For what reason do you think that its God's responsibility to answer your questions ?

[chinu]

Who, me? I don't think I do.

Any questions relating to God I might have are directed those who propose the concept, not to God himself.

Instead of wasting your time on those who propose the concept, why didn't you asked to God himself ?

 

[LuisDantas]

Instead of wasting your time on those who propose the concept, why didn't you asked to God himself ?

Because that makes no sense, for one.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

But, for what reason do you think that its God's responsibility to answer your questions ?

I dont bother God and he doesn't bother me. Works for both of us. Some of his followers are less considerate, but then again, some are amongst my best friends.

 

[chinu]

I dont bother God and he doesn't bother me. Works for both of us. Some of his followers are less considerate, but then again, some are amongst my best friends.

And God also says.. I don't bother lewisnotmiller and he doesn't bother me. Works for both of us. Some of his friends are less considerate, but then again, All are my children.

 

[chinu]

Because that makes no sense, for one.

Until ?

 

[HonestJoe]

Than I'll leave you saying Good bye, because, if you can really talk to God than of course it makes me clear that you need not any discussion about it.

So you've no interest in hearing from someone in touch with God who might challenge your beliefs about him? That's telling.

I will not establish one final detail of God because different people have different point of views.

You already have established some details of God - that was the whole point of this thread. What you're saying is that you won't (can't) answer specific direct questions because you're not here to question your own beliefs about God, you're just here to proselytise them.

But, yes, I'd love to understand your point of view to have a meaningful discussion between us.

My point of view is simple. We don't (and, to date, can't) know anything about whether any gods exist or their nature if they do and so acting in a particular way on the basis of belief in any specific deity is irrational. I'm happy to discuss those starting points though.

No problem. I'd also love to continue a hypothetical thought too.

You've not started on a hypothetical. You're claiming definitive and unquestionable facts about God. The idea that God could be anything other than how you perceive him doesn't appear to be an option.

 

[LuisDantas]

Until ?

Until I have any reason to believe in a deity, perhaps. Or most likely never.

 

[chinu]

So you've no interest in hearing from someone in touch with God who might challenge your beliefs about him? That's telling.

Actually, without wasting any time I simply just want to give-up, if such kinda person is in front of me.

You already have established some details of God - that was the whole point of this thread. What you're saying is that you won't (can't) answer specific direct questions because you're not here to question your own beliefs about God, you're just here to proselytise them.

Instead of proselytising, I want to know what is wrong in what I have established.

My point of view is simple. We don't (and, to date, can't) know anything about whether any gods exist or their nature if they do and so acting in a particular way on the basis of belief in any specific deity is irrational. I'm happy to discuss those starting points though.

You mean you cannot see anybody above you, If you see yourself in the starting ?

You've not started on a hypothetical. You're claiming definitive and unquestionable facts about God. The idea that God could be anything other than how you perceive him doesn't appear to be an option.

Of course, that is the thing which makes this topic more interesting to me.
Hypothetical discussions always give hypothetical results. Why should I state it hypothetical ?

 

[chinu]

Until I have any reason to believe in a deity, perhaps. Or most likely never.

Reasons cannot be created. Reasons become.
And for me the reason has become.

 

[LuisDantas]

Reasons cannot be created. Reasons become.
And for me the reason has become.

Then you will have to live with the knowledge that some people, myself included, don't share that reason, won't you?

 

[HonestJoe]

Actually, without wasting any time I simply just want to give-up, if such kinda person is in front of me.

Why would it be a waste of time? They could have vital insights for you. Isn't it just that you don't want to hear challenges to your beliefs that you can't dismiss in your usually way?

Instead of proselytising, I want to know what is wrong in what I have established.

It's unsupported speculation that you're promoting as definitive fact. It also sometimes shifts and changes when logical inconsistencies are claimed.

You mean you cannot see anybody above you

No, I mean exactly what I said - we don't know anything about any gods. There are various people "above" me in various contexts - legally, politically, economically, professionally, intellectually. I'm "above" some others in those contexts too.

Hypothetical discussions always give hypothetical results. Why should I state it hypothetical ?

I don't think you should. The problem is that without any evidence to support your claims, it's hypothetical by default. You just won't admit that.

 

[chinu]

Then you will have to live with the knowledge that some people, myself included, don't share that reason, won't you?

If I know that where's water is in the desert than of course I can take someone there. But If am thirsty, I cannot make someone thirsty, if one isn't yet.
Thus.. sadly I have to live with that thirst, alone.

Thirst arises,
Thirst isn't a knowledge.
Similarly, the Reason to believe in deity is.

Dear, if you think that the arise of Reason to believe in a deity is a good thing, than you are getting something very wrong because according to me it's kinda sickness. And I pray God even to keep away my enemy from such a sickness.

 

[LuisDantas]

If I know that where's water is in the desert than of course I can take someone there. But If am thirsty, I cannot make someone thirsty, if one isn't yet.
Thus.. sadly I have to live with that thirst, alone.

If you say so.

I think you mean to say something about unbelievers, but I'm not sure.

Thirst arises,
Thirst isn't a knowledge.
Similarly, the Reason to believe in deity is.

To you, it apparently is.

To me it is not. That is just how things are.

