'Catholic alt-right'

[pearl]

Fordham University theologian Jason Steidl has coined a name for them.

"I call them the 'Catholic alt-right,'" Steidl told NBC News. "We haven't seen anything like this before. I think they are part of a bigger cultural movement. These people have hitched their wagons to Trump's presidency, to his tactics."
The call for action against the "Forces of Organized Perversion" landed in the inboxes of conservative Roman Catholics across the country just before Election Day.

"Have you had enough?" activist Randy Engel wrote in a column that first appeared on the conservative website RenewAmerica.com. "Or will you wait until the Homosexual Collective's hobnail boot is pressed on the neck of your prone body or that of your child or grandchild before reacting?"

"Cast your vote for God, family, and nation," she wrote.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/how-the-catholic-alt-right-aims-to-purge-lgbtq-members-from-the-church/ar-BBPPyj0?li=BBnb7Kz

This is Catholic fundamentalism at its worse.

 

[Vouthon]

I have long been a stern critic of American lay Catholicism, which has become disturbingly permeated with explicitly anti-Catholic, right-wing nativist infilitration.

Pope Francis and his allies among the U.S. hierarchy (the bishops are predominantly moderate and in league with the Pope, pardoning a few bad eggs like Cardinal Burke), have been up against it for years now. From migrants, to labour laws and poverty, to social welfare and healthcare, to the death penalty...the yawning gap between the Vatican position and that of radical Trump-supporting elements in the American church is getting to breaking point.

There's just too big an ideological and theological void. See this from last year:


US Catholics accused of pro-Trump 'alliance of hate' by Pope's allies

Pope Francis' allies accuses US Catholics of forming an 'alliance of hate' to back Trump

Antonio Spadaro and Marcelo Figuerola have denounced the world view of some US Christians saying they are 'not too far apart' from Islamist jihadists

Two people close to Pope Francis have accused ultra-conservative American Catholics of making an alliance of “hate” with evangelical Christians to back Donald Trump.

Catholic priest Antonio Spadaro and Protestant theologian Marcelo Figueroa published a joint article in La Civilta Cattolica, a journal published by Jesuit priests in Rome and overseen by the Vatican, in which they denounced US Catholics for supporting the extremist positions of the American right
​

If the situation does not improve, I honestly foresee excommunication and schism from the Pontifical See of Rome, once all other means of resolving this dispute have been exhausted.

In other words, the ecclesiastical version of the "nuclear option".

 

[exchemist]

Fordham University theologian Jason Steidl has coined a name for them.

"I call them the 'Catholic alt-right,'" Steidl told NBC News. "We haven't seen anything like this before. I think they are part of a bigger cultural movement. These people have hitched their wagons to Trump's presidency, to his tactics."
The call for action against the "Forces of Organized Perversion" landed in the inboxes of conservative Roman Catholics across the country just before Election Day.

"Have you had enough?" activist Randy Engel wrote in a column that first appeared on the conservative website RenewAmerica.com. "Or will you wait until the Homosexual Collective's hobnail boot is pressed on the neck of your prone body or that of your child or grandchild before reacting?"

"Cast your vote for God, family, and nation," she wrote.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/how-the-catholic-alt-right-aims-to-purge-lgbtq-members-from-the-church/ar-BBPPyj0?li=BBnb7Kz

This is Catholic fundamentalism at its worse.

It seems that in every organisation or social group, there will be some angry people looking for an excuse to have a fight. That's what we have here. I hope the hierarchy will preach strongly against these groups. They are clearly quite hysterical and have lost the plot entirely on Christian charity.

 

[Vouthon]

I hope the hierarchy will preach strongly against these groups.

The USCCB (The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops) is frequently making pronouncements critical of this insidious counter-culture among the laity in America but do any of them listen?

In the main, I think not. i.e.

Catholic bishops rebuke Trump’s asylum changes, suggest ‘canonical penalties’ - Religion News Service

Catholic bishops rebuke Trump’s asylum changes, suggest ‘canonical penalties’

FORT LAUDERDALE, Fla. (RNS) — The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops opened its spring meeting this week with a stern reproach of the Trump administration’s latest immigration policies, with the group’s president suggesting the new rules on asylum are a “right to life” issue.

Some bishops followed by urging protests, including “canonical penalties” for those who carry out the administration’s new rules.​

For some reason, a number have come to regard the GOP, neo-liberal economics, libertarian philosophy and in particular Trump as being a more sure conduit of moral truth and revelation than the Magisterium of a Church supposedly founded by the Son of God. The more considered amongst them will try and twist the social teachings of the Popes to fit their narrow partisan agenda but many are now openly hostile.

There is a shocking degree of anti-clericalism - and especially, anti-papalism directed against Francis, whom they call "the Dictator Pope" (a ludicrous appellation, I mean what pope in history hasn't been a "dictator" in conventional terms? He's meant to be the bloody supreme pontiff!) - rife in these groups like Church Militant that would make an old-style Marxist ideologue blush.

In essