Dark Night of the Soul

[YmirGF]

Let me clarify, everyone is in a state of self-contraction, until we are liberated into the causal and the nondual. Self-contraction is the natural state. It's what the myth of the Fall is all about, and a good myth it is! It describes the awareness of the separate self and it's existential dread. We can get more into this later.


I think you'll find what you open to will exceed what you had before. The joy I experienced as a five year in the nakedness of life, is the same joy as now for me, only fuller because I am more than five years old now. I've seen pain, and I hold Beauty in the knowledge of this.

The first part is pretty much what I had in mind in the wee hours early today, but was too rushed to type it out. What I was thinking was that one has outgrown their previous self image, but the new self-image is not yet complete and so one has this lag as reality takes time to catch up. Due to the lag time, one can feel like they are treading in quicksand or molasses and that nothing is changing and that can promote feelings of uncertainty and malaise. Perhaps it is a necessary buffer between the old and the new.

 

[TurkeyOnRye]

I am interested in hearing experiences and perspectives on the dark night of the soul. I am currently struggling with this. How long does it last? Can you do anything about it? Have you been through it? What was it like, and how did you come out of it? Why does it happen?

I would call the dark knight of the soul any protracted period of deep inner reflection that owes to some significant loss of value in one's life. This process involves one or more of myriad forms of suffering. The duration seems to be highly variable and unpredictable.

All of us have been through this and will continue to go through it periodically throughout our existence. I tend to think of suffering as an extreme form of stress, one that doesn't just limit one's creative pursuit, but destroys current outlets involved in pursuit. I once believed there was an ultimate ending to suffering, but I have since learned that as one suffering ends, so another kind begins. Sometimes the onset is sudden, while other times it creeps very slowly. Thankfully, however, the condition of suffering seems to be self-limiting, and is just as temporary as any pleasure. In addition, we usually learn something from our experience--even gain more than we had previously--so there's value in it too.

 

[Orbit]

I think I'm starting to sort it out in my head, the separation from the life stress issues vs. the spiritual issue, though they affect one another. It's not that I'm "cut off" from the ineffable, it's that I don't experience the ineffable with the frequency and intensity that I used to. And I suppose I miss that.

 

[Adramelek]

The first part is pretty much what I had in mind in the wee hours early today, but was too rushed to type it out. What I was thinking was that one has outgrown their previous self image, but the new self-image is not yet complete and so one has this lag as reality takes time to catch up. Due to the lag time, one can feel like they are treading in quicksand or molasses and that nothing is changing and that can promote feelings of uncertainty and malaise. Perhaps it is a necessary buffer between the old and the new.

These "plateaus", which you seem to be describing, are quite common in spiritual development/Initiation, they are to be expected. A dark night of the soul, however, is something very different.

 

[YmirGF]

I think I'm starting to sort it out in my head, the separation from the life stress issues vs. the spiritual issue, though they affect one another. It's not that I'm "cut off" from the ineffable, it's that I don't experience the ineffable with the frequency and intensity that I used to. And I suppose I miss that.

Then think of it as a precursor to heightened appreciation and experience. The experience is in perpetual change and when we try to cling to aspects of it we create problems for ourselves. It might sound superficial due to its obvious nature, but attitude plays a big part here, as does expectation. Think of it as trying to squeeze into a pair of beloved jeans from yesteryear that no longer fit. You can try and put them on but you will likely become quite frustrated during the ordeal. Likewise, if you manage to get them on, somehow, they won't feel very good and you will quickly go back to square one.

These "plateaus", which you seem to be describing, are quite common in spiritual development/Initiation, they are to be expected. A dark night of the soul, however, is something very different.

I'm pretty aware of that Adramelek, the point is not to feed the beast, as it were. Don't give in to the feeling of isolation and all its entrapping qualities.

