Could There Be A Miracle For the Unbeliever?

[Charity]

This question would mostly be for the atheist or the unbeliever of the Christian Faith. There are some Christians who may not quite believe in total healing, lets say they read it in scriptures, but do they really believe that divine healing is possible in this day and time?

For all intent and purpose lets suppose you have been diagonsed with some disease which the doctors have said "We've done all that is medically possible and you at the most have only 6 months to live"
If I came to you and said, I would like to pray for you and I have the faith that you will be healed. Now I'm going on the assumption that it is my faith that will sustain your life. (I'm not claiming that I have any special power, just my faith)
Say you start showing a remission and you go back to the doctor and he, after more intensive testing finds that you now show no signs of the previous diagnosis.
Would you then at least consider the fact that their might indeed be a "Higher Power" or would you just continue with the fact that it was:
(1) Virtually impossible since no higher power exists
(2) A fluke, you would have beaten the odds anyway
(3) The diagnosis was wrong to start with

This would indeed be a miracle, you never know there might be one in the making for you: Let's hope you don't have to find out, I might be low on the prayer scale that day.....

 

[whereismynotecard]

I would go with 2 or 3. Doctors around here are pretty stupid, so it's highly likely that the diagnosis would have been wrong to begin with. Also, since there are a lot of diseases where they don't know much about them, I think it's possible that they might possibly go away on their own even if the odds are against it.

I think a "miracle" is something that is impossible, but it happens anyway. Because this definition is an oxymoron, I don't believe in miracles. If something impossible did happen, it clearly isn't impossible.. because it happened... so I don't think miracles exist. Nothing that happens is impossible, and nothing that is possible is a miracle.

 

[dust1n]

This question would mostly be for the atheist or the unbeliever of the Christian Faith. There are some Christians who may not quite believe in total healing, lets say they read it in scriptures, but do they really believe that divine healing is possible in this day and time?

For all intent and purpose lets suppose you have been diagonsed with some disease which the doctors have said "We've done all that is medically possible and you at the most have only 6 months to live"
If I came to you and said, I would like to pray for you and I have the faith that you will be healed. Now I'm going on the assumption that it is my faith that will sustain your life. (I'm not claiming that I have any special power, just my faith)
Say you start showing a remission and you go back to the doctor and he, after more intensive testing finds that you now show no signs of the previous diagnosis.
Would you then at least consider the fact that their might indeed be a "Higher Power" or would you just continue with the fact that it was:
(1) Virtually impossible since no higher power exists
(2) A fluke, you would have beaten the odds anyway
(3) The diagnosis was wrong to start with

This would indeed be a miracle, you never know there might be one in the making for you: Let's hope you don't have to find out, I might be low on the prayer scale that day.....

First of all, I would ask you to use your pray on someone who could actually use a miracle, say, basically anyone buy a white male in America from the middle-class. Even then, it would not work because I would not be inclined to the placebo effect. Maybe if world hunger is eradicated, poverty eliminated; then I would get on my knees and start talking to the sky.

 

[johnhanks]

This question would mostly be for the atheist or the unbeliever of the Christian Faith. There are some Christians who may not quite believe in total healing, lets say they read it in scriptures, but do they really believe that divine healing is possible in this day and time?

For all intent and purpose lets suppose you have been diagonsed with some disease which the doctors have said "We've done all that is medically possible and you at the most have only 6 months to live"
If I came to you and said, I would like to pray for you and I have the faith that you will be healed. Now I'm going on the assumption that it is my faith that will sustain your life. (I'm not claiming that I have any special power, just my faith)
Say you start showing a remission and you go back to the doctor and he, after more intensive testing finds that you now show no signs of the previous diagnosis.
Would you then at least consider the fact that their might indeed be a "Higher Power" or would you just continue with the fact that it was:
(1) Virtually impossible since no higher power exists
(2) A fluke, you would have beaten the odds anyway
(3) The diagnosis was wrong to start with

This would indeed be a miracle, you never know there might be one in the making for you: Let's hope you don't have to find out, I might be low on the prayer scale that day.....

I'd start with the observations (a) that doctors are fallible, and (b) that people, both prayed-for and unprayed-for, do from time to time recover from life-threatening conditions. If you could show me that only people prayed for by christians ever made such recoveries, I'd have more pause for thought; but I don't believe you can.

More fundamentally troubling are the further implications of your scenario. God intervenes to let me live because you have requested it? Had you not done so, he would have let me die? And as it is, because you neglected to pray for the guy in the next bed, he goes ahead and dies anyway, leaving destitute a wife and five kids. (Look, if you can make up stories, I can embellish them.)

The problem with miracles is their selectivity. Why, in your scenario, should god save me just because you asked for it, but neglect to save a million African babies from starvation or malaria? Plenty of people leaped in to claim last year's successful ditching of an airliner in the Hudson as a clear case of divine intervention; odd how these same people are silent when a plane crashes and everyone on board is killed (a far more frequent occurrence).

