satan, and listening to that one.

• (John 8:43-47) 43 Why do you not understand what I am saying? Because you cannot listen to my word. 44 You are from your father the Devil, and you wish to do the desires of your father. That one was a murderer when he began, and he did not stand fast in the truth, because truth is not in him. When he speaks the lie, he speaks according to his own disposition, because he is a liar and the father of the lie. 45 Because I, on the other hand, tell you the truth, you do not believe me. 46 Who of you convicts me of sin? If I speak truth, why is it that you do not believe me? 47 The one who is from God listens to the sayings of God. This is why you do not listen, because you are not from God.”
• (John 12:48-50) 48 Whoever disregards me and does not receive my sayings has one to judge him. The word that I have spoken is what will judge him on the last day. 49 For I have not spoken of my own initiative, but the Father who sent me has himself given me a commandment about what to say and what to speak. 50 And I know that his commandment means everlasting life. So whatever I speak, I speak just as the Father has told me.”

So, it's really up to you, if you will hold on to your belief, and reject Jesus, and the rest of the scriptures. Or accept these, and let go of the false teaching, you hold to so vigorously.

Again, your childish manipulations and accusations that anyone who disagrees with you is aligned with Satan is, well, just silly. The Biblical commentaries are again on my side concerning what Jesus meant concerning his authoritative knowledge that he spoke to Nicodemus. Your attempt to distort the meaning to disqualify Elijiah and Enoch from going to heaven is Watchtower mental gymnastics!

Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers (13) And no man hath ascended up.—There can be no other means of receiving heavenly truth. No man hath learnt it, and is able to teach it, except the Son of Man, who ever was, and is, in heaven. The thought has met us before (John 1:18). To Nicodemus it must have come as an answer to the words of Agur, which had passed into a proverb to express the vanity of human effort to know God. “Who hath ascended up into heaven or descended?. . . . What is his name, and what is his son’s name, if thou canst tell?” (Proverbs 30:4). No man had so passed to heaven and returned again to earth; but there was One then speaking with him who had been in heaven with God, and could tell him its eternal truths. He had that knowledge which a man could obtain only by ascending to heaven, and He came down from heaven with it. From the human point of view He was as one who had already ascended and descended. (Comp. Note on John 1:51.) This is the evident meaning of the sentence, and the form is quite consistent with it. To explain the perfect tense of the future ascension, or to introduce the idea of the “hypostatic union,” by virtue of which the human nature may be said to have ascended into heaven with the divine, is, to give an explanation, not of the text, but of a misunderstanding of it. (But comp. John 6:62.) Which is in heaven.—These words are omitted in some MSS., including the Sinaitic and the Vatican. The judgment of most modern editors (not including Westcott and Hort) retains them. It is an instance where it is hard to account for the insertion by a copyist, but where the omission is not unlikely, owing to their seeming difficulty. And yet the difficulty is one which vanishes before the true idea of heaven. If heaven is thought of as a place infinitely distant beyond clouds and sky, or as a time in the far future when this world’s life shall end, then it is indeed hard to understand what is here meant by “the Son of Man which is in heaven;” and a copyist may well have found in omission the easiest solution of the difficulty. But if heaven is something wholly different from this coldness of distance in space or time; if it is a state, a life, in which we are, which is in us—now in part, hereafter in its fulness—then may we understand and with glad hearts hold to the vital truth that the Son of Man, who came down from heaven, was ever in heaven; and that every son of man who is born of water and of the Spirit is “made a member of Christ, a child of God, and an inheritor (in the present, κληρονόμος) of the kingdom of heaven.”

 

[nPeace]

The dishonest manipulation that indoctrinated you won't work on me. The scripture says Elijiah was taken up to heaven, I don't have to desperately twist that and add speculation that going to heaven means he was sent off on a special mission somewhere else. On balance the Biblical commentaries on this issue are on my side.

You got to it before I deleted it.
I said to myself, 'You know what. The guy is so hung up on believing in going to heaven, he has determined that this is a fact, therefore, everything else contrary to it, must have a different explanation. Give him a break."
Oh well.

Actually you have all the misled, on your side.
Nothing to rejoice about Colt. Biblical commentators? SMH.