Dear, if you think that the arise of Reason to believe in a deity is a good thing,

No, I do not.

It would probably be a bad thing if it were likely to arise, which it is not.

than you are getting something very wrong because according to me it's kinda sickness. And I pray God even to keep away my enemy from such a sickness

.

This is so very abstract to me, but I guess I agree.

 

[chinu]

Why would it be a waste of time? They could have vital insights for you. Isn't it just that you don't want to hear challenges to your beliefs that you can't dismiss in your usually way?

I want to hear the challenges.

It's unsupported speculation that you're promoting as definitive fact. It also sometimes shifts and changes when logical inconsistencies are claimed.

But how ?

No, I mean exactly what I said - we don't know anything about any gods. There are various people "above" me in various contexts - legally, politically, economically, professionally, intellectually. I'm "above" some others in those contexts too.

No, you think that if you failed to know about God, than no one else can.

I don't think you should. The problem is that without any evidence to support your claims, it's hypothetical by default. You just won't admit that.

One can consider it hypothetical if one want. I don't have any problem

 

[HonestJoe]

I appreciate there is a language barrier here but could you at least try to answer straight questions with straight answers?

I want to hear the challenges.

So why would it be a waste of your time to discuss with someone (else) who has direct contact with God?

No, you think that if you failed to know about God, than no one else can.

No, we as the human race don't know whether any god or gods exists and, if they do, what their true nature would be. It's perfectly possible that you've failed to know about the real god, but you're apparently unwilling to even consider that possibility.

 

[Nietzsche]

Okay, if that is case.. that you are unhappy with.. that your were created without your permission. Than I don't think there's any question of your which is un-answered.
What is your question ?

Why was I made? And more importantly, why was I made to suffer?

 

[Parsimony]

There's a lot of difference between electing someone and giving charge to someone.

In what ways are they different enough that it is of significance in this discussion? Why would it be that electing someone gives them a responsibility to answer your questions but simply putting them in charge would not?

 

[Ouroboros]

I think.. No, God doesn't require we may know him.

That's why I said "if there is." I don't think there is a God that requires that we know him either. But if there were one such God, that demanded that we knew him, then it would also be God's duty to inform.

Neither God demands anything.

I agree. Than what ?

Nothing. I was talking in the hypothetical of a God that fits the evangelical Christianity version, a God who condemns people if they don't know him.

When you started listening to nature, its the real prayer. But, when you pray its kinda Claim hided in the prayer, i think.

Yup. Agree. Many prayers are more like curses and blessings, and the attempt to fix things in the world by using the right magical formulas and keywords.

If the question is.. What is prayer ?
Than my answer is.. According to me the true-prayer doesn't need any specific Time, Place, Style, Rites or Ritual etc.. The whims of prayer automatically start coming out of human mind when one looses all hopes from all sides. In fact that's the time when true prayer begins.That what is true prayer is, indeed.

Absolutely agree. Today, I consider every moment of thought, insight, even discussion here with you as a form of prayer. I am at this moment communicating with God by talking to you. Fell special yet?

Dear, Ouroboros.
According to me.. almost most of us fail to notice the moments when we really pray. Those moments are our most humble, meek moments of life. Such moments are very far away from any/all kinds of claim. pride and ego.

Yup. I hear ya'. I can feel being in mediation or prayer while driving the car. I've had spiritual experience by eating food that just triggers the right memories, emotions, and such. Music can set me in a mood of contemplation like prayer. And so on.

Where there is claim, there's pride and ego.
Where there is true-prayer, there's NO-claim.

Sounds good to me.

 

[chinu]

Why was I made? And more importantly, why was I made to suffer?

Actually.. In the beginning YOU created a game for yourself to play, but before stepping into this game there was a question in YOUR mind.

Q: How can such a game give true enjoyment until you may forget you are the creator of this game ? Thus.. you turned this game into an illusion game, Which means that you will forget everything, your power, your rank, your place, your status, after jumping into that game.

But again an another new question got arise, Q: As You will forget everything about yourself after jumping into that game, than who will pull you out when you will get tired after playing a lot ? Thus, by giving all of yours powers you created a CLONE of yourself and gave him the duty to pull you out.

Now, asked the clone; Sir, how will i come to know that you are really tired of this game ? YOU said; when i'll cry and beg in front of you to take me out of this game like as you have created me, rather than i created you. And finally by saying this YOU jumped into that game.

 

[chinu]

That's why I said "if there is." I don't think there is a God that requires that we know him either. But if there were one such God, that demanded that we knew him, then it would also be God's duty to inform.


Nothing. I was talking in the hypothetical of a God that fits the evangelical Christianity version, a God who condemns people if they don't know him.


Yup. Agree. Many prayers are more like curses and blessings, and the attempt to fix things in the world by using the right magical formulas and keywords.


Absolutely agree. Today, I consider every moment of thought, insight, even discussion here with you as a form of prayer. I am at this moment communicating with God by talking to you. Fell special yet?


Yup. I hear ya'. I can feel being in mediation or prayer while driving the car. I've had spiritual experience by eating food that just triggers the right memories, emotions, and such. Music can set me in a mood of contemplation like prayer. And so on.


Sounds good to me.

Thankyou