Do you believe that Baha`u'llah is Jesus Christ?

[TashaN]

Hi my friends.

I'm sorry because i jump from the time to another to disturb with my questions , that's because i havn't meet a Baha'i before so my information is so little about Baha'i faith.

Before few months a go, i was discussing with my lovely friend Popey in a topic then he gave me this information which shocked me because i never heard of it before.

I heard from him, and i would love to see your opnions about it.

I wish he wouldn't mind using his post here in the discussion.

What is the Qur'anic basis for deciding that Jesus will live a man's life and father children after His return? Both the Bab and Baha`u'llah fathered children, by the way.

There is no authority lost between the announcement of the Bab (Mahdi) and the announcement ofIsa (Baha`u'llah) because the authority of the Mahdi is in place until the appearance of Isa. So the issue in that time frame of nineteen years is moot. I would point out that the station of revelation was acknowledged by both Those Apostles (the Bab and Baha`u'llah) and They DO lead together.

Do you believe Isa (Jesus Christ) came again and he was actually, Baha`u'llah?

My second questions is, is the Jihad for Allah rocommanded in Baha'i faith or it's banned as i read so once.

 

[Booko]

Do you believe Isa (Jesus Christ) came again and he was actually, Baha`u'llah?

Baha'u'llah is the return of the Christ in the same way that John the Baptist was the return of Elijah. Obviously it was a different body and different name, but the Spirit is the same one.

That's the short answer, anyway. It's 1:30am here.

My second questions is, is the Jihad for Allah rocommanded in Baha'i faith or it's banned as i read so once.

Jihad is now abrogated as a law.

If the time is come for the world to enter into the era of peace that God has promised in so many religions, then it would be kinda obvious that we should not require jihad any more.

We are not allowed to defend ourselves if we are attacked for our faith either.

It's not the same situation Muhammad and the early Muslims faced. They could have been wiped out early on if God had not permitted them to defend themselves.

 

[Booko]

I believe that the second comming will fufil the prophecys one way or another. If the dude hasnt, then why would i think hes the second comming? He may be a enlightened person but that doesnt make him a khristos.

You're quite right, Ophiuchus. It would be very unwise to just accept anyone who comes along and makes such a claim without investigating his teachings and his life very carefully.

 

[Ophiuchus]

To tell the truth i do not know much about bahu'i faith, but i do know that there is a reason for Christ's second comming and there are many events that have been forcasted for that time that had not come to pass in the time of your founder.

 

[Booko]

To tell the truth i do not know much about bahu'i faith, but i do know that there is a reason for Christ's second comming and there are many events that have been forcasted for that time that had not come to pass in the time of your founder.

No, not all of them are completed yet. World peace hasn't exactly broken out yet, that much is obvious.

Would you like to mention a few?

 

[Ophiuchus]

The main reason why i cannot accept Baha'u'llah as my saviour is that he has not saved me. The second reason is that i do not believe that Christ would leave his people behind.

 

[Booko]

The main reason why i cannot accept Baha'u'llah as my saviour is that he has not saved me. The second reason is that i do not believe that Christ would leave his people behind.

Why do you think Christ would have left His people behind?

Did Moses leave his people behind?

Some of his people became Christians. More did not.

 

[Ophiuchus]

As i recall it he didnt leave his people behind, rather he died claiming he was the King of the Jews.

 

[BruceDLimber]

Hi!

The main reason why i cannot accept Baha'u'llah as my saviour is that he has not saved me. The second reason is that i do not believe that Christ would leave his people behind.

No Divine Messenger EVER deserts humanity!

And according to the Bible, all Baha'is are indeed saved because every one of us accepts and believes in Christ (as well as in the Bible itself)!

And if you do some reading, you'll find that most of the prophecies have already been fulfilled, and the rest are in the progress of fulfillment.... I refer you to such websites as http://bci.org/prophecy-fulfilled for the details.

Regards,

Bruce

 

[TashaN]

Baha'u'llah is the return of the Christ in the same way that John the Baptist was the return of Elijah. Obviously it was a different body and different name, but the Spirit is the same one.

So, Jesus came using another body, Baha'u'llah's body? and he passed away again?

Ok then, thanks for answering this ..

Jihad is now abrogated as a law.

My friend Popey sent to me once Al_Kalimatu_l_Maknunih (Hidden words) and in the last verse it was saying that:
........ if you couldn't find an ink from the bottom of you heart so write it by the red ink which shed in the name of me because it's the most sweetest thing ever, so the light remain forever. (somthing like that because sometimes i have difficulties in translating some arabic words to english one).

Does the red ink which shed is blood? or somthing else?

This was my understanding from the arabic version.

يَا ابْنَ الإِنْسانِ​

اكتُبْ كُلَّ ما أَلْقَيْنَاكَ مِنْ مِدادِ النُّورِ عَلَى لَوْحِ الرُّوحِ. وَإِنْ لَنْ تَقْدِرَ عَلَى ذلِكَ فاجْعَلِ المِدادَ مِنْ جَوْهَرِ الفُؤادِ، وَإِنْ لَنْ تَسْتَطِيعَ فَاكْتُبْ مِنَ المِدَادِ الأَحْمَرِ الَّذِي سُفِكَ فِي سَبيلي؛ إِنَّهُ أَحْلَى عِنْدِي مِنْ كُلِّ شَيْءٍ، لِيَثْبُتَ نُورُهُ إِلَى الأَبَدِ.

34​

I noticed that the arabic one is only 34 verses which makes this one i just posted the last verse but the english version is actually about 82 verses.


34. O SON OF MAN!

The spirit of holiness beareth unto thee the joyful tidings of reunion; wherefore dost thou grieve? The spirit of power confirmeth thee in His cause; why dost thou veil thyself? The light of His countenance doth lead thee; how canst thou go astray?

http://bahai-library.com/?file=bahaullah_hidden_words

I believe, i'm missing somthing here, whether that the arabic one (kalimat almaknoona) is under another name in english rather than (hidden words) or that i mixed up with another hidden words. I have no idea. :bonk:

Please would you help me in founding out that? because the arabic one doesn't match with the english one.

Why do you think Christ would have left His people behind?

Did Moses leave his people behind?

Some of his people became Christians. More did not.

Do you think Moses would feel bad if his people became Christians?


Thanks again ..

 

[9harmony]

Hi Truth,

The Hidden Words of Baha'u'llah is actually written in two parts. The Arabic (71 verses) and the Persian (82 verses). (The 2nd verse you noted is from the Persian)

http://reference.bahai.org/en/t/b/HW/

does that help?

yes, the red ink refers to the blood of the 20,000+ martyrs who died in the early days of His cause. (imho)

as for Moses feeling bad...no, it was His most cherished desire, that His people would recognize His voice.

Have a great day!

-Amy

 

[TashaN]

Hi Truth,

The Hidden Words of Baha'u'llah is actually written in two parts. The Arabic (71 verses) and the Persian (82 verses). (The 2nd verse you noted is from the Persian)

Why there is difference between the Arabic copy and the Persian one in the number of verses?

 

[Booko]

Why there is difference between the Arabic copy and the Persian one in the number of verses?

It's one book, but one section was revealed in Arabic, and the other section was revealed in Farsi. One section is just longer than another, that's all.

 

[Popeyesays]

So, Jesus came using another body, Baha'u'llah's body? and he passed away again?

Ok then, thanks for answering this ..




My friend Popey sent to me once Al_Kalimatu_l_Maknunih (Hidden words) and in the last verse it was saying that:
........ if you couldn't find an ink from the bottom of you heart so write it by the red ink which shed in the name of me because it's the most sweetest thing ever, so the light remain forever. (somthing like that because sometimes i have difficulties in translating some arabic words to english one).

Does the red ink which shed is blood? or somthing else?

This was my understanding from the arabic version.

يَا ابْنَ الإِنْسانِ​

اكتُبْ كُلَّ ما أَلْقَيْنَاكَ مِنْ مِدادِ النُّورِ عَلَى لَوْحِ الرُّوحِ. وَإِنْ لَنْ تَقْدِرَ عَلَى ذلِكَ فاجْعَلِ المِدادَ مِنْ جَوْهَرِ الفُؤادِ، وَإِنْ لَنْ تَسْتَطِيعَ فَاكْتُبْ مِنَ المِدَادِ الأَحْمَرِ الَّذِي سُفِكَ فِي سَبيلي؛ إِنَّهُ أَحْلَى عِنْدِي مِنْ كُلِّ شَيْءٍ، لِيَثْبُتَ نُورُهُ إِلَى الأَبَدِ.

34​

I noticed that the arabic one is only 34 verses which makes this one i just posted the last verse but the english version is actually about 82 verses.


