Christianity vs Baha'i

[CG Didymus]

Paul's personal experience with Jesus made him from persecutor to missionary.

Yes, ask Trailblazer to show you what one Baha'i writer says about Paul.

 

[CG Didymus]

This is not just about the Baha'is vs. the Christians, it is about the Christians vs. every other religion in the world. Christians believe Jesus is the Only Way and that the Bible is the only true scripture and that Christianoty is the only true religion.

But this thread is just about Baha'is and Christianity. Two very different religions.

Why should there be a double standard?

What double standard? They believe what they believe is the truth from the Bible, and Baha'is believe they have a new truth.

There is no fixing that and there is no reconciliation between the Baha'i Faith and Christianity, so why pretend?

As long as Christians believe that (1) Jesus is the Only Way and that (2) the Bible is the only true scripture and that (3) the same man Jesus is going to return, there is no chance of reconciliation of our beliefs, so we just have to accept that our beliefs differ and try to get along in a spirit of harmony and unity.

Yes, so how do Baha'is move forward in bringing God's plan for unity between all the religions. Most Baha'is are just as stubborn and stuck in their beliefs as they are in theirs.

 

[Trailblazer]

But Baha'is twist it into being true in one sense and false in another. It is true in a spiritual, symbolic way but not true in a literal way.

According to Baha'i beliefs Jesus did not rise from the dead so the scripture is not true in any way, because it was not a true story.

 

[Skywalker]

Ask one of the many Baha'is here. My argument with them is that the NT clearly teaches that Jesus rose from the dead and was seen alive and ate with them, talked with them and let them touch him to show it was him and not a ghost. I'm fine if that was just a made up story to make Jesus greater than any other prophet/savior. But that would make the NT a fabricated work of the early Christians. And I'm fine with that too. But Baha'is twist it into being true in one sense and false in another. It is true in a spiritual, symbolic way but not true in a literal way.

The New Testament story is not a made up story to make Jesus greater than any other savior. The mathematical probabiltiy that Jesus fulfilled all of the messianic prophecies is one in ten trillion to the thirteenth power. Y-Jesus.com -

 

[Skywalker]

Christians "believe" they have an explanation for everything, but Jesus clearly said He was no more in the world and that means He is not going to return to the world. How many hundreds of times do I need to post these verses on this forum?

John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

But of course Christians always have a way out of accepting what Jesus said instead of accepting the reality that Jesus is heaven and they will see Him after they die.

Moreover, there is not one single verse in the Bible wherein Jesus promised to return to earth, not one.
That Jesus will return to earth is just a Christian belief based upon nothing except what they want.

Jesus promised He would return. The Old Testament also mentions two comings of the Messiah in Micah 5:2, which mentions the second advent. Jesus fullfilled the Messianic prophecies. Zechariah mentions the crucifixtion of Jesus in Zechariah 12:10. Did Jesus Promise to Return within the Lifetime of his Disciples? - Canon Fodder

 

[Trailblazer]

What double standard? They believe what they believe is the truth from the Bible, and Baha'is believe they have a new truth.

What I meant by a double standard is what I said: Do you see Christians going along with Baha'i beliefs? Why should there be a double standard?

In other words, why should Baha'is go along with Christian beliefs? Christians do not go along with Baha'i beliefs.

Yes, so how do Baha'is move forward in bringing God's plan for unity between all the religions. Most Baha'is are just as stubborn and stuck in their beliefs as they are in theirs.

The goal of the Baha'i Faith is not to unite religions, because that is impossible as long as those of the older religions cling tenaciously to their beliefs. The goal is for those of other religions to recognize Baha'u'llah and thereby become Baha'is.

According to Baha'u'llah, the goal of God is the union of all its peoples in one universal Cause, one common Faith.

“That which the Lord hath ordained as the sovereign remedy and mightiest instrument for the healing of all the world is the union of all its peoples in one universal Cause, one common Faith. This can in no wise be achieved except through the power of a skilled, an all-powerful and inspired Physician. This, verily, is the truth, and all else naught but error.”
The Summons of the Lord of Hosts, p. 91

 

[CG Didymus]

There are so many ways that prophecies can be interpreted but when one lays out all the puzzle pieces they all come together and the prophecies show that Baha'u'llah was the one the Bible was referring to as the return of Christ and the Messiah. There really is no way around that because history and geography and they cannot be denied.

