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Did the Pharisees Purposely Make up Christianity?

Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
Something about Galatians 2:11.
It is a clear example of bipolar thinking...since he contradicts himself.
in 1 Corinthians 9:19 he says he does all the time what he accuses Peter of in Galatians 2:12.
What bipolars do. They accuse other of their own doing.
 
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wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
I have to say, anyone who points to themselves as Messiah must be trying to lead people astray!

To deny the calling of Paul and John is also, lMO, a sure sign of heretical views. Sorry, but it needs to be said!
The problem with saying it on a forum, is if later it is proven internationally in a court; then you'd look silly for not realizing the proof was stated in the OP.

I'm not actually the one pointing to myself as the Messiah, I believe we can show it from the world's religious texts as prophesied, and I just find people under educated to know automatically my name proves it.

If we don't fix this religious dilemma, soon mankind ends as Armageddon kicks off, and then the Judgement Day Fire will cleanse here, as God already showed me whilst growing up.

So whereas I know I've fulfilled multiple prophecies, and can remember details from two thousand years ago before reading the texts...

Have had a Near Death Experience, and been back to Heaven - As far as I'm aware, you have a belief in a book about me, then challenge me, when I'm trying to help free you from the Great Deception as prophesied.

In my opinion. :innocent:
 

Brickjectivity

wind and rain touch not this brain
Staff member
Premium Member
Please do take into account that I believe we can prove I'm the return of Christ, here trying to save many of your existences, and though I'm using ReligiousForums as a method of dialogue with the world, much of where I'm coming from has been inspired by God. - In other words, I'm on your side.
Your messianic act is a distraction from RF's mission. Why don't you offer to buy the site? Maybe they will sell it to you. Then you can change the mission, and we can all decide whether we want to be a part of your mission or not.
 

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
so true... and i didn't know just where to start other than "I think you are creating your own interpretation" type of a statement
As saying ask specific questions, and I will address all the scriptures to show it...

As far as I've been told by God I'm here before the Great Tribulation, where billions of souls soon get removed from reality; thus I'm trying to be kind by explaining the Great Deception as prophesied, as I personally do not find it fair to sentence many for not being wise enough to see these errors.

In my opinion. :innocent:
 

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
Your messianic act is a distraction from RF's mission. Why don't you offer to buy the site? Maybe they will sell it to you. Then you can change the mission, and we can all decide whether we want to be a part of your mission or not.
Firstly I do not find a religious discussion a distraction from a religious forum.

If many of the world's religions expect a religious leader to be sent, to help correlate religious ideas, and fix what has been misunderstood; I'd say the goal of religious forums is being fulfilled by our interactions, and I try to be really courteous in stating it is my belief - where I recognize that some people don't want to question their own authenticity.

In terms of buying religious forums: if we can establish Messianic prophecy, then the religious authorities literally will buy the whole site for us; as it correlates the world's religious texts over the last 18 years of interaction on here - Thus thank you for participating.

In my opinion. :innocent:
 

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
What do you think of Mary?
The all three Gospels mention Mary, and they underline her own specific role.
Depends what you're asking... I find women much more capable than men at recalling details of a case; that Yeshua was equalizing some of the chauvinism by the Rabbinic thinking.

Which Mary by the way?

As I don't agree with the Holy Mother ideologies by the Catholic Church; yet I do respect the ideas presented in the Apocryphon of john, and Revelation 12:1-6, that the Messiah is the son of Sophia the 'Goddess of Wisdom.'

Where in Zechariah 5:7-9, Revelation 17:4-6 instead of women being respected as the Matriarchs over our society, they've been degraded into being 'alcoholic prostitutes', 'who don't see the wickedness'.

In my opinion. :innocent:
 

Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
Depends what you're asking... I find women much more capable than men at recalling details of a case; that Yeshua was equalizing some of the chauvinism by the Rabbinic thinking.

Which Mary by the way?

As I don't agree with the Holy Mother ideologies by the Catholic Church; yet I do respect the ideas presented in the Apocryphon of john, and Revelation 12:1-6, that the Messiah is the son of Sophia the 'Goddess of Wisdom.'

Where in Zechariah 5:7-9, Revelation 17:4-6 instead of women being respected as the Matriarchs over our society, they've been degraded into being 'alcoholic prostitutes', 'who don't see the wickedness'.

In my opinion. :innocent:

Of course. :)
I think we should focus on what unites us, and not on what makes us disagree.
I respect your vision, it is incredibly interesting and insightful.

