Government slammed over report on indigenous incarceration

[danieldemol]

‘The Law Council of Australia has slammed the federal government's failure to respond to a comprehensive report into the "stark over-representation" of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people in Australian prisons - despite the government having commissioned the report in the first place.

"Pathways to Justice" by the Australian Law Reform Commission made extensive recommendations into incarceration rates a year ago - including that Aboriginal-led solutions are essential and effective.’

Read more here;
'International embarrassment': Government slammed for ‘ignoring’ Indigenous incarceration report

 

[lewisnotmiller]

‘The Law Council of Australia has slammed the federal government's failure to respond to a comprehensive report into the "stark over-representation" of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people in Australian prisons - despite the government having commissioned the report in the first place.

"Pathways to Justice" by the Australian Law Reform Commission made extensive recommendations into incarceration rates a year ago - including that Aboriginal-led solutions are essential and effective.’

Read more here;
'International embarrassment': Government slammed for ‘ignoring’ Indigenous incarceration report

Good.
That criticism appears completely justified to me.

 

[Shad]

‘The Law Council of Australia has slammed the federal government's failure to respond to a comprehensive report into the "stark over-representation" of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people in Australian prisons - despite the government having commissioned the report in the first place.

"Pathways to Justice" by the Australian Law Reform Commission made extensive recommendations into incarceration rates a year ago - including that Aboriginal-led solutions are essential and effective.’

Read more here;
'International embarrassment': Government slammed for ‘ignoring’ Indigenous incarceration report

Demographics in normal populations does not equate demographics in everything else.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Demographics in normal populations does not equate demographics in everything else.

Sorry, mate, not sure I quite follow?
Do you mean comparing total population demographics to prison demographics is too simplistic, etc?

If so, I agree. However, there is clear and massive over-representation of indigenous in prison here by basically any measure I can think of.
It's not necessarily due to racism (it can be, of course) but is a sign that we have something to address for the improvement of our society.

That practical recommendations on this, requested by the government, have then simply been not acted on is a pretty familiar story here.

In this, we are quite different to our NZ neighbours...there are few votes in indigenous affairs here.
Hence both sides of politics have been uninventive, in my estimation.

 

[danieldemol]

Demographics in normal populations does not equate demographics in everything else.

Still, it is advisable to keep as many people non-offending and thus out of jail as one can, and the report found that aboriginal led solutions provide benefit here, so i’m not really sure where you are going with this remark.

 

[Shad]

Still, it is advisable to keep as many people non-offending and thus out of jail as one can, and the report found that aboriginal led solutions provide benefit here, so i’m not really sure where you are going with this remark.

Via "stark over-representation" as if demographic representation needs to equal demographic populations. Representation being the keyword.

 

[Shad]

Sorry, mate, not sure I quite follow?
Do you mean comparing total population demographics to prison demographics is too simplistic, etc?

It is an error itself in method and thought.

If so, I agree. However, there is clear and massive over-representation of indigenous in prison here by basically any measure I can think of.
It's not necessarily due to racism (it can be, of course) but is a sign that we have something to address for the improvement of our society. That practical recommendations on this, requested by the government, have then simply been not acted on is a pretty familiar story here.

There are little details on the solutions in the article so I didn't address those.

 

[Father Heathen]

So do they refrain from arresting criminals belonging to race X until they find enough criminals that belong to race Y to arrest?

 

[Lyndon]

The problem is they throw the book at aborigine's crimes while white people get away with the same. Not much different to the situation In USA but to a greater extent.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

So do they refrain from arresting criminals belonging to race X until they find enough criminals that belong to race Y to arrest?

No.
The recommendations are more around how to intervene before policing is required, including community policing, proactive intervention on alcohol and drug abuse, and better proactive mental health services.

There are substantial cultural differences which means that things like provision of services individuals need to access has commonly been less effective with indigenous communities, so...very, very simplistically...having more intervention programs can be a more efficient spend of the same dollars.

This isn't about ignoring crimes to drive more parity in arrest rates.

There are also recommendations around things like recidivism, and what could be done to reduce this which may not be the same as more general attempts to do the same.

Incidentally, Aboriginals are not the only party with over-representation or unique needs. But they are the most extreme case of this currently, and gave been for a long time.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

The problem is they throw the book at aborigine's crimes while white people get away with the same. Not much different to the situation In USA but to a greater extent.

No, not really.
It's far more difficult to assess and address than that.
Racism plays a part though.

I'd also suggest that comparing the situation to blacks in America is a mistake. There may be more similarities between indigenous in New Zealand and African Americans in the US, I suspect.

Our indigenous situation is more akin to your Native American one.