Yet, they are denied. Each side ignores or has ways to explain away contradictory prophecies. Like Jesus saying that like sign of Jonah, he will be in the grave for three days. Also he said tear down this temple and in three days I will raise it up. There's a verse that says he will return to the Mt. of Olives. The 666 prophecy is mangled by Baha'is. It is said to be the year 666 AD but the verse says the "number" or "mark" of the beast. Then there is "he" shall come to you from Assyria or "they" shall come to you from Assyria. None of it is clear. Even the starting time of Daniel's prophecy. Why start it when the decree went out to rebuild Jerusalem when it says that it starts with the abomination setting?

Daniel 12:11-12 “From the time that the daily sacrifice is abolished and the abomination that causes desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days. 12 Blessed is the one who waits for and reaches the end of the 1,335 days.​

The decree to rebuild Jerusalem is in Daniel 9...

25 “Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes, there will be seven ‘sevens,’ and sixty-two ‘sevens.’ It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble. 26 After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing. The people of the ruler who will come will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood: War will continue until the end, and desolations have been decreed. 27 He will confirm a covenant with many for one ‘seven.’ In the middle of the ‘seven’ he will put an end to sacrifice and offering. And at the temple he will set up an abomination that causes desolation, until the end that is decreed is poured out on him.”​

Is all this clearly explained by Bill Sears? And how would he know? He not the infallible messenger. Nothing is clear in any interpretation of prophecies, plus Christians and Baha'is have both found verses that they make into prophecies.

 

[Trailblazer]

Jesus promised He would return.

Show me one verse in the New Testament where Jesus promised he would return to earth.

The Old Testament also mentions two comings of the Messiah in Micah 5:2, which mentions the second advent. Jesus fullfilled the Messianic prophecies. Zechariah mentions the crucifixtion of Jesus in Zechariah 12:10. Did Jesus Promise to Return within the Lifetime of his Disciples? - Canon Fodder

Baha'is believe that all the Old Testament prophecies that were not fulfilled by Jesus at His first coming refer to Baha'u'llah, who was the second coming. That is provable by looking at the prophecies side by side with what happened when Baha'u'llah appeared.

 

[Trailblazer]

Is all this clearly explained by Bill Sears? And how would he know? He not the infallible messenger. Nothing is clear in any interpretation of prophecies, plus Christians and Baha'is have both found verses that they make into prophecies.

It is very clear to me and it has been proven by Sears that Baha'u'llah was the return of Christ.

Sears knew because he studied the Bible and also the history of the Baha'i Faith. He did not need to be infallible to add two and two and get four. All he had to do is the necessary research, which he did for seven years.

Baha'is do not have to MAKE anything into a prophecy because those prophecies were actually fulfilled by the coming of Baha'u'llah. History and geography do not lie.

Christians cannot MAKE them be about Jesus because it is impossible for them to be about Jesus unless history and geography are erased. Those prophecies can only be about one man, Baha'u'llah, and that was proven in the book Thief in the Night by William Sears.

Even if there was no other proof of Baha'u'llah's claims, that would be adequate for me.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Even if there was no other proof of Baha'u'llah's claims, that would be adequate for me.

Yet the greatest proof was His life and people have spent so much time on the claim, that they forget to look at the. Life.

The Messenger lives the Message before they give it.

Thus if they ask you to sacrafice certain things, or to be charitable, kind to all etc, they already have, they are known by those qualities.

Regards Tony

 

[Kenny]

Acts 1:9-11 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

Bible verses can have more than one interpretation. I believe that the disciples were staring up into the sky as the spirit of Jesus was taken up to heaven out of their sight. The two men dressed in white (angels) came along and asked why they were staring up into the sky because they wondered why the disciples were staring up into the sky. Then the angels told the disciples that the same spirit of Jesus that was taken up to heaven will return just as it went to heaven, in like manner.

The verse does not say that the disciples saw a body go up. It was the Christ Spirit that ascended, not a body, which is why the angels wondered why the disciples were staring into the sky, since there was nothing to look at. That makes perfect sense since angels can see spirits.

Descending from heaven upon the clouds means that the spirit of Jesus, the Christ Spirit, will be made manifest from the heaven of the will of God and will appear in the form of the human temple. Though delivered from the womb of Mary, Jesus in reality descended from the heaven of the will of God. Baha’u’llah descended in like manner, from the heaven of the will of God.

Hmmmm... no.

John 20: 26 And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you.27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. 28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.

luke 24; 42 And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb. 43 And he took it, and did eat before them. 44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

Tangible flesh.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+24&version=KJV

I believe it will be a Spiritual Kingdom but also an Earthly Kingdom. I believe the Jews are wrong about the Messiah ruling like a King ruling on earth and there are no verses that say that. It was just an interpretation they came up with based upon expectations they had. I believe that the Messiah did rule on earth during His lifetime, but not like a King, but just because of His Glory. I believe that the throne of David refers to the Most Great Law and the Law refers to the Revelation of God that came through Baha’u’llah.

