Couldn't have said it better myself...

[YoursTrue]

You are being inconsistent. You might as well call the whole story symbolic. First, we know that it is myth. Second the morals in it are abysmal. Instead of claiming that your God is a monster you should just call it a morality tale.

Again -- if you're going to look at it, the 7th day has not closed. It's still going. Please read my other comment to Brian2 about how that 'day' could not possibly have been a 24-hour period, whether you want to say that's what it means or not.
Regardless, again -- no matter how a person looks at it, only humans make and wear clothes. There's more, but I'll leave it there for the moment. (Moment? or time, which might it be? Have a good day/evening.)

 

[SkepticThinker]

I think I answered your point in my first post to you. We are all perpetrators and all victims. God offers forgiveness to all of us if we accept the offer.
If that is an immoral offer by God in your mind then so be it.

No we are not. And definitely not in the scenarios we were discussing. That's just one of the warped views your religion pushes, as noted. The religion you follow tells you that it's moral. But when you actually think it through it becomes pretty obvious how immoral it actually is.

Don't you think it's strange that you had to bail out on the specific examples we were talking about and instead bring up some sort of vague and broad notion of "we are all perpetrators and victims" as though that comes anywhere near addressing the issues I've brought up about your belief system?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Again -- if you're going to look at it, the 7th day has not closed. It's still going. Please read my other comment to Brian2 about how that 'day' could not possibly have been a 24-hour period, whether you want to say that's what it means or not.

How long do you claim the first 6 days were?

Regardless, again -- no matter how a person looks at it, only humans make and wear clothes. There's more, but I'll leave it there for the moment. (Moment? or time, which might it be? Have a good day/evening.)

And again I have to ask, so what? What's your point with this?

 

[Brian2]

No we are not. And definitely not in the scenarios we were discussing. That's just one of the warped views your religion pushes, as noted. The religion you follow tells you that it's moral. But when you actually think it through it becomes pretty obvious how immoral it actually is.

Don't you think it's strange that you had to bail out on the specific examples we were talking about and instead bring up some sort of vague and broad notion of "we are all perpetrators and victims" as though that comes anywhere near addressing the issues I've brought up about your belief system?

No I don't think it is strange to stand back and see the forest instead of just focusing on the trees.
Some people can't see the forest for the trees.

We are the victims, how are we the perpetrators, we are innocent. God offers forgiveness to even the innocent victims so I guess that means God doesn't know what He is talking about because we are victims. And God wants us victims to try to forgive those who have harmed us just as He has forgiven us. Doesn't He realise that we are innocent and in no need of forgiveness and that those who have harmed us should be made to pay in some way and we should be compensated for any loss we have suffered at the hands of others. God must be not only stupid by immoral for seeing us as guilty and not giving to us what we think we deserve and would have had if we were not attacked by the perpetrators. The whole thing is not fair. Why should we forgive anyone? Why should those who have harmed us be forgiven and end up in heaven if we don't or if we end up there with them and not above them somehow?

 

[SkepticThinker]

No I don't think it is strange to stand back and see the forest instead of just focusing on the trees.
Some people can't see the forest for the trees.

We are the victims, how are we the perpetrators, we are innocent. God offers forgiveness to even the innocent victims so I guess that means God doesn't know what He is talking about because we are victims. And God wants us victims to try to forgive those who have harmed us just as He has forgiven us. Doesn't He realise that we are innocent and in no need of forgiveness and that those who have harmed us should be made to pay in some way and we should be compensated for any loss we have suffered at the hands of others. God must be not only stupid by immoral for seeing us as guilty and not giving to us what we think we deserve and would have had if we were not attacked by the perpetrators. The whole thing is not fair. Why should we forgive anyone? Why should those who have harmed us be forgiven and end up in heaven if we don't or if we end up there with them and not above them somehow?

Yes, this is an immoral system, as you've demonstrated throughout this discussion.
A system of morality where Jeffrey Dahmer ends up in heaven forever while his victims do not, and receive zero restitution in the one and only life we know we get for sure, is no system of morality at all.

I agree that God is stupid and immoral, if this is the system "he" created. Especially if we're all viewed as disgusting sinners from the get-go. Sorry, but Jeffrey Dahmer is much worse person than I am. Or you.

 

[Muffled]

Parts never happened. They would fit under the category of myth.

I believe I don't know of any and don't know how you could.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I believe I don't know of any and don't know how you could.

I know how to apply science properly. It is not that hard if one an do that. Also there is history. That helps on some of the more recent wrong claims.

One question, can God lie?

 

[Hawkins]

OP is fallacious. The true question is rather, if hell is true (let's assume so for the sake of argument), then how can this truth be conveyed to humans.

 

[Brian2]

Yes, this is an immoral system, as you've demonstrated throughout this discussion.
A system of morality where Jeffrey Dahmer ends up in heaven forever while his victims do not, and receive zero restitution in the one and only life we know we get for sure, is no system of morality at all.

I agree that God is stupid and immoral, if this is the system "he" created. Especially if we're all viewed as disgusting sinners from the get-go. Sorry, but Jeffrey Dahmer is much worse person than I am. Or you.

So God's mercy is evil because God is willing to forgive people that you see as more evil than you are if they turn to Him and accept that forgiveness, and people who are less evil than those forgiven are going to be condemned.
You do seem to make the mistake of thinking that all people who are not Christians are going to be condemned at the final judgement however.
Another mistake you seem to make is that because Jeffrey Dahmer is forgiven that means that all people whom you think are less evil that he should also be forgiven.
The way I see the gospel is that eternal life is given as a gift for all those who accept the gift and the rest go through the judgement and possible get what their sins deserve if mercy is not extended to them. But of course we can't preempt the judgement and make our own call on what it will be or should be. It is only God who knows the hearts of people.

 

[SkepticThinker]

So God's mercy is evil because God is willing to forgive people that you see as more evil than you are if they turn to Him and accept that forgiveness, and people who are less evil than those forgiven are going to be condemned.
You do seem to make the mistake of thinking that all people who are not Christians are going to be condemned at the final judgement however.
Another mistake you seem to make is that because Jeffrey Dahmer is forgiven that means that all people whom you think are less evil that he should also be forgiven.
The way I see the gospel is that eternal life is given as a gift for all those who accept the gift and the rest go through the judgement and possible get what their sins deserve if mercy is not extended to them. But of course we can't preempt the judgement and make our own call on what it will be or should be. It is only God who knows the hearts of people.

What you've just described again is an immoral system.

And again, you've completely ignored my entire point about the victims never receiving proper restitution, which was my main point of contention in the first place.

 

[Muffled]

I know how to apply science properly. It is not that hard if one an do that. Also there is history. That helps on some of the more recent wrong claims.

One question, can God lie?

I believe in this case science and history are useless.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I believe in this case science and history are useless.

And then you would be wrong. You are in effect admitting that neither history nor science agree with the Bible when you do that.

It appears that you do know for the Bible to be literally true that God would have to be a liar. Why not just admit it?