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Featured Free Will

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Fool, Dec 23, 2018.

  1. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    Is free will basically the idea of an open mind, or free spirit?
     
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  2. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon shunyadragon
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    No, because claims of the open mind or free spirit is to vague and egocentric to reflect the degree of Free Will humans may have Comment more later.
     
    #2 shunyadragon, Dec 23, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2018
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  3. Skwim

    Skwim Veteran Member

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    Will is the capacity to act decisively on one's desires.

    Free will is to do so undirected by controlling influences.

    While will exists, free will does not.

    .
     
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  4. Shantanu

    Shantanu Well-Known Member

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    Free will is an impossible objective unless one lives in the wild where there are no man-made laws and such places do not exist where one can do as one pleases.
     
  5. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    doing what is right for all is adverse to free will?
     
  6. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    this is considered selfishness

    so the All having free will towards all forms of itself would be adverse to itself?
     
  7. Skwim

    Skwim Veteran Member

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    Other than by you, who else?

    What is the "All"?

    .
     
  8. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    you yourself used the terms one's desire.


    all is vanity. all is desire. not all desire the same for All
     
  9. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon shunyadragon
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    No, 'doing right for all' only means one's decisions are patterned for the collective good, and survival. Yes,it is likely deterministic over for survival, but does not preclude the possibility of a degree of Free Will.

    I question the use of 'what is right,' because of the subjective nature of this statement. Yes there is most often a cultural standard for what is right, but most if not all are conditioned culturally to 'what is right,' even those who claim to be open minded or free spirits,or possibly claim to be 'enlightened.'
     
    #9 shunyadragon, Dec 23, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2018
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  10. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    the golden rule, or law of reciprocity, is found in many cultures.
     
  11. 1137

    1137 Thelemite
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    Free will is the ability to act freely in accordance with one's will.
     
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  12. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    then the Absolute has free will?
     
  13. Axe Elf

    Axe Elf Prophet

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    "Do not answer a Fool according to his folly, or you yourself will be just like him." --Proverbs 26:4 (NIV)
     
  14. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    ad hominems have nothing to do with discussions about ideas
     
  15. Daemon Sophic

    Daemon Sophic Avatar in flux

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    The concept of free will in my opinion is larger than your OP and the replies I have seen so far. Free will supposes that the universe is not pre-determined.

    There is a basic premise, which is that free will cannot coexist with an omniscient being. If something out there (let’s call it “God”) knows what you’re going to do or think next, or even what your great-grand-child will think or do next one century from now, then everything that we think we are doing is simply predetermined fate. If it can be read ahead of time, then you were not actually making any spontaneous decisions that were not predictable.
    Conversely, if you have an idea pop into your head, and some “God” says, “Wow! I didn’t know he was going to think that!”, then that entity is NOT an all knowing entity, and while it may be a god-like being, it is definitively NOT The God.

    Additionally, while obliterating the possibility of a universal God, free will would also eliminate the possibility of a purely physical universe. If the motion of every atom and electron and quark is already set up throughout the universe, and all particles are subject to laws of physics, then where they go and how they interact (including with the sodium and potassium channels in the neurons of your brain) are all knowable (even though we currently couldn’t begin to fathom how). What you choose to eat for lunch today could have been influence by how a photon bounced off a hydrogen atom in the vicinity of venus yesterday.
    True free will suggests (demands) the presence of some sort of undefinable “spirit” outside of your body/brain which is able to influence your brain, and yet is not influenced by physical matter and energy within this universe.

    [​IMG]
    ;)
     
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  16. Axe Elf

    Axe Elf Prophet

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    I quoted from the Book of Proverbs, not Hominems.
     
  17. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon shunyadragon
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    True.
     
  18. TheresOnlyNow

    TheresOnlyNow The Mind Is Everything. U R What U Think

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    There's an article about this that some may find of interest.
    Biblical Christianity Denies Free Will

    I would agree there can be no such thing as human free will within the domain of that which describes itself as God in scripture.

    We're told, all things are pre-planned according to God's will, purpose, and for his glory. Even in matters of salvation. Those who would be saved were pre-determined and by name by God. And before God created the planet where the whole sin/redemption paradigm would begin.
     
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  19. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon shunyadragon
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    Many Christians claim the Biblical text describes a libertarian Free Will. The reality is likely some where in between,

    Science at present describes a naturally deterministic human will with a possible degree of free will described as compatabilism with a limited range of choices in human decision making processes.

    To add some scientists propose a completely deterministic human will.

    I believe humans have a potential of limited Free Will,but by far most humans do not make use of this possibility.
     
    #19 shunyadragon, Dec 24, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2018
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  20. shunyadragon

    shunyadragon shunyadragon
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    This definition has a problem and that is the claim that humans 'act freely' without outside influences. The evidence indicates that the possible ability to ' act freely' is very limited at best.
     
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