Again, your childish manipulations and accusations that anyone who disagrees with you is aligned with Satan is, well, just silly.

Not anyone that disagrees with me Colt. I haven't said anything of my own originality. Every verse I quoted, is in the Bible.
You can read them, if you want to, rather than ignore them.
Besides that, your speech already identifies whom you are aligned with. You don't need my help there.

The Biblical commentaries are again on my side concerning what Jesus meant concerning his authoritative knowledge that he spoke to Nicodemus. Your attempt to distort the meaning to disqualify Elijiah and Enoch from going to heaven is Watchtower mental gymnastics!

Actually, those associated with the Watchtower are the only ones that got this right.
If you are interested in learning, that's not hard for the sheep that knows the voice of the shepherd. It only requires humbly listening, and accepting the Bible's teaching, that no one prior to Jesus knew of the sacred secret of the kingdom, which was only revealed to... no other than Jesus' followers - the firstfruits to the kingdom.

Yes. the scriptural truth you ignored, and don't want to hear, because you cannot refute the facts that debunk your beliefs.
Elijah and Enoch are not the firstfruits to God. You'll have to rewrite your own Bible, to get that, and guess what? No one will read it, except the ones that reject Christ and his father, and are Satan's ministers.

Imagine. Behold. Extract from...
Colt's Revised Version 2023
(Hebrews 6:19, 20) 19 We have this hope as an anchor for the soul, both sure and firm, and it enters in within the curtain, 20 where a forerunner forerunners Elijah and Enoch has entered in our behalf, Jesus, who has become a high priest in the manner of Mel·chizʹe·dek forever.

(Hebrews 10:19, 20) 19 Therefore, brothers, since we have boldness for the way of entry into the holy place by the blood of Jesus, 20 which Elijah and Enoch opened up for us as a new and living way through the curtain, that is, his flesh. . . God's hand.

​

Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers (13) And no man hath ascended up.—There can be no other means of receiving heavenly truth. No man hath learnt it, and is able to teach it, except the Son of Man, who ever was, and is, in heaven. The thought has met us before (John 1:18). To Nicodemus it must have come as an answer to the words of Agur, which had passed into a proverb to express the vanity of human effort to know God. “Who hath ascended up into heaven or descended?. . . . What is his name, and what is his son’s name, if thou canst tell?” (Proverbs 30:4). No man had so passed to heaven and returned again to earth; but there was One then speaking with him who had been in heaven with God, and could tell him its eternal truths. He had that knowledge which a man could obtain only by ascending to heaven, and He came down from heaven with it. From the human point of view He was as one who had already ascended and descended. (Comp. Note on John 1:51.) This is the evident meaning of the sentence, and the form is quite consistent with it. To explain the perfect tense of the future ascension, or to introduce the idea of the “hypostatic union,” by virtue of which the human nature may be said to have ascended into heaven with the divine, is, to give an explanation, not of the text, but of a misunderstanding of it. (But comp. John 6:62.) Which is in heaven.—These words are omitted in some MSS., including the Sinaitic and the Vatican. The judgment of most modern editors (not including Westcott and Hort) retains them. It is an instance where it is hard to account for the insertion by a copyist, but where the omission is not unlikely, owing to their seeming difficulty. And yet the difficulty is one which vanishes before the true idea of heaven. If heaven is thought of as a place infinitely distant beyond clouds and sky, or as a time in the far future when this world’s life shall end, then it is indeed hard to understand what is here meant by “the Son of Man which is in heaven;” and a copyist may well have found in omission the easiest solution of the difficulty. But if heaven is something wholly different from this coldness of distance in space or time; if it is a state, a life, in which we are, which is in us—now in part, hereafter in its fulness—then may we understand and with glad hearts hold to the vital truth that the Son of Man, who came down from heaven, was ever in heaven; and that every son of man who is born of water and of the Spirit is “made a member of Christ, a child of God, and an inheritor (in the present, κληρονόμος) of the kingdom of heaven.”

Hmm. That's some commentary. Talk about Gymnastics.
I need the exercise, anyway, so... Nah. I'm fit enough.