 

[mystic64]

Orbit you are a mystic's mystic ! You just are. Based on my experience the problem is that you keep doing meditations that "expand" your consciousness. Quit doing them and the dark night of the soul stuff will go away . Everything that everybody has posted so far to explain the dark night of the soul, based on my experience, is pretty much right on. The way that I explain it, relative to understanding it myself, is that the dark night of the soul experience is a pre cognative leap experience. You expand your consciousness which then causes you to receive (download) new information, your mind then processes that information, and you then experience a cognative leap in understanding. And durring the processing part of the process you experience the dark night of the soul stuff. I have, after years of this stuff, reached the point where I understand that when the dark night of the soul kicks in that the next thing that is going to happen is a cognative leap in understanding and that the deeper the dark night of the soul experience is the greater the cognative leap . That is of course if you can get through it without doing yourself in .

So, because I refuse to give up the expanding of consciousness meditations, inspite of the emotional state caused by the information processing part of the process, and because I am a yogi , I do meditations that counter balance the physiological effects of the depression caused by the information processing part of the process that is sometimes called the dark night of the soul. The meditations that I do is to raise my eyebrows up a little, feel the bridge of my nose as a perfectly streight line, and then feel the back part of the "roof" of my mouth. From there I hold the three aspects of that meditian until my mind wanders off into something else. When that happens I redo the meditation. And I have reached the point to where I can do this meditation whether I am sitting or doing something. And if you are sitting, feel the effect that this meditation has on your nervous system. It causes your body to feel happy inspite of your mind being in a state of depression . What it is that is happening is that you are stimulating consciously your autonomic nervous system in a positive way (what you put thought into lights up and is activated) to counter balance the effect that the subconscious mind is having on your nervous system in a negative way (shutting things down) because it is in a state of depression (change ).

Anyway, I am in a constant state of depression because of the processing part caused by the meditations that I do that cause constant deep jumps into the "unknown", but my body doesn't know it because I am over riding the effects that subconscious mind has on it with my conscious mind. I do this active meditation the instant that I feel depression coming on and it seems to work quite nicely.

If you would quit being a mystic Orbit and go get a life , the dark night of the soul stuff will go away.

 

[TurkeyOnRye]

If you would quit being a mystic Orbit and go get a life , the dark night of the soul stuff will go away.

Hehehe...I quite like this. Based on experience, I can say when we focus on the practical aspects of our life, the spiritual aspects naturally sky-rocket.

 

[mystic64]

Hehehe...I quite like this. Based on experience, I can say when we focus on the practical aspects of our life, the spiritual aspects naturally sky-rocket.

Hi Turkey and welcome to the world of a mystic . What you have proposed here is seriously interesting. Basically what you are saying is that we normal mystics are probably doing it all wrong. Basically what you are saying is that we should focus on the practical aspects of life to find and experience the Divine instead of focusing on the metaphysical to find and experience the Divine. Humm ? Maybe. But I can not do that because life for me as an experience has never been fun. Ever. To me life is an ugly sucker and there is not any loving God in it. There has to be a loving God some place, so I am seeking "It" in the metaphysical as a mystic. I can not find/see a predictably loving God in the practical aspects of life. I admit that there seems to be some folks that are able to focus on the practical aspects of life and find a loving God/entity/force with that focus, but I have no idea how they do it . None . I do admit that being a mysic is no picnic, but you do learn a lot of interest stuff if one is persistant at it. Have I found a "predictably" loving God yet? No, I haven't. But, what I have found is a predicably loving entity in Christ Jesus. His Father that is in Heaven not so much . He is not predictable. Lord Shiva is a loving predictable entity, but he tears everything a part and then puts it back together better. But, the tearing of everything a part part can be very disturbing . I love Lord Shiva dearly, but based on my experience with him, i am very careful with what I request from him .

"Finding and experiencing the Divine by focusing on the practical aspects of life." I like the idea, but Turkey I have no idea how to do it. None.

 

[TurkeyOnRye]

Basically what you are saying is that we normal mystics are probably doing it all wrong.

No, I would suggest that we are doing it the best way we know how.

But I can not do that because life for me as an experience has never been fun. Ever. To me life is an ugly sucker and there is not any loving God in it.

