Christianity v. Secular Humanism

[BilliardsBall]

This is seriously deserving of the funny rating. No, there is no evidence at all of moral superiority of theists. In fact as pointed out by @ecco the evidence is that theists are less moral.

By the way, which Commandments were you referring to? The original Ten? You do realize that quite a few of those have nothing to do with morals, don't you?

I'd like to respond to your post, but my strong sense of morality doesn't permit me to do so.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I'd like to respond to your post, but my strong sense of morality doesn't permit me to do so.

The statistics are clear if you look into them. Christians are far more likely to be in prison, to have murdered someone, to have divorced. The list goes on. I think that your fear of being laughed at is what does not permit you to respond. Your morality is likely a undeveloped one. Religions often end up causing people to be immoral since their holy books accurately report the immoral behavior of their ancient tribes. They are forced to justify those immoral acts. The Old Testament is chock full of immorality condoned by their god. When someone says that they cannot see any they are claiming not to be moral as a result.

 

[ecco]

I think that your fear of being laughed at is what does not permit you to respond.

That horse left the barn many years ago.

 

[night912]

The Bible agrees with you 100% as to your moral outrage.

No. I get morally outraged at slavery. Your Bible condones it. I get morally outraged at young girls being given over to soldiers as the spoils of war. Your Bible God commands it.

I respect your right to be selectively mad at what you subjectively consider immoral, while you yourself literally are immoral by daring to reprove a child of God.

You said the bible agreed 100%, then why did slavery suddenly became subjectively immoral now?

 

[BilliardsBall]

The statistics are clear if you look into them. Christians are far more likely to be in prison, to have murdered someone, to have divorced. The list goes on. I think that your fear of being laughed at is what does not permit you to respond. Your morality is likely a undeveloped one. Religions often end up causing people to be immoral since their holy books accurately report the immoral behavior of their ancient tribes. They are forced to justify those immoral acts. The Old Testament is chock full of immorality condoned by their god. When someone says that they cannot see any they are claiming not to be moral as a result.

Know a lot of people who were born again, tithing, active witnessing evangelicals--who then went to prison?

Know a lot of people whose morals, like yours, are rooted in the Bible (don't murder, don't divorce) but claim they arrived at them via secular humanistic logic?

 

[BilliardsBall]

You said the bible agreed 100%, then why did slavery suddenly became subjectively immoral now?

Bible slavery is indentured servitude, not an episode of Roots. There are more capital punishment laws for slave owners in the Bible than any other class of person!

 

[Subduction Zone]

Know a lot of people who were born again, tithing, active witnessing evangelicals--who then went to prison?

Know a lot of people whose morals, like yours, are rooted in the Bible (don't murder, don't divorce) but claim they arrived at them via secular humanistic logic?

Whoa whoa whoa! What makes you think that my morals are rooted in the Bible? You do realize that the Ten Commandments are not as old as the Code of Hammurabi? The Code of Hammurabi was probably the inspiration for the Ten Commandments.

Code of Hammurabi.

I could list quite a few "born again" (a nonsensical category that is merely self serving) that went to prison. I can also link statistics on the religious beliefs of people in prisons. These facts are not in dispute. You have made false claims about others, isn't there a Commandment about that?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Whoa whoa whoa! What makes you think that my morals are rooted in the Bible?

Who else should we look to as resident expert on the source of your morals?

(Oh, wait; let me rethink this ...)

 

[Subduction Zone]

Who else should we look to as resident expert on the source of your morals?

(Oh, wait; let me rethink this ...)

Rational thought is not a bad source. Enlightened self interest leads to moral behavior. One common test is: If you had no control into the sort of system that you were born into, meaning you could be any race, religion, gender, sexuality, or level of wealth etc. what sort of laws and morals would you like?

 

[Left Coast]

Bible slavery is indentured servitude, not an episode of Roots.

Oh what nonsense. Slavery is the owning of another person as property. That is what Biblical slavery is. That the Bible occasionally says masters should be nice to their property does not make it any less slavery.

 

[ecco]

First off, let's drop the word "subjectively". Slavery has always been immoral. As to why it is now recognized as immoral...

Because secular humans spoke up against it.
Because some religious people decided to point out that the Bible was wrong.​

The same thing applies to it no longer being acceptable to give young captured females to conquering warriors as trophies.

 

[ecco]

I likewise dare, so I spend a lot of time doing anti-apologetics at LOTR and Dune forums.

I have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[McBell]

Know a lot of people who were born again, tithing, active witnessing evangelicals--who then went to prison?

Yes, i do.
I also know a lot of atheists who converted (mostly to Muslim) after going to prison.

So what?

Know a lot of people whose morals, like yours, are rooted in the Bible (don't murder, don't divorce) but claim they arrived at them via secular humanistic logic?

I know a lot of people who can not accept that there are those who did not get their morals from the Bible.
I suspect it causes to much confusion to their worldview.

Or are you going to claim that the Bible is everywhere?
If so, why all the missionaries to introduce the Bible to those who know nothing of it?

Or perhaps it is your claim that they do not have morals?

The problem for you here is that the Bible is not the only "source" for morality.

 

[Subduction Zone]

The same thing applies to it no longer being acceptable to give young captured females to conquering warriors as trophies.

What? Well there go my plans to join the Space Force.

 

[ecco]

I also know a lot of atheists who converted (mostly to Muslim) after going to prison.

That assertion needs substantiation.

 

[ecco]

What? Well there go my plans to join the Space Force.

YOU were going to be a Guardian? Wow!

 

[McBell]

That assertion needs substantiation.

I have none to offer.
This is my personal experience from when I worked in the prison system.

 

[Subduction Zone]

YOU were going to be a Guardian? Wow!

And at my age too! What can I say. I have a taste for green strange.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I have none to offer.
This is my personal experience from when I worked in the prison system.

I have no experience with the penal system. From my vast experience watching crime dramas on TV aren't most Muslims in prison black? African Americans are under represented in the U.S. atheist population so that might be a pretty neat trick.

 

[Wandering Monk]

First off, let's drop the word "subjectively". Slavery has always been immoral. As to why it is now recognized as immoral...

Because secular humans spoke up against it.
Because some religious people decided to point out that the Bible was wrong.​

The same thing applies to it no longer being acceptable to give young captured females to conquering warriors as trophies.

To be fair, most Abolitionists during the years leading up to the Civil war were religious folks.