“THE Most Great Law is come, and the Ancient Beauty ruleth upon the throne of David. Thus hath My Pen spoken that which the histories of bygone ages have related. At this time, however, David crieth aloud and saith: ‘O my loving Lord! Do Thou number me with such as have stood steadfast in Thy Cause, O Thou through Whom the faces have been illumined, and the footsteps have slipped!’” Proclamation of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 89-90

I believe that Jesus is ruling in heaven and His Kingdom is everlasting.

Luke 1:32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:

“The Throne upon which He sat is the Eternal Throne from which Christ reigns for ever, a heavenly throne, not an earthly one, for the things of earth pass away but heavenly things pass not away. He re-interpreted and completed the Law of Moses and fulfilled the Law of the Prophets. His word conquered the East and the West. His Kingdom is everlasting.” Abdu'l-Baha, Paris Talks

No problem with you believing Baha'u'llah. I just don't subscribe to that faith.

Following is how I believe the Messiah will appear, based upon scripture.

18. Lightning from the East

I now began an earnest search for clues that would tell me something about the place in which the Messiah would appear. Two interesting things came to light. For the first coming, Daniel had given the time and Micah had given the place. Daniel had prophesied exactly when the Messiah would appear the first time and when He would be slain. Micah had said of the place: “But thou, Bethlehem … out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel.” (Micah 5:2)

Daniel had also prophesied with even greater exactness the time of the second coming of the Messiah in 1844 (see p. 20). Therefore, I turned to Micah for a possible clue as to the place of His second appearance. I was richly rewarded. In Micah 7:7 and 12 I found:

“I will wait for the God of my salvation … In that day also he shall come even to thee from Assyria …” (Micah 7:7, 12)

The Assyrian Empire at one time covered the entire area in which both Daniel and Micah lived out their lives. Therefore, I chose to study those parts of the Empire, in which these two prophets traditionally lived and taught. To my surprise, I found that there were many other clues to follow as well. Gradually one led to another, until a definite picture began to emerge, and I knew at least in which direction to turn my gaze.

The book of Ezekiel spoke of a great Figure who would come in those days. He said: “And, behold, the glory of the God of Israel came from the way of the east.” (Ezekiel 43:2)

This was clearly a reference to the second coming of Christ and not the first, for Jesus did not come from the way of the East, He came from north and west of Jerusalem. Isaiah in like manner spoke of the wondrous Figure who would come from the East. Isaiah said that it was God Himself Who had “… raised up the righteous man from the east, called him to his foot, gave the nations before him, and made him rule over kings.” (Isaiah 41:2) Even Christ Himself pointed to the direction from which He would appear in the day of His second coming. Speaking of that day, He said: “For as the lightning cometh out of the East … so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.”(Matthew 24:27)

The Jewish Oracles, the Sibylline books, prophesied that the ‘King Messiah’ of the time of the end would come ‘from the sunrise’.(The Messianic Idea in Israel, J. G. Klausner, 1956, p. 376). Daniel had written his words of millennial prophecy while in the East. In fact, he was in Elam, a part of ancient Persia, when he foretold with such startling accuracy the exact time of both the first and the second comings of Christ. It was in the capital city of Persia, Shúshán, (Ancient Susa, Khúzistán, south-west Írán) that Daniel had the prophetic vision that revealed the year 1844 as the time for the return of the Messiah. Daniel not only gave the time 1844, but he also directed attention to the place, saying that ‘Elam’ (Persia) would be given as a place of ‘vision’ in the latter days (Daniel 8:2).The Prophet Jeremiah speaks of things that ‘shall come to pass in the latter days’ and in the verse preceding this, he says: “And I will set my throne in Elam (Persia) … saith the Lord.”(Jeremiah 49:38). I came across a prophecy well known among the Arabs. Speaking of the time of the end, it said:“When the promised One appears, the ‘upholders of His faith shall be the people of Persia.’”(The Dawn-breakers, Nabíl, p. 49). All these prophecies clearly showed that the Messiah would come from the East, and they put a strong emphasis on the territory of Persia. It was something definite to go on. The circle was narrowing.

William Sears, Thief in the Night, pp. 73-75

Daniel 8:2 And I saw in a vision; and it came to pass, when I saw, that I was at Shushan in the palace, which is in the province of Elam; and I saw in a vision, and I was by the river of Ulai.