God doesn't exactly whisper in our ears. But if he did, would you listen to him unquestioningly? God is a quiet ******* and doesn't really figure into our existence, whether he/it exists or not. I've cried bloody rage wishing for intervention numerous times. What I learned is that to some extent, we do get our wishes, but it's never quite how we expect. And some things just take time to make sense of. That requires a LOT of patience.

There has to be a loving God some place, so I am seeking "It" in the metaphysical as a mystic. I can not find/see a predictably loving God in the practical aspects of life.

Remember, there is no real distinction between the metaphysical and the physical. The border between the two was purely imaginary.

I admit that there seems to be some folks that are able to focus on the practical aspects of life and find a loving God/entity/force with that focus, but I have no idea how they do it .

If it were a matter of "how," there would probably be an instruction manual out there to do it. Having said that, some people find it easy to believe in nonsense. I find it rather difficult and not the least bit satisfying.

I do admit that being a mysic is no picnic, but you do learn a lot of interest stuff if one is persistant at it. Have I found a "predictably" loving God yet? No, I haven't. But, what I have found is a predicably loving entity in Christ Jesus. His Father that is in Heaven not so much . He is not predictable. Lord Shiva is a loving predictable entity, but he tears everything a part and then puts it back together better. But, the tearing of everything a part part can be very disturbing . I love Lord Shiva dearly, but based on my experience with him, i am very careful with what I request from him .

If you're looking for a persistent loving connection with the divine, I would advise you to stop holding your breath. You should realize these entities from literature merely describe aspects of your own self. As a side note, I do have quite a soft spot for Jesus. Much of what he said felt pretty spot-on to me as a child. I never really liked any other parts of the Bible though.[/QUOTE]

 

[mystic64]

Well Turkey, you are very right on ! But if I just flat agree with you, then there is not any discussion (Debate is outlawed in this DR ). So, humm? "some people find it easy to believe in "nonsense"." Turkey you would have to define your version of nonsense because most folks find most of what I say as nonsense.

"God doesn't exactly whisper in our ears. But if he did, would you listen to him unquestioningly? God is a quiet ******* and doesn't really figure into our existence, whether he/it exists or not. I've cried bloody rage wishing for intervention numerous times. What I learned is that to some extent, we do get our wishes, but it's never quite how we expect. And some things just take time to make sense of. That requires a LOT of patience." Turkey what you have posted here has been the ultimate quest for understanding of my goal as a mystic since I was five years old when I had my first mystic experience when I made my first prayer to God in the name of Jesus Christ. After sixty years and thousands of hours of meditation I find what you are saying very insightful . Based on my experience God can whisper in one's mind. And that voice, just like all other voices, sounds just like one's own voice. Which causes some folks to think that it is theirself that is talking to them. I am extremely empathic and somewhat telepathic. Because of this I pick up a lot of emotions and thoughts that are not mine but they all sound and feel like they are mine. Now what I have learned over the years is that every mind has its own unique electro magnetic frequency and that even though these differences between different minds are subtle, one can learn to tell the difference between these thought and emotional sources. God has a different emf signature than all other minds/thought sources and when God talks to me I listen. The problem is that I do not always agree with Him and I have to go to Lord Jesus about it because there is a high probability that I am missing something . What I have learned over the years is that God is not like we are and that He exists in a totally different reality than we do. And, that He has the mind of an extremely bright child who is inclined to be loving. He has never experienced fear or vulnerablity or want of anything and the concept of power never enters into His mind reality. Because God is so radically different than we are, the mind changes that we go through as we explore His mind reality are what cause the "dark night of the soul" stuff because that amount of radical change is terrifying. Now, this is with the understanding that there is a higher self and that one's higher self is not as frightening to explore. And based on my experience this higher self is not what we are generally calling God. But you have to be at one with your higher self to truely understand God (until you are as a child you will not see the Kingdom of Heaven), so exploring and learning from your higher self is an extremely constructive endeaver and not to be discouraged in any way, shape, or form.

So anyway Turkey, welcome to "my" world of nonsense .