 

[Colt]

2 Kings 2

King James Version

2 And it came to pass, when the Lord would take up Elijah into heaven by a whirlwind, that Elijah went with Elisha from Gilgal.​

​
Jehovah Witness sect rewritten Bible:

"When Jehovah was about to take E·liʹjah up to the heavens * in a windstorm, E·liʹjah and E·liʹshac went out from Gilʹgal.

* = sky in the corrupted JW Bible.

 

[nPeace]

2 Kings 2​

King James Version​

2 And it came to pass, when the Lord would take up Elijah into heaven by a whirlwind, that Elijah went with Elisha from Gilgal.​

Jehovah Witness sect rewritten Bible:

"When Jehovah was about to take E·liʹjah up to the heavens * in a windstorm, E·liʹjah and E·liʹshac went out from Gilʹgal.

* = sky in the corrupted JW Bible.

Can't say anything on the scriptures, so you start rambling, like the people who tried building the Tower of Babel?

You haven't read the NWT, but you are ready to state something as fact, for which you know nothing?
This says a lot about you, and why you repeat the things the people standing on the podium tickle the ears with. "Oh, when we get to heaven and walk on streets of gold. Amen. We will see Enoch and Elijah... Hallelujah!"

Then totally ignore every scripture to the contrary.
Yes, those sweet talking "ministers of Satan", have an easy time carrying off the gullible, to join Satan.

So that you know... here is how the NWT reads...
(2 Kings 2:1) When Jehovah was about to take E·liʹjah up to the heavens in a windstorm, E·liʹjah and E·liʹsha went out from Gilʹgal.
(2 Kings 2:11)  As they were walking along, speaking as they walked, suddenly a fiery chariot and fiery horses made a separation between the two of them, and E·liʹjah ascended to the heavens in the windstorm.

What if it read... "take E·liʹjah up to the sky"; "E·liʹjah ascended to the sky", would that be a corrupt Bible?
This is where we highlight the ignorance of those who just want to believe anything they want, regardless of what scripture says, and how we know they are allowing themselve to be led by Satan, to do his will.

Strong's Concordance
shamayim: heaven, sky
Original Word: שָׁמַיִם
Part of Speech: Noun Masculine
Transliteration: shamayim
Phonetic Spelling: (shaw-mah'-yim)
Definition: heaven, sky

So, Strong's Greek Concordance is corrupt, Why... because Colt does not want to see anything that would cause the idea he has so come to love, collapse under his very eyes?
Anyway, we don't need Strong's on the Hebrew word. We have enough scriptures to burn your beliefs in Hell... as taught by Satan's ministers.

• One must die before going to heaven. 1 Corinthians 15:36
• One must be born again in order to get to heaven. John 3:3-6 - Something that became available only after the Messiah came.
• The way to heaven was opened only after the death of Jesus Christ. Hebrews 6:19, 20; Hebrews 10:19, 20
• No one could enter the Most Holy, before the High Priest - the firstfruits to God, and the firstborn son of God, from the dead. 1 Corinthians 15:20; Colossians 1:18
• Jesus said that no man had gone to heaven, prior to his ascension. John 3:13

Please don't ignore them. Many minds are corrupted away from God and Christ. 2 Corinthians 4:3, 4 says Satan has blinded those minds, so truth does not matter to such persons.... because God has been erased from the mind... without them being aware. Their so-called Christianity is a farce, according to 2 Thessalonians 2.
Heeding the warning at Revelation 18:4 can help save those who want to escape Satan's clutches.

 

[Colt]

Can't say anything on the scriptures, so you start rambling, like the people who tried building the Tower of Babel?

You haven't read the NWT, but you are ready to state something as fact, for which you know nothing?
This says a lot about you, and why you repeat the things the people standing on the podium tickle the ears with. "Oh, when we get to heaven and walk on streets of gold. Amen. We will see Enoch and Elijah... Hallelujah!"

Then totally ignore every scripture to the contrary.
Yes, those sweet talking "ministers of Satan", have an easy time carrying off the gullible, to join Satan.

So that you know... here is how the NWT reads...
(2 Kings 2:1) When Jehovah was about to take E·liʹjah up to the heavens in a windstorm, E·liʹjah and E·liʹsha went out from Gilʹgal.
(2 Kings 2:11)  As they were walking along, speaking as they walked, suddenly a fiery chariot and fiery horses made a separation between the two of them, and E·liʹjah ascended to the heavens in the windstorm.

