Thief
Rogue Theologian
and then crossover into the next life with expectations!
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God The Omnipotent
- Thread starter Neo Deist
- Start date
I don't agree. Deism denies any role of key human experiences in developing an understanding of the universe.I agree, deism is awesome!
Neo Deist
Th.D. & D.Div. h.c.
Deism does not deny human experiences with regard to understanding the universe. It is the exact opposite. I should know...I AM A DEIST. Deism is based off of personal observations of nature and the universe, and thus what you learn from those experiences. Deism is not earth centric; it has a cosmic focus. We look beyond our little borders.
What deism denies and rejects are man made holy books where some ancient prophet says "I was divinely inspired" or "God spoke to me and told me this..." Deism is all about deductive reasoning and we most often agree with science.
What I was getting at were things like Near Death Experiences; Childhood reincarnation verifiable memories, spirit communications, mystical experiences, teachings of advanced souls, etc.. I have studied all these phenomena and more and a full consideration (from all sides) has been instrumental in forming my understanding of the universe
The main difference between you and us deists is that we recognize that humans are extremely capable of inventing fiction. We do it all the time. So we deists expect something more than a human making a claim before accepting something that is implausible.
Tom
I actually agree with that position. That's why all the subjects I mentioned require careful analysis considering all evidence and argumentation; which is neither blind acceptance nor blind dismissal. My analysis concludes something is indeed going on that is beyond our current science and effects my view of how the universe operates. I see how so much of this is really part and parcel of an already established wisdom tradition (eastern/Indian).
Skwim
Veteran Member
So, god doesn't want chaos and could stop it, but allows it to continue anyway. Kind of wonder why, don't you? Boy, when stuff happens that I don't like, and I have the capability of stopping it, I do. Gotta wonder what god's waiting for. More human deaths perhaps?
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I definitely agree with this. The history of science is finding out things about the universe we didn't know.
But one of the biggest things holding us back is people making claims for things without strong evidence. People wishing to believe are very easily led by charlatans.
So while I agree that there is more to Creation than we know, I am not going to believe anything important based on somebody's second hand account of an experience indistinguishable from a delusion or magic trick.
At the moment, that's all there is for most of the beliefs you cited.
Tom
First Baseman
Retired athlete
God created the universe and all that is in it.
God created the laws of nature.
God created gravity and orbits.
God created what would become science and mathematics.
God created life and its complexities.
God created the elements and photosynthesis.
God created time, space and medicine.
God created us with intelligence.
God even created "Satan" but for some damn reason the omnipotent creator can't seem to do anything about him, according to some of the more archaic minded religions. Satan gets to roam free, tempting and taunting, and spreading his wickedness in his wake. Only a human mind would come up with such nonsense.
I say that if Satan were truly this evil, devilish nemesis, that God could simply snap His divine fingers and uncreate what He created and save everyone the trouble.
I see you're not very familiar with the Bible. Try reading Job. You'll quickly discover that Satan can only do what God will allow him to do.
If Satan really were allowed to run around free the world have ended many times by now. God is the One who keeps things together.
That is why one's analysis needs to be intelligent (and beyond blind dismissal or blind acceptance). The evidence for my beliefs are strong enough for me to be well beyond reasonable doubt. I do not think the average person is aware of the quality of some of this evidence without serious study and consideration of the subjects.
Which is why I am more inclined to rely on the analysis by experts, who tend to dismiss the evidence.
Tom
First Baseman
Retired athlete
Everybody has bias, even "experts" of whatever kind.
Which is why scientists rely so heavily on seemingly arbitrary standards and methods. Things like repeatable experiments, published results and very precise terminology.
As opposed to theologians and supernatural quacks.
Tom
First Baseman
Retired athlete
Yeah, sure they do. That's why they preach macro-evolution, which they cannot prove and why they teach abiogenesis, which they can't even form a good acceptable theory about. Yeah, sure they do.
As opposed to what?
Catholics and Shia disagreeing about God? And who really knows the truth about Him?
Tom
Maybe God is wiser than you and me? And he has very good reasons for his patience? And God has explained those reasons in the Bible? I think that may be, no, I'm sure that is the case.
First Baseman
Retired athlete
Jesus is the truth, the way and the life. Only Jesus knows the Father, has seen His face and been in His presence. Along with whomsoever Jesus will take into His presence.
Muslims sincerely and devoutly believe differently. So let's investigate the evidence, OK?
Tom
First Baseman
Retired athlete
The only evidence I'm convinced of is Jesus Christ because only in Him is truth. You listen to Mohammed if you want, I'll go with Him who died for me and loves me.