We have a deep, inbuilt reluctance to accept that our survival and well-being are at the mercy of uncaring contingency; but the fact is they are.

 

[Humanistheart]

This question would mostly be for the atheist or the unbeliever of the Christian Faith. There are some Christians who may not quite believe in total healing, lets say they read it in scriptures, but do they really believe that divine healing is possible in this day and time?

For all intent and purpose lets suppose you have been diagonsed with some disease which the doctors have said "We've done all that is medically possible and you at the most have only 6 months to live"
If I came to you and said, I would like to pray for you and I have the faith that you will be healed. Now I'm going on the assumption that it is my faith that will sustain your life. (I'm not claiming that I have any special power, just my faith)
Say you start showing a remission and you go back to the doctor and he, after more intensive testing finds that you now show no signs of the previous diagnosis.
Would you then at least consider the fact that their might indeed be a "Higher Power" or would you just continue with the fact that it was:
(1) Virtually impossible since no higher power exists
(2) A fluke, you would have beaten the odds anyway
(3) The diagnosis was wrong to start with

This would indeed be a miracle, you never know there might be one in the making for you: Let's hope you don't have to find out, I might be low on the prayer scale that day.....

We'll taht kind of thing happens sometimes. Doctors are often wrong about their estimated time remaining. It would not be a sign of anything but our need to continue in medical advancment. 1-3 would all work, I guess I'd favor #3 though. On the other hand, if I watched a man get flattened by on oncomming semi, then reinflate with his blood drawing back into his body, he got up and was fine, then I might lean toward something more in the 'higher power' area, although I think I'd still consider super high tech aliens and mutants a more likely senario than a god.

 

[Charity]

We'll taht kind of thing happens sometimes. Doctors are often wrong about their estimated time remaining. It would not be a sign of anything but our need to continue in medical advancment. 1-3 would all work, I guess I'd favor #3 though. On the other hand, if I watched a man get flattened by on oncomming semi, then reinflate with his blood drawing back into his body, he got up and was fine, then I might lean toward something more in the 'higher power' area, although I think I'd still consider super high tech aliens and mutants a more likely senario than a god.

Actually I saw where a man was flattened by a steam roller on one of the channels the other day and lived, wish I had paid closer attention to where and when it happened. I'm not suggesting that he had prayer, but I do find that a miracle within its self.....

 

[Charity]

We'll taht kind of thing happens sometimes. Doctors are often wrong about their estimated time remaining. It would not be a sign of anything but our need to continue in medical advancment. 1-3 would all work, I guess I'd favor #3 though. On the other hand, if I watched a man get flattened by on oncomming semi, then reinflate with his blood drawing back into his body, he got up and was fine, then I might lean toward something more in the 'higher power' area, although I think I'd still consider super high tech aliens and mutants a more likely senario than a god.

Medicine has advanced to the point where in most cases, depending on the test results and the progression of a terminal illness that most doctors are able to predict within a few months with accuracy.
Why continue with medical advancement when the treatment is only making the quality of time worse. There's times you just know when you've done all you can medically. I think if I were a strawman, I would be grasping for all the straws I could, and especially for the last one, wouldn't it be worth a try?

 

[no-body]

Selective perception and reporting.

 

[Buttercup]

If I came to you and said, I would like to pray for you and I have the faith that you will be healed. Now I'm going on the assumption that it is my faith that will sustain your life. (I'm not claiming that I have any special power, just my faith)

First off, I would be very touched and thankful that you cared enough to pray for me. Even if I don't really believe in the Christian god these days, I still find the offer of prayer to be a very, very kind gesture.

Say you start showing a remission and you go back to the doctor and he, after more intensive testing finds that you now show no signs of the previous diagnosis.
Would you then at least consider the fact that their might indeed be a "Higher Power" or would you just continue with the fact that it was:
(1) Virtually impossible since no higher power exists
(2) A fluke, you would have beaten the odds anyway
(3) The diagnosis was wrong to start with

This would indeed be a miracle, you never know there might be one in the making for you: Let's hope you don't have to find out, I might be low on the prayer scale that day.....

Under those circumstances, I would definitely consider the idea again of a higher power (I was Christian for 30 years). However, I also believe in human ability to overcome disease. I think the passionate desire to be well again can have some affect in healing. I believe people can also (sometimes) will themselves well with no intervention from "higher" sources.

So, in the end, I wouldn't really be sure if I was healed by God. I would however, be very grateful to be well again.

 

[footprints]

This question would mostly be for the atheist or the unbeliever of the Christian Faith. There are some Christians who may not quite believe in total healing, lets say they read it in scriptures, but do they really believe that divine healing is possible in this day and time?

