Cosmic Consciousness: Everything from matter is just making a baseless assumptions

[exchemist]

heh. There's a Quantamagazine article re that in that list I see. Often they have fairly good reporting/writing.

So there is: "A New Spin on the Quantum Brain". The opening section describes exactly the scepticism I have been referring to.

Well good luck to this Fisher guy. Let's see if he can make his idea about the spin of phosophorus nuclei stand up. What I am not clear about is how changes in the spin state of the nuclei will affect the biochemistry of nerve cells. Generally the nuclear spin state has little effect on chemistry.

I suspect he's barking up the wrong tree by focusing on nuclear spin. I see the article rather airily dismisses the effect of the different mass of the 2 Li isotopes in the antidepressant drug. But in fact a difference in atomic mass will alter bond vibration frequencies and reaction rates, so I think it is a bit glib to dismiss the effects of atomic mass.

However his idea seems to be at least entertained by some decent chemists, so they may find a way to put it to the test.

 

[Ostronomos]

Except that this is a wrong conclusion to draw.

Consciousness is a state of activity of a brain, like the functioning of the operating system of a computer. To have a functioning computer you don't have to imagine that every component it is made from in some way carries out computations, when it is lying in the warehouse before assembly.
See post 4 about emergent properties.

No. You are the one who is wrong.

Consciousness is obviously universal. As demonstrated by a cosmic consciousness that can suddenly appear within the immediate environment of a given observer who obtains a particular state of awareness. There is far more to consciousness that you are unaware of and believe that you have full access to than you currently display. Hence your ignorance which is most likely held in high regard as what we know as atheism. Consciousness is light in the brain and can be affected and even infiltrated by images that appear before the eyes. Far from being an illusion (as supported by Steve Klinko's "Inter-Mind" theory on sciforums), consciousness is a holographic image that is projected by the spiritual and/ or material brain. God consciousness is global consciousness capable of full self-configuration and self-reflection and exists within a spiritual dimension that is 90 degrees to the material world that YOU currently believe to be all there is and what I know to be the matrix.

 

[exchemist]

No. You are the one who is wrong.

Consciousness is obviously universal. As demonstrated by a cosmic consciousness that can suddenly appear within the immediate environment of a given observer who obtains a particular state of awareness. There is far more to consciousness that you are unaware of and believe that you have full access to than you currently display. Hence your ignorance which is most likely held in high regard as what we know as atheism. Consciousness is light in the brain and can be affected and even infiltrated by images that appear before the eyes. Far from being an illusion (as supported by Steve Klinko's "Inter-Mind" theory on sciforums), consciousness is a holographic image that is projected by the spiritual and/ or material brain. God consciousness is global consciousness capable of full self-configuration and self-reflection and exists within a spiritual dimension that is 90 degrees to the material world that YOU currently believe to be all there is and what I know to be the matrix.

This is the sort of stuff people come up with when they abandon the requirement for objective evidence. Just a collection of romantic assertions with no foundation in observation. (Steve Klinko is just some crank, talking gibberish.)

 

[Ostronomos]

This is the sort of stuff people come up with when they abandon the requirement for objective evidence. Just a collection of romantic assertions with no foundation in observation. (Steve Klinko is just some crank, talking gibberish.)

"No foundation in observation" you say?

I'll have you know that I have transcended "ordinary consciousness" to enter the spiritual plane.

Thank you for your time. It was cute.

 

[ChristineM]

I'll have you know that I have transcended "ordinary consciousness" to enter the spiritual plane

You have physical evidence for a "spiritual plane" or does it just happen in your imagination?

 

[exchemist]

"No foundation in observation" you say?

I'll have you know that I have transcended "ordinary consciousness" to enter the spiritual plane.

Thank you for your time. It was cute.

Exactly: purely subjective claims of experience, that cannot be validated by anyone else. Worthless, to anyone interested in objective reality.

 

[Ostronomos]

Exactly: purely subjective claims of experience, that cannot be validated by anyone else. Worthless, to anyone interested in objective reality.

Not only is objective reality also subjective on the flip side, but that subjective reality can be evidenced by logic. No empirical basis is necessary to those who cannot access it the way I can.

 

[exchemist]

Not only is objective reality also subjective on the flip side, but that subjective reality can be evidenced by logic. No empirical basis is necessary to those who cannot access it the way I can.

Well that means you can convince yourself, on the basis of your (supposedly) unique insight and abilities - but you have no way to convince anybody else!

Good luck with that.

 

[night912]

Well, QM is certainly involved, in the sense that QM determines how all atoms and molecules interact, including those in the biochemistry of the structures of the brain.

However, as to whether the operation of the brain may involve quantum computing, most physicists seem to think not, as the environment is too dense, warm and "noisy" in terms of the rapid rates of interaction of quantum systems.

There is a terrible tendency just now for people to try to drag QM into just about anything - especially when, or even because, they don't understand it. I am always a bit sceptical of such attempts.

That's because QM solves everything. It even solved the Thanos problem in Avengers End Game.

 

[Kooky]

Let us entertain the idea that everything came from matter for a moment. Then the question becomes, how did matter give rise to consciousness? What are the properties inherent within matter that allow for a being to compose Beethoven's symphonies, discover a new law of Physics, create life? If there is some extra property in matter that we are completely unaware of, I ask, what is it?

Consciousness does not exist separately from the matter that produces it. If your brain is stops to function, then so will your consciousness.

I think one of the best ways to conceive of consciousness and thinking from a materialist position is by way of the concept of Emergence or Emergent Complexity, where specific material configurations can emerge to have abilities their constitutent parts do not possess.