34. O SON OF MAN!

The spirit of holiness beareth unto thee the joyful tidings of reunion; wherefore dost thou grieve? The spirit of power confirmeth thee in His cause; why dost thou veil thyself? The light of His countenance doth lead thee; how canst thou go astray?

http://bahai-library.com/?file=bahaullah_hidden_words

I believe, i'm missing somthing here, whether that the arabic one (kalimat almaknoona) is under another name in english rather than (hidden words) or that i mixed up with another hidden words. I have no idea. :bonk:

Please would you help me in founding out that? because the arabic one doesn't match with the english one.



Do you think Moses would feel bad if his people became Christians?


Thanks again ..

The red ink is the shed blood of martyrs. Thousands of Babi's were martyred between 1850 and 1860. Some say as many as twenty thousand, others figure lower at least 8,000.

The Arabic Hidden Words may be versed differently than the English translation. The Hidden Words in Persian and Arabic were translated by Shoghi Effendi, the Guardian and the grandson of Abdu'l Baha.

How have you been doing, my friend. I have been well, but was working very hard on a novel which I just finished last week. So now begins the weary task of finding an agent or publisher to take the book for publication.

I do not think Moses would have objected to His people accepting Jesus, or Muhammad. Moses probably understood His link in the chain as well as the chain itself sufficiently to know that all the Voices are One Voice.

Regards,
Scott

 

[TashaN]

Thanks for the information

 

[Popeyesays]

The Truth says: "So, Jesus came using another body, Baha'u'llah's body? and he passed away again?

Ok then, thanks for answering this .. "

This isn't quite the case. We believe the Apostles of God are in one sense One and the Same, and in another sense one cannot deny that They are separate people living in separate places and times.

We don't view this as a dichotomy, but rather as a Unity on a plane of reality we can only begin to understand.

Regards,
Scott

P.S. Good to see you, too Brother Truth.

 

[BruceDLimber]

Hi!

Baha'u'llah, the Founder of the Baha'i Faith, IOV fulfills the prophecies of the spiritual Return of the Christ Spirit, but is a different person from Jesus Himself. There is a distinction to be made here....

Further questions are most welcome.

Peace,

Bruce

 

[CDRaider]

Jihad is now abrogated as a law.

If the time is come for the world to enter into the era of peace that God has promised in so many religions, then it would be kinda obvious that we should not require jihad any more.

We are not allowed to defend ourselves if we are attacked for our faith either.

It's not the same situation Muhammad and the early Muslims faced. They could have been wiped out early on if God had not permitted them to defend themselves.

What is happening with the situation in Iran. I know that Baha'is are persecuted there. What can they do about it if they are not allowed to defend themselves? Sorry I'm a little ignorant on the topic.

 

[arthra]

What is happening with the situation in Iran. I know that Baha'is are persecuted there. What can they do about it if they are not allowed to defend themselves? Sorry I'm a little ignorant on the topic.

Well we get little bits and pieces of what is happening in Iran and sometimes only partially know about things.... The Faith is outlawed in Iran and there are no Baha'i Institutions allowed to function there... The Baha'is however continue their beliefs even under the oppression of their Faith.. The power of prayer and the knowledge that if the Baha'is are persecuted it will become instantly known around the world and in the international community are probably the only things that are a source of support.

Any organized resistance using say arms would be an open invitation to the "authorities" to escalate violence and reprisals and confirm their dakest suspicions and it would also violate our principles and teachings. Personal self defence however is permitted under desparate circumstances.

- Art

 

[Muffled]

Baha'u'llah is the return of the Christ in the same way that John the Baptist was the return of Elijah. Obviously it was a different body and different name, but the Spirit is the same one.

That's the short answer, anyway. It's 1:30am here.



Jihad is now abrogated as a law.

If the time is come for the world to enter into the era of peace that God has promised in so many religions, then it would be kinda obvious that we should not require jihad any more.

We are not allowed to defend ourselves if we are attacked for our faith either.

It's not the same situation Muhammad and the early Muslims faced. They could have been wiped out early on if God had not permitted them to defend themselves.

Baha'u'llah can not be a reincarnation of Jesus because there was never a prediction of it in Christianity. When He ascended to heaven the angels said that He would return in like manner (as an adult) and the book of the Relvelation corroborates that prediction.
In addition to that are the words of Jesus to the affect that He would not join the apostles on earth until the Kingdom of God comes on earth.