For all intent and purpose lets suppose you have been diagonsed with some disease which the doctors have said "We've done all that is medically possible and you at the most have only 6 months to live"
If I came to you and said, I would like to pray for you and I have the faith that you will be healed. Now I'm going on the assumption that it is my faith that will sustain your life. (I'm not claiming that I have any special power, just my faith)
Say you start showing a remission and you go back to the doctor and he, after more intensive testing finds that you now show no signs of the previous diagnosis.
Would you then at least consider the fact that their might indeed be a "Higher Power" or would you just continue with the fact that it was:
(1) Virtually impossible since no higher power exists
(2) A fluke, you would have beaten the odds anyway
(3) The diagnosis was wrong to start with

This would indeed be a miracle, you never know there might be one in the making for you: Let's hope you don't have to find out, I might be low on the prayer scale that day.....

Personally Charity, I don't think there could be any miracle which could persuade any hard line atheist. Their mind would be too sceptical, they would be looking for the trick in it and wouldn't stop looking till they found it, even if they had to make something up based on their own imagination.

However, I put something similar to Cardinal Dell (Catholicism) in Australia, of course what I said to him was, "If Jesus came to you or the Pope today, you would most probably send him away or get the police to cart him off to a mental facility." LOL it is okay, Dell and many other Cardinals already have me listed as a nutcase, the same with the Seventh Day Adventist Church, I gave them a bit of curry after what they had done to a very close friend of mine. I have been condemned to hell so many times by the theist and the atheist I now own shares in it. Look out brother Pan, here I come, move over so I can make myself more comfortable.

 

[Charity]

I'd start with the observations (a) that doctors are fallible, and (b) that people, both prayed-for and unprayed-for, do from time to time recover from life-threatening conditions. If you could show me that only people prayed for by christians ever made such recoveries, I'd have more pause for thought; but I don't believe you can.

More fundamentally troubling are the further implications of your scenario. God intervenes to let me live because you have requested it? Had you not done so, he would have let me die? And as it is, because you neglected to pray for the guy in the next bed, he goes ahead and dies anyway, leaving destitute a wife and five kids. (Look, if you can make up stories, I can embellish them.)

The problem with miracles is their selectivity. Why, in your scenario, should god save me just because you asked for it, but neglect to save a million African babies from starvation or malaria? Plenty of people leaped in to claim last year's successful ditching of an airliner in the Hudson as a clear case of divine intervention; odd how these same people are silent when a plane crashes and everyone on board is killed (a far more frequent occurrence).

We have a deep, inbuilt reluctance to accept that our survival and well-being are at the mercy of uncaring contingency; but the fact is they are.

The question was not asked if only people that were prayed for by Christians recovered. I've known of people who did make recoveries, but stick to our hypothetical post. It's your last chance and you could have a Christian pray for you.

Let us not forget that God is not obligated to answer prayer for unbelievers, he has no covenant with them, not saying that he wouldn't answer your prayer, but it is more likely He will hear the prayer. The fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much....

I guess given the implications of your own post, If you live because of prayer it would have to be from me, since you definitely wouldn't pray.....God has an appointed time for each of us to die. No one escapes death, but maybe they could be given a pardon or delay in that time. Maybe God put in on my heart to pray sort of God offering you one last ditch effort to live.
In the Bible a certain King became ill and was going to die, but he prayed and asked God to let him live. God extended him 15 more years....15 years means a lot if you got family, children to raise, or simply enjoy life.

Maybe the man in the next bed does not live, but maybe he had the promise from God that He knew no matter what everything was covered by God's insurance policy. His wife would be comforted by this thought and his children would grow up knowing about faith, and the fact that they had the strength to face whatever happened in their life.....I can embellish back also..

Selectivity in my scenario, why would God save you and let starving children die, the answer eludes me completely, Unless its love for you, because if someone rejected me, I wouldn't give them a second thought....

As far as your plane crash, Who gets saved and who dies, I can't explain that I wish I could, just remember we all have an appointed time to meet death.

 

[johnhanks]

The question was not asked if only people that were prayed for by Christians recovered.

No, it was not; but you did ask

Would you then at least consider the fact that their might indeed be a "Higher Power"...

and I was giving you the circumstance that might make me consider that.

God has an appointed time for each of us to die. No one escapes death, but maybe they could be given a pardon or delay in that time. Maybe God put in on my heart to pray sort of God offering you one last ditch effort to live.

I'm sorry, but this is awfully muddled.

1. God has fixed the time of my death.
2. But he can offer a deferment, and for some reason wishes to.
3. So he nudges you to pray to him and persuade him to go ahead with it?

With all due respect, this makes no sense.

Selectivity in my scenario, why would God save you and let starving children die, the answer eludes me completely ... As far as your plane crash, Who gets saved and who dies, I can't explain that I wish I could, just remember we all have an appointed time to meet death.