I am terribly sorry if my harsh criticism of Saint Paul might not be pleasant to read, for many Christians. I do not possess the truth.
This is my vision. My personal opinion.
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Yeshua is prophesying in the Parable of the Wicked Husbandmen that the Pharisees will corrupt his message, teaching you get an inheritance from his death; when instead it is saying many will be condemned by God at Judgement Day for believing such a thing.
Jesus was clearly of the Pharisee tradition as they were a very diverse group. Thus saying "the Pharisees..." often ends up being inaccurate.
 

Redemptionsong

Well-Known Member
The idea that Paul would have any legal authority in Damascus seems a bit far fetched. Damascus at that time was not part of Israel or Judea. It would have been a bit like Mexican police crossing the border to arrest some Mexicans for something illegal in Mexico but not in the US.
Damascus at the time was part of the Roman province of Syria. Judea was also under Roman occupation.

Paul, having Roman citizenship, was the ideal person to travel within the territories under Roman control.
 

Goldemar

A queer sort
As far as I can see from the Bible, I believe we can show Paul & Simon the stumbling stone (petros) purposely corrupted the teachings of Yeshua to a more Pharisaic ideology - Creating Christianity between them in Antioch (Acts 11:25-26) with the help of the Sanhedrin.

Where it is also possible to show that the Gospel of John was purposely made up by the Sanhedrin, to corrupt Yeshua's original message.

It is being questioned historically, that the original followers of Yeshua were the Ebionites; which stemmed from the Essenes, then the Nasoraeans & Mandaeans.

It is questioned James the Just was Head of the church of Jerusalem, and an Ebionite; where the terminology 'Poor Ones' was prophesied in Zechariah 11:11 prior to the 2nd temple destruction.

The idea that the Nasoraeans/Mandaeans fled Jerusalem prior to the destruction, is because they were following Yeshua's teachings.

Paul & Simon taught an idea that the Jews were now under Grace, as Christ had died for them; rather than what scripture shows, that they were placed under the Curse of Moses (Deuteronomy 28), because their Worthless Leaders (Sadducees, Pharisees, Levites) rejected the Messiah for 30 pieces of silver (Zechariah 11:1-14).

Proof that the Curse was placed is that in Zechariah 11:9, it repeats the idea that they will eat each others flesh as found in Deuteronomy 28:53-55; where we can show historically, that at the Siege of Jerusalem by the Romans, they literally eat each others flesh due to being starved to death.

To me it is clear that the book of James in the Bible is standing against Paul, on some of the similar concepts that were debated between them. Some of these contrary points, are Paul kicking people out who didn't want to follow his sacrificial Messiah's death & resurrection doctrines, impartially deciding who is worthy of being part of Pauline Christianity, Abraham being faithful, and thus doing good works, etc.

When Revelation 2:2 says about the False Apostle who tried to get them to follow his fake Gospel, Paul also stated that he was rejected by the Church of Asia Minor with his own version of the Gospel (2 Timothy 1:15).

Because over time Christianity has become the main orthodox view on the teachings of Christ, the original ideas have been partially overwritten; yet it is still possible to see from the texts alone, that the original message is still there in the Synoptic Gospels.

I understand it could be possible for us to fix this as part of Messianic prophecy; otherwise in my understanding scripture says God will condemn the Rabbinic Jews for having lied to humanity (Jeremiah 5:26, Isaiah 29:20-21).

It appears to me that what the Pharisees did, is try to cover up the prophesied concepts they'd been cut off, to make the Gentiles follow a system supporting them, and in doing so creating the false representation of the Messiah.

Thus when there are Jewish texts called the Sefer of Zerubbabel that refer to a true, and false Messiah both in Rome; the problem I find, is that the Rabbinic Jews don't realize they've made up the false Messiah contrary to the real one, that they have overwritten. Thus when in Ezekiel 22:3, and other places, it says they made their own idols, this is talking about how they made the Messiah into an idol.

I believe as a provable return of the Messiah it is possible for me to redeem, and fix this situation (Isaiah 52:3-7) - if I can get the support from the Rabbis, to help fix what they've messed up; otherwise Judgement Day will come, and God will just keep the Enlightened Saints who've already noticed.

To quickly summarize the difference between the original followers, and the Pharisaic Christianity: Is that the Pharisees taught an Oral Tradition, that "the death of the righteous, can atone for the sins of that generation"...

Where Yeshua challenged the Sanhedrin, and cut them off, for saying that the murdering of the prophets counted as atoning sacrifices in Matthew 23:27-38, Mark 7:1-13, and the Parable of the Wicked Husbandman (Matthew 21:33-46, Mark 12:1-12, and Luke 20:9-19).

Yeshua is prophesying in the Parable of the Wicked Husbandmen that the Pharisees will corrupt his message, teaching you get an inheritance from his death; when instead it is saying many will be condemned by God at Judgement Day for believing such a thing.