 

[Lyndon]

But the over representation of minorities in jail and prison, the black situation in America is similar to the Aborigine situation in Australia, Native Americans are also over represented in jail but not to the same extent. Australia has much more racism towards its native population than America has today, although historically the Native Americans may have had it worse.

 

[Subduction Zone]

But the over representation of minorities in jail and prison, the black situation in America is similar to the Aborigine situation in Australia, Native Americans are also over represented in jail but not to the same extent. Australia has much more racism towards its native population than America has today, although historically the Native Americans may have had it worse.

Our native population has other problems. There are government subsidies for many of them, but of course only enough to keep them in poverty. Alcoholism is the major problem with Natives (I do not appreciate that term. I am native. I was born here, Canada has a better term, as does Australia).

But the good news is that now the U.S. can point to Australia and say "they're worse!!"

 

[Vinayaka]

The problem is they throw the book at aborigine's crimes while white people get away with the same. Not much different to the situation In USA but to a greater extent.

Canada as well.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Our native population has other problems. There are government subsidies for many of them, but of course only enough to keep them in poverty. Alcoholism is the major problem with Natives (I do not appreciate that term. I am native. I was born here, Canada has a better term, as does Australia).

But the good news is that now the U.S. can point to Australia and say "they're worse!!"

You always could point to us, you just may not have realised it.
Though I would make the point that it's not quite so clear cut. Both countries have issues.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You always could point to us, you just may not have realised it.
Though I would make the point that it's not quite so clear cut. Both countries have issues.

I know. Sadly with our current leadership we are grasping at straws to make us look better. This gave me a very slim one. Seriously treating minorities fairly can be a rather difficult task. Especially since some degree of racism appears to be a natural reaction to those not in one's group. That does not make it right, but it does make it a problem that will not go away on its own.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

But the over representation of minorities in jail and prison, the black situation in America is similar to the Aborigine situation in Australia,

Right, got ya. Yes, that's correct, although actually there is no equivalent comparison in the US. The situation here is worse, but with a smaller minority (hence unfortunately easier to ignore and with less political clout).
So you're completely correct in terms of over-representation. I guess I was thinking more of things like more remote communities, smaller percentage of overall population, and a culturally diverse group we treat as homogeneous.

Native Americans are also over represented in jail but not to the same extent. Australia has much more racism towards its native population than America has today, although historically the Native Americans may have had it worse.

It was bad here too. I've read a lot of Native American history, and aspects were horrific. But the common colonial roots we shared meant some of the prevailing attitudes and actions were bad here too, albeit on a smaller scale in absolute terms.

Explainer: the evidence for the Tasmanian genocide

 

[Subduction Zone]

Right, got ya. Yes, that's correct, although actually there is no equivalent comparison in the US. The situation here is worse, but with a smaller minority (hence unfortunately easier to ignore and with less political clout).
So you're completely correct in terms of over-representation. I guess I was thinking more of things like more remote communities, smaller percentage of overall population, and a culturally diverse group we treat as homogeneous.



It was bad here too. I've read a lot of Native American history, and aspects were horrific. But the common colonial roots we shared meant some of the prevailing attitudes and actions were bad here too, albeit on a smaller scale in absolute terms.

Explainer: the evidence for the Tasmanian genocide

In the U.S., and other New World countries we did not need to fight so much. Most of the work was done by dusease:

American Indians and European Diseases | Native American Netroots

That is why it is a crime to even visit some isolated people's today. Do you remember the kerfuffle about the American missionary that was killed by a Pacific island tribe? If he had survived he would be facing very serious charges since his presence threatened genocide.

 

[metis]

As we continuously witness here in the States, justice is not blind, and it indeed makes a difference how much one makes and what the color of their skin may be.

Even with the Flint water crises, an investigation showed that this mostly poor and overwhelmingly black city was largely neglected by the Snyder (Republican) administration both prior to the testing that found lead in the drinking water and also afterward. But all the pipes in Michigan's capital, Lansing, had been replaced. And, btw, the "poor roads" in Lansing I'd love to have here in the Detroit area as our roads have been declared the worst in the nation.

 

[metis]

‘The Law Council of Australia has slammed the federal government's failure to respond to a comprehensive report into the "stark over-representation" of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people in Australian prisons - despite the government having commissioned the report in the first place.

"Pathways to Justice" by the Australian Law Reform Commission made extensive recommendations into incarceration rates a year ago - including that Aboriginal-led solutions are essential and effective.’

Read more here;
'International embarrassment': Government slammed for ‘ignoring’ Indigenous incarceration report

BTW, some years ago I watched the movie "Rabbit-Proof Fence", and is that a reasonably accurate portrayal of what really happened if you saw it?