What if it read... "take E·liʹjah up to the sky"; "E·liʹjah ascended to the sky", would that be a corrupt Bible?
This is where we highlight the ignorance of those who just want to believe anything they want, regardless of what scripture says, and how we know they are allowing themselve to be led by Satan, to do his will.

Strong's Concordance
shamayim: heaven, sky
Original Word: שָׁמַיִם
Part of Speech: Noun Masculine
Transliteration: shamayim
Phonetic Spelling: (shaw-mah'-yim)
Definition: heaven, sky

So, Strong's Greek Concordance is corrupt, Why... because Colt does not want to see anything that would cause the idea he has so come to love, collapse under his very eyes?
Anyway, we don't need Strong's on the Hebrew word. We have enough scriptures to burn your beliefs in Hell... as taught by Satan's ministers.

• One must die before going to heaven. 1 Corinthians 15:36
• One must be born again in order to get to heaven. John 3:3-6 - Something that became available only after the Messiah came.
• The way to heaven was opened only after the death of Jesus Christ. Hebrews 6:19, 20; Hebrews 10:19, 20
• No one could enter the Most Holy, before the High Priest - the firstfruits to God, and the firstborn son of God, from the dead. 1 Corinthians 15:20; Colossians 1:18
• Jesus said that no man had gone to heaven, prior to his ascension. John 3:13

Please don't ignore them. Many minds are corrupted away from God and Christ. 2 Corinthians 4:3, 4 says Satan has blinded those minds, so truth does not matter to such persons.... because God has been erased from the mind... without them being aware. Their so-called Christianity is a farce, according to 2 Thessalonians 2.
Heeding the warning at Revelation 18:4 can help save those who want to escape Satan's clutches.

LoL! I quoted the scriptures, but the JW cult programed you to twist them.

Enoch and Elijah did effectively die the instant that they were translated to heaven. 2 Kings 2 Genesis 5:23-25
The spirit birth has always been available to Gods children. John 3:10
Jesus has ALWAYS been the way! John 14:6, John 8:58
Proverbs 30:4

 

[YoursTrue]

​

2 Kings 2​

​

King James Version​

​

2 And it came to pass, when the Lord would take up Elijah into heaven by a whirlwind, that Elijah went with Elisha from Gilgal.​

Jehovah Witness sect rewritten Bible:

"When Jehovah was about to take E·liʹjah up to the heavens * in a windstorm, E·liʹjah and E·liʹshac went out from Gilʹgal.

* = sky in the corrupted JW Bible.

Question...Jesus died, right? Was he resurrected to the earth or did he go from the grave directly to heaven? Then again, maybe you don't think Jesus ever really died. Which wouldn't make sense if he did not "suffer death." So did Jesus go directly to heaven upon his death?

 

[Colt]

Question...Jesus died, right? Was he resurrected to the earth or did he go from the grave directly to heaven? Then again, maybe you don't think Jesus ever really died. Which wouldn't make sense if he did not "suffer death." So did Jesus go directly to heaven upon his death?

Yes, the mortal body of Jesus died, the Son of God did not die. We don’t know where he was during those days before returning in a new form.

After Jesus returned he began suddenly appearing and disappearing in locked rooms. That being the case the tomb didn’t need to be opened unless his body was taken out and disposed of or dematerialized.

Never the less Elijah and Enoch went directly to heaven, their bodies instantaneously disposed of. Elijiahs translation to heaven involved flames.

 

[Bthoth]

To say God asks anything else from us, isn't this denying the payment Jesus already made?

Solid rational.


I often wonder that if a person believes that the 'son of god' died for their sins. How could the person ever sin again and expect to be forgiven?

 

[Bthoth]

Question...Jesus died, right? Was he resurrected to the earth or did he go from the grave directly to heaven? Then again, maybe you don't think Jesus ever really died. Which wouldn't make sense if he did not "suffer death." So did Jesus go directly to heaven upon his death?

Weird point of view. Why would there be a tomb if he went directly to heaven? The shroud, what would that be?

Resurrection?

But how many doctors were on site to determine that jesus died rather than pass out unconscious?