It isn't just selectivity in your scenario: whenever believers claim that certain people have been saved by a miracle, they are raising the uncomfortable question 'why them and not others?' This question is very easily answered if there is in fact no prayer-answering god, and survival or not is a matter of pure contingency - however difficult that fact may be for our brains to cope with.

 

[Kerr]

This question would mostly be for the atheist or the unbeliever of the Christian Faith. There are some Christians who may not quite believe in total healing, lets say they read it in scriptures, but do they really believe that divine healing is possible in this day and time?

For all intent and purpose lets suppose you have been diagonsed with some disease which the doctors have said "We've done all that is medically possible and you at the most have only 6 months to live"
If I came to you and said, I would like to pray for you and I have the faith that you will be healed. Now I'm going on the assumption that it is my faith that will sustain your life. (I'm not claiming that I have any special power, just my faith)
Say you start showing a remission and you go back to the doctor and he, after more intensive testing finds that you now show no signs of the previous diagnosis.
Would you then at least consider the fact that their might indeed be a "Higher Power" or would you just continue with the fact that it was:
(1) Virtually impossible since no higher power exists
(2) A fluke, you would have beaten the odds anyway
(3) The diagnosis was wrong to start with

This would indeed be a miracle, you never know there might be one in the making for you: Let's hope you don't have to find out, I might be low on the prayer scale that day.....

If by miracle you mean divine intervention by the deity you believe in, then no, I don´t think that your prayer would have any affect on my health. Extraordinary things do happen, it is not a proof of God. Would appriciate it none the less, coming from a Christian it would show that they care I guess.

What I am curious about is why you say this question would apply to unbelievers of Christian faith.

 

[Willamena]

If I came to you and said, I would like to pray for you and I have the faith that you will be healed. Now I'm going on the assumption that it is my faith that will sustain your life. (I'm not claiming that I have any special power, just my faith)
Say you start showing a remission and you go back to the doctor and he, after more intensive testing finds that you now show no signs of the previous diagnosis.
Would you then at least consider the fact that their might indeed be a "Higher Power"...

And you wouldn't consider this to be a "special power" of any sort? Would "a Higher Power" have acted without the intervention of your prayer/faith?

 

[Willamena]

Actually I saw where a man was flattened by a steam roller on one of the channels the other day and lived, wish I had paid closer attention to where and when it happened. I'm not suggesting that he had prayer, but I do find that a miracle within its self.....

Is a "miracle" just an incredibly unlikely thing? Or is it something more?

 

[Sunstone]

If you consider it possible to experience god, and you think experiencing god a miracle, then it seems that, according to the first hand accounts, the odds of that happening are about the same for a believer as for a non-believer.

 

[John D]

A Miracle is something that just happens to you. You don't ask for it nor deserve it,it is a gift. It will happen if someone pray or not, belief or not.
If it is a miracle from God, you will know it !!!!!!

 

[Charity]

If by miracle you mean divine intervention by the deity you believe in, then no, I don´t think that your prayer would have any affect on my health. Extraordinary things do happen, it is not a proof of God. Would appriciate it none the less, coming from a Christian it would show that they care I guess.

What I am curious about is why you say this question would apply to unbelievers of Christian faith.[/quot

I didn't say the deity that I believe in, I stated a higher power.
Yes Extraordinary things do happen, oft time they are called miracles, depending on how one tends to evaluate it.....
Then you would make the perfect candidate for the intervention, why would "God/or higher deity" need to prove anything to someone who already believes?

Why would I have need to ask this question to a Christian that's why it's directed to someone who doesn't believe in God?higher Power

 

[MSizer]

I don't know which would be the most plausible explanation, as each may be correct. However, since it is always more likely that a person has either lied or been mistaken about an event than a suspension of natural laws, it is never reasonable to conclude a miracle has happened. Miracles by definition are impossible. If something happens in this universe, it obviously complies with natural laws, so nothing that happens can be a miracle.

 

[Charity]

And you wouldn't consider this to be a "special power" of any sort? Would "a Higher Power" have acted without the intervention of your prayer/faith?

This is hypothetical do remember that.
No I am not claiming that I or anyone else who was praying has been granted any "special power", it is not I who would be doing the healing....Mine is simply an act of obedience, And lets say in this case "God" who answers my prayer.
The thing you must understand is I would never just walk up to anyone, especially someone who doesn't believe in God and say "let me pray for you" I don't like strong arm tactics....But if I felt that God had indeed laid in on my heart, then I would at least be bold enough to try.
If God told me to pray, and you were healed, then my prayer and your need have been met.
Perhaps a Higher Power would act without my prayer, but the fact is I would have been obedient to what I felt that God required of me. Maybe it is a test for me....
Keep in mind that death will come to us all eventually....