Hamas vs. Israel, a thought experiment

[Shadow Wolf]

It looks like you are seeing what you want to see.

Saying you're going to attack insurrections or Jihadists or terrorists or whatever they want to call them but racking up civilian casualties while not seeming to do anything about the stated targets, yeah both scenarios look identical.
I have not one doubt, that just like Uncle Sam, the IDF would gun down journalists over mistaking a camera for a gun or talk some nasty things about "terrorists" on the run end kill a father and son in an aerial attack.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Saying you're going to attack insurrections or Jihadists or terrorists or whatever they want to call them ...

Out of curiosity, what would you call Hamas?

 

[England my lionheart]

When Egypt was in control was there terrorist attacks from Gaza?

More closer to home like Egypt itself,the birthplace of the Muslim brotherhood,

 

[Magic Man]

Obviously, but that doesn't add much help to the discourse. BTW, it isn't "murder" per se, so you've played your hand miserably. Hamas and the Iranians who prompt Hamas don't want peace, which has been known for a long time standing, and Iran will never give that up because of the teaching within the Hadith.

What doesn't help the discourse is using a false dichotomy to accuse someone of a position they obviously don't hold. Personally, I'd say unnecessarily killing innocent civilians is murder.

Israel doesn't really want peace either, at least not Netanyahu and other Israeli leaders.

 

[Magic Man]

Didn't realize you were such a military expert.

I already realized you're not very good at productive discussion. What I didn't realize was that you think bombing hospitals and other places where innocent civilians are is somehow seeking the elimination of a barbarous malignant threat. What exactly did those hundreds of regular people with no connection to Hamas do to be considered a "barbarous, malignant threat"? What did the other thousands of civilian Palestinians who have been killed by Israel do to earn that label?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I already realized you're not very good at productive discussion. What I didn't realize was that you think bombing hospitals and other places where innocent civilians are is somehow seeking the elimination of a barbarous malignant threat.

That comment is as stupid as it is slanderous.

 

[Kenny]

It's ironic that the Zionists are also committing gradual genocide like the Nazis and taking over the land which was also given to the Palestinians and other Semites by a god.

This sounds more like an anti-semitic rant than holding any water of truth. IMV

 

[Kenny]

What doesn't help the discourse is using a false dichotomy to accuse someone of a position they obviously don't hold. Personally, I'd say unnecessarily killing innocent civilians is murder.

Israel doesn't really want peace either, at least not Netanyahu and other Israeli leaders.

Looking at the history of Israel... all efforts of peace offered by Israel has been responded to by a resounding "no" or "not enough" or "great... and now we want more" and what they get in return is more missiles sent weekly.

So I would disagree with your position

I'm not saying that the Israelis are saints but rather speaking generally and referencing "overall".

 

[Monty]

This sounds more like an anti-semitic rant than holding any water of truth. IMV

Why is that an anti-semitic rant if genocide is being committed against the Palestinian Semites by the Zionists who want to steal their land which was given to them by a god?

 

[Orbit]

Yikes. This thread is starting to mirror the cycle of neverending hate that is the initial problem. Does anyone have any solutions?

 

[Kenny]

Why is that an anti-semitic rant if genocide is being committed against the Palestinian Semites by the Zionists who want to steal their land which was given to them by a god?

genocide:

1. The systematic and widespread extermination or attempted extermination of a national, racial, religious, or ethnic group.

They are not attempting to exterminate any nation, any race, any racial, religious or ethnic group.

It is anti-semitic in that you are referring to the Jewish people as attempting to do such a thing. A false accusation.

 

[Monty]

genocide:

1. The systematic and widespread extermination or attempted extermination of a national, racial, religious, or ethnic group.

They are not attempting to exterminate any nation, any race, any racial, religious or ethnic group.

It is anti-semitic in that you are referring to the Jewish people as attempting to do such a thing. A false accusation.

Why is that anti-semitic if the Zionists are attacking and killing the Palestinian Semites in order to steal their land which was given to them by a god? Or is that just an oxymoron?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Out of curiosity, what would you call Hamas?

They're pretty rotten too, like Bin Laden and the Taliban.

 

[Revoltingest]

Perhaps that is what you want to see?

You could think that.

Such is typical of fervent anti-Israel apologists, ie,
continually seeking the ad hominem, ignoring
Islamic brutality as a source of continued hostility,
& blaming defense from Israel as an excuse for
further brutalization.

Except I'm pro survival of a stable peaceful
just Israel.

This seems particularly so from many people
who appear to not value Jewish lives much, & for
whom violence justifies the murder of the innocent.

Except that unlike so many Christians & Jews,
I don't see the value of lives being dependent
upon their religion.

We see this from the overwhelmingly anti-Judeo/Christian
libertarian leadership....

There is no libertarian leadership.

, who don't challenge Islamic
oppression & murder of civilians....merely clucking
"Palestinians have the right to send countless missiles to kill the innocent", thereby tacitly
approving of every heinous act.

Unlike Israel's fans, I challenge
all oppression.

You were saying?

You can ape my style, but your
copy is superficial & specious.

1) How would you force Palestine to use the billions of dollars in aid for actually helping the people vs buying arms and making tunnels
2) How would you stop the constant barrage of missiles into Israel
3) How would you prevent the incursions without harming children in Palestine.

The answer to all 3 questions is for Israel to
end the oppression that inspires retaliation.

 

[Kenny]

Why is that anti-semitic if the Zionists are attacking and killing the Palestinian Semites in order to steal their land which was given to them by a god? Or is that just an oxymoron?

You need to read the definition.

They aren't trying to take their lands...

This is an example of genocide:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1711764480307151344

It has never been a secret that the end goal is to exterminate Jews and remove them from their lands.

"Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it" (The Martyr, Imam Hassan al-Banna, of blessed memory)."

"The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, (evidently a certain kind of tree) would not do that because it is one of the trees of the Jews." (related by al-Bukhari and Moslem).

The Islamic Resistance Movement consider itself to be the spearhead of the circle of struggle with world Zionism and a step on the road. The Movement adds its efforts to the efforts of all those who are active in the Palestinian arena. Arab and Islamic Peoples should augment by further steps on their part; Islamic groupings all over the Arab world should also do the same, since all of these are the best-equipped for the future role in the fight with the warmongering Jews.

"..and we have put enmity and hatred between them, until the day of resurrection. So often as they shall kindle a fire of war, Allah shall extinguish it; and they shall set their minds to act corruptly in the earth, but Allah loveth not the corrupt doers." (The Table - verse 64).

The Avalon Project : Hamas Covenant 1988

Thus... your definition is anti-semitic and faulty in its foundation.

 

[Kenny]

Unlike Israel's fans, I challenge
all oppression.

No you don't. You classify Israel as oppression while, by default, you are supporting the oppression that Palestine has inflicted on Israel and make no reference to it with me.

"A" The answer to all 3 questions is for Israel to
end the oppression that inspires retaliation.

As mentioned in my line above,

I now present exhibit "A"

Case sealed and settled!

 

[Watchmen]

Israel expresses regret and remorse for the "collateral damage" they cause when seeking revenge. The same way an abusive partner expresses regret at having to teach their partner a lesson. If Israel actually felt regret and remorse, they would just go ahead and not kill innocent people.

Wow. Comparing the Israelis to domestic abuse. A new low. You do recall it was Hamas that launched an all out attack against Israel and murdered and raped and pillaged and took hostages, and so on? It wasn’t that long ago. You remember, right?

 

[Watchmen]

And both sides are left with dead women and children, nonetheless.

So you don’t see a difference?

 

[Revoltingest]

No you don't.

Then you've not been reading my posts.

You classify Israel as oppression while...

You mean "oppressive".

, by default, you are supporting the oppression that Palestine has inflicted on Israel....

That's a bad assumption.
I don't support it.
I support both parties resolving differences.

Moreover, your post shows great prejudice
by saying that Palestine inflects it on Israel,
conflating Hamas with innocents therein.

Please, stop attributing false beliefs to me.

 

[Monty]

You need to read the definition.

They aren't trying to take their lands...

This is an example of genocide:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1711764480307151344

It has never been a secret that the end goal is to exterminate Jews and remove them from their lands.

"Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it" (The Martyr, Imam Hassan al-Banna, of blessed memory)."

"The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, (evidently a certain kind of tree) would not do that because it is one of the trees of the Jews." (related by al-Bukhari and Moslem).

The Islamic Resistance Movement consider itself to be the spearhead of the circle of struggle with world Zionism and a step on the road. The Movement adds its efforts to the efforts of all those who are active in the Palestinian arena. Arab and Islamic Peoples should augment by further steps on their part; Islamic groupings all over the Arab world should also do the same, since all of these are the best-equipped for the future role in the fight with the warmongering Jews.

The Avalon Project : Hamas Covenant 1988

Thus... your definition is anti-semitic and faulty in its foundation.

So why are the Zionists building settlements on the Palestinian Semite land which was given to them by a god if they don't want to steal it?
Before 1947 the Jewish and Palestinian Semites lived harmoniously together before the non-Semitic Zionists wanted to steal the Palestinian Semite land.