Who checked his pulse? Who even knew what a pulse was?

 

[nPeace]

LoL! I quoted the scriptures, but the JW cult programed you to twist them.

Enoch and Elijah did effectively die the instant that they were translated to heaven. 2 Kings 2 Genesis 5:23-25
The spirit birth has always been available to Gods children. John 3:10
Jesus has ALWAYS been the way! John 14:6, John 8:58
Proverbs 30:4

Taken to heaven and then died.
You have it backwards. 1 Cor. 15:36

Just like you have these.
(Hebrews 6:19, 20) 19 We have this hope as an anchor for the soul, both sure and firm, and it enters in within the curtain, 20 where a forerunner forerunners Elijah and Enoch has entered in our behalf, Jesus, who has become a high priest in the manner of Mel·chizʹe·dek forever.

(Hebrews 10:19, 20) 19 Therefore, brothers, since we have boldness for the way of entry into the holy place by the blood of Jesus, 20 which Elijah and Enoch opened up for us as a new and living way through the curtain, that is, his flesh. . . God's hand.

Isn't that how Satan always gets things - backwards?

 

[Dimi95]

Matthew 11:13-15
"For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John. And if you are willing to receive it, he is Elijah who is to come.He who has ears to hear, let him hear!"

Matthew 14:10-12
"So John was beheaded in the prison,and his head was brought on a tray and given to the girl, who took it to her mother.Later, John’s disciples came for his body and buried it. Then they went and told Jesus what had happened."

Matthew 17:10-13
"And His disciples asked Him, saying, "Why then do the scribes say that Elijah must come first?" Jesus answered and said to them, "Indeed, Elijah is coming first and will restore all things. But I say to you that Elijah has come already, and they did not know him but did to him whatever they wished. Likewise the Son of Man is also about to suffer at their hands." Then the disciples understood that He spoke to them of John the Baptist."

Matthew 21:32
"For John came to you in the way of righteousness, and you did not believe him; but tax collectors and harlots believed him; and when you saw it, you did not afterward relent and believe him."

John is Elijah as explained in Matthew 11:13-15
John was beheaded and died as explained in Matthew 14:10-12

Hebrew 11:5
"By faith Enoch was taken from this life, so that he did not experience death: “He could not be found, because God had taken him away.”For before he was taken, he was commended as one who pleased God."

but , there is further explenation for all the previous prophets.

Henrews 11:13
"All these people were still living by faith when they died.They did not receive the things promised; they only saw them and welcomed them from a distance, admitting that they were foreigners and strangers on earth."

Acts 26:23
"that the Messiah would suffer and, as the first to rise from the dead, would bring the message of light to his own people and to the Gentiles."

Elijah and Enoch are taken , so that means that they are not more in this world , so they are dead as explained in

1 Corinthians 15:36
"But someone will ask, “How are the dead raised? With what kind of body will they come?” How foolish! What you sow does not come to life unless it dies."

Elijah and Enoch are dead,they died!

 

[Colt]

Taken to heaven and then died.
You have it backwards. 1 Cor. 15:36

Just like you have these.
(Hebrews 6:19, 20) 19 We have this hope as an anchor for the soul, both sure and firm, and it enters in within the curtain, 20 where a forerunner forerunners Elijah and Enoch has entered in our behalf, Jesus, who has become a high priest in the manner of Mel·chizʹe·dek forever.

(Hebrews 10:19, 20) 19 Therefore, brothers, since we have boldness for the way of entry into the holy place by the blood of Jesus, 20 which Elijah and Enoch opened up for us as a new and living way through the curtain, that is, his flesh. . . God's hand.

Isn't that how Satan always gets things - backwards?

I didn't say that they died in heaven, their bodies would have been destroyed instantaneously before going to heaven. It was believed that Elijiah would return from heaven before the Messiah. Some people even thought Jesus was Elijiah!

 

[YoursTrue]

Weird point of view. Why would there be a tomb if he went directly to heaven? The shroud, what would that be?

Resurrection?

But how many doctors were on site to determine that jesus died rather than pass out unconscious?

Who checked his pulse? Who even knew what a pulse was?

OK, not sure what you're saying here. Do you believe Jesus died for three days and was then resurrected?