Isaiah 41:2 Who raised up the righteous man from the east, called him to his foot, gave the nations before him, and made him rule over kings? he gave them as the dust to his sword, and as driven stubble to his bow.

The Lord was prophesied to set His throne in Elam, from which the Messiah would rule.
Elam is modern-day Persia, where Baha’u’llah was born.

Jeremiah 49:38 And I will set my throne in Elam, and will destroy from thence the king and the princes, saith the LORD.

When that verse was recorded Elam existed and the verses for the coming of the Lord refer to the latter days.

Jeremiah 49:39 But it shall come to pass in the latter days, that I will bring again the captivity of Elam, saith the LORD.

Without going through each scripture... didn't you just say what I said? The the Messiah Jesus is coming again? Or did I misunderstand?

 

[paarsurrey]

According to Baha'i beliefs Jesus did not rise from the dead so the scripture is not true in any way, because it was not a true story.

Please quote from Bahaullah, preferably from Kitab-i-Iqan or Book of Certitude in support of one's expression. Right, please?

Regards

 

[Trailblazer]

Hmmmm... no.

John 20: 26 And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you.27 Then saith he to Thomas, Reach hither thy finger, and behold my hands; and reach hither thy hand, and thrust it into my side: and be not faithless, but believing. 28 And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God.

luke 24; 42 And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb. 43 And he took it, and did eat before them. 44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.

Tangible flesh.

I do not believe that Jesus actually rose from the dead. I believe the resurrection was stories that were told about Jesus long after he walked the earth, not real life happenings. Anyone can write stories and make them sound real. That is what novels are, they are fictitious stories typically representing character and action with some degree of realism.

I have no problem with you believing that Jesus rose from the dead, I just do not believe it, nor do I see what it is a necessary belief given it has nothing to do with why Jesus came into the world.

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

I believe that after the crucifixion the soul of Jesus ascended to the fourth heaven to be at the right hand of God and His body died. I believe that Jesus is alive in heaven in a spiritual body and that He will remain there for eternity.

Without going through each scripture... didn't you just say what I said? The the Messiah Jesus is coming again? Or did I misunderstand?

I believe that Jesus was 'a Messiah' but not 'the Messiah' of the last days. I believe the Messiah of the last days was Baha'u'llah, who was the return of Christ, the second coming.

 

[paarsurrey]

Ask one of the many Baha'is here. My argument with them is that the NT clearly teaches that Jesus rose from the dead and was seen alive and ate with them, talked with them and let them touch him to show it was him and not a ghost. I'm fine if that was just a made up story to make Jesus greater than any other prophet/savior. But that would make the NT a fabricated work of the early Christians. And I'm fine with that too. But Baha'is twist it into being true in one sense and false in another. It is true in a spiritual, symbolic way but not true in a literal way.

I requested them but the answer ,#139, is ambiguous . Right, please?

Regards

 

[Trailblazer]

Please quote from Bahaullah, preferably from Kitab-i-Iqan or Book of Certitude in support of one's expression. Right, please?

Regards

I already responded to that request in another post.

I said: "To my knowledge, Baha'u'llah did not refer to the bodily resurrection of Jesus.

The Day of God’s Revelation is the Day of the most great Resurrection because God has resurrected His Cause and by sending a new Manifestation."

#139 Trailblazer, Today at 3:05 PM

 

[Skywalker]

Show me one verse in the New Testament where Jesus promised he would return to earth.

Baha'is believe that all the Old Testament prophecies that were not fulfilled by Jesus at His first coming refer to Baha'u'llah, who was the second coming. That is provable by looking at the prophecies side by side with what happened when Baha'u'llah appeared.

Its first mentioned in the Old Testament. 11 Bible verses about Promise Of Return

The Bible doesn't say that Jesus would fullfill all of the messianic prophecies at His first coming. There are two advents of the Messiah.

 

[Skywalker]

To my knowledge, Baha'u'llah did not refer to the bodily resurrection of Jesus. Below are the instances I know about wherein Baha'u'llah explains what the TRUE Resurrection is.

The Day of God’s Revelation is the Day of the most great Resurrection because God has resurrected His Cause and by sending a new Manifestation.