In my opinion. :innocent:

What is your source for saying that the Mandaeans follow(ed) Yeshua?
 

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
Jesus was clearly of the Pharisee tradition as they were a very diverse group. Thus saying "the Pharisees..." often ends up being inaccurate.
For me we have an error in the historical & prophetic understandings of these things, and so I'll try to dissect where I think this comes from:

I find Rabbinic Jews have been taught it makes sense Yeshua's argumentation against the Pharisees, is typical of what the Rabbis do, thus we can assign him as one of them.

Plus because he is commenting on their belief system, as well as the larger Jewish ideas as a whole, it can then be assumed he was one of them.

Yet I believe based on prophecy, and history the Pharisees were a renegade sect that existed since the Babylonian Exile.

The Essenes expected the 2nd temple destruction, as they were none meat eaters, and didn't drink alcohol, whereas the Sanhedrin did (Levites, Sadducees, Pharisees).

In Zechariah 11:1-14 I see it is a continuation of Jeremiah 25, and Daniel 9, where God is fed up with these 'Brutish Leaders' since Babylon (Jeremiah 10:21), who have taken over rulership from God's appointed.

Yeshua challenged the Pharisees to the point of saying if we follow them, we will not enter Heaven (Matthew 5:20), and that they are sending people to the pits of Hell by their doctrines (Matthew 15:14).

Yeshua warned not to be called a Rabbi (Matthew 23:2-11), as originally Moses instructed no hierarchy, so that God could inspire any of the tribe of Israel to correct each other.

Pharisees placed themselves in the seat of Moses, making up oral traditions, and claiming to be the final authority; to the point I've been told by a professor of Kabbalah that he isn't meant to question the Tanakh independently, as the Rabbis decide its meanings.

As far as I understand Yeshua wasn't simply debating meanings as the Rabbis do, he was justifying he was the Messiah (spirit of the Lord) justifying what was meant.

Claiming an archangel (Eloh - אלה) fits into a religious label is part of the problem; religions are made about the beings sent by God, not they can fit into a man-made box.

In my opinion. :innocent:
 

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
What is your source for saying that the Mandaeans follow(ed) Yeshua?
On posting the link on Wikipedia it explains they left Israel prior to the 2nd temple destruction, which I would say is because they heeded Yeshua's warnings.

I'd not say they were completely following him, like the cult mentality that we've seen has come about after; more that they respected John the Baptist, who accepted Yeshua as the Messiah, so we should take into account that they didn't reject him as someone sent by God.

In my opinion. :innocent:
 

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
Does that mean you trust the Bible?
I don't really trust anything in this realm completely, we're down near Hell according to many religious texts globally; we can show most things in this world become corrupted, and the bigger something is, the more potential it has for decay, and corruption.

I respect I can show certain aspects of the Bible fulfilled, and I can show multiple illegitimate books added to the Bible; yet I would say based on years of study, that the Source of reality has purposely allowed these corruptions, to test who is actually paying attention.

Thus do I trust that God has made all of this comprehensive, yes; is it a simple answer of blind faith, no.

In my opinion. :innocent:
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
If you would have at least bothered to have read the midrash, you would see that nothing Shimon Caiapha (which I have since learned is how the name שמעון כיפא should probably be transliterated) did was with the help of the Sanhedrin. Nor is the Sanhedrin actually mentioned in the midrash. He volunteered to do these things, and the other sages supported him, but they never actively assisted him. Nor, once again, are they to be identified with the Sanhedrin. Maybe they were, maybe they weren't.
 

wizanda

One Accepts All Religious Texts
Premium Member
Which books and would you please show how they were added illegitimately?
Tanakh, Synoptic Gospels, James, Jude, Revelation Vs John, Paul, Simon the stone (peter), Ecclesiastes, Leviticus, Lamentations
  • Leviticus - I believe was correlated, and canonized in Babylon from the past down Levitical ideas. Where I find it contradicts the standards the prophets tried to correct i.e that God didn't command sacrifice - where they did so since Egypt, so that they could eat meat (Jeremiah 7:21-23, etc). I find it has exaggerated the concepts that were practised by the Israelites; so that it is committing black magic, rather than it being something ceremonial for ritual cleansing.

  • Ecclesiastes - I find to be contrary to Solomon's level of wisdom, and the utterances of many of the prophetic writers; again I think it came from Babylonian thinking.

  • Lamentations - Doesn't align with the Biblical prophets - where as I showed you, we can do Strongs reference searches to find keyword referencing/paraphrasing; again it seems to be Babylonian wishful expectations.

  • John, Paul, Simon were Pharisaic; where I find their thinking flawed, as they've also accepted both the Pharisaic Oral Traditions, and took on board these previous illegitimate ideas.
In my opinion. :innocent:
 
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