“How strange! These people with one hand cling to those verses of the Qur’án and those traditions of the people of certitude which they have found to accord with their inclinations and interests, and with the other reject those which are contrary to their selfish desires. “Believe ye then part of the Book, and deny part?” 4……..And yet, through the mystery of the former verse, they have turned away from the grace promised by the latter, despite the fact that “attainment unto the divine Presence” in the “Day of Resurrection” is explicitly stated in the Book. It hath been demonstrated and definitely established, through clear evidences, that by “Resurrection” is meant the rise of the Manifestation of God to proclaim His Cause, and by “attainment unto the divine Presence” is meant attainment unto the presence of His Beauty in the person of His Manifestation.” The Kitáb-i-Íqán, pp. 169-170

“Strive, therefore, O my brother, to grasp the meaning of “Resurrection,” and cleanse thine ears from the idle sayings of these rejected people. Shouldst thou step into the realm of complete detachment, thou wilt readily testify that no day is mightier than this Day, and that no resurrection more awful than this Resurrection can ever be conceived. One righteous work performed in this Day, equalleth all the virtuous acts which for myriads of centuries men have practised—nay, We ask forgiveness of God for such a comparison! For verily the reward which such a deed deserveth is immensely beyond and above the estimate of men. Inasmuch as these undiscerning and wretched souls have failed to apprehend the true meaning of “Resurrection” and of the “attainment unto the divine Presence,” they therefore have remained utterly deprived of the grace thereof.” The Kitáb-i-Íqán, pp. 144-145

“At the time of the appearance and manifestation of the rays of the Daystar of Truth, all occupy the same station. God then proclaimeth that which He willeth, and whoso heareth His call and acknowledgeth His truth is accounted among the inhabitants of Paradise. Such a soul hath traversed the Bridge, the Balance, and all that hath been recorded regarding the Day of Resurrection, and hath reached his destination. The Day of God’s Revelation is the Day of the most great Resurrection. We cherish the hope 63 that, quaffing from the choice wine of divine inspiration and the pure waters of heavenly grace, thou mayest attain the station of discovery and witnessing, and behold, both outwardly and inwardly, all that which thou hast mentioned.”
The Tabernacle of Unity, pp. 62- 63

The apostles could have recanted that they saw Jesus but they didnt. Why would they do that? Multiple people couldn't have seen a hallucination Jesus, a hallucination is seen by one person. The ressurection of Jesus has historical evidence. https://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/us/201...squo-death-and-resurrection-are-absolute-fact

 

[Kenny]

I do not believe that Jesus actually rose from the dead. I believe the resurrection was stories that were told about Jesus long after he walked the earth, not real life happenings. Anyone can write stories and make them sound real. That is what novels are, they are fictitious stories typically representing character and action with some degree of realism.

I have no problem with you believing that Jesus rose from the dead, I just do not believe it, nor do I see what it is a necessary belief given it has nothing to do with why Jesus came into the world.

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

I believe that after the crucifixion the soul of Jesus ascended to the fourth heaven to be at the right hand of God and His body died. I believe that Jesus is alive in heaven in a spiritual body and that He will remain there for eternity.

I believe that Jesus was 'a Messiah' but not 'the Messiah' of the last days. I believe the Messiah of the last days was Baha'u'llah, who was the return of Christ, the second coming.

Trailblazer... then there is really nothing to argue about.

We believe differently and we respect each other's differences in belief. How can we argue? The whole of the Gospel is based on a resurrection and if there is no resurrection, I have no Gospel.

But I did enjoy the exchange.

Ken

 

[Trailblazer]

The Bible doesn't say that Jesus would fullfill all of the messianic prophecies at His first coming. There are two advents of the Messiah.

The Bible does not say that the same man Jesus will return to earth and fulfill any prophecies.

There are two advents of the Messiah. I believe that Jesus was the first advent and the second advent was Baha'u'llah.

Since Baha'u'llah fulfilled all the OT prophecies it would be impossible for Jesus to return and re-fulfill them.
History has already transpired and the geography has been altered.

 

[Trailblazer]

The apostles could have recanted that they saw Jesus but they didnt. Why would they do that? Multiple people couldn't have seen a hallucination Jesus, a hallucination is seen by one person. The ressurection of Jesus has historical evidence. https://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/us/201...squo-death-and-resurrection-are-absolute-fact

A story is not proof that anything in the story ever happened. As I said to Ken earlier:

I do not believe that Jesus actually rose from the dead. I believe the resurrection was stories that were told about Jesus long after he walked the earth, not real life happenings. Anyone can write stories and make them sound real. That is what novels are, they are fictitious stories typically representing character and action with some degree of realism.

I have no problem with you believing that Jesus rose from the dead, I just do not believe it, nor do I see what it is a necessary belief given it has nothing to do with why Jesus came into the world.

You mighty want to ask yourself why Christians believe that is is so important that Jesus rose from the dead. That is glorification of the flesh, and Jesus downplayed the flesh:

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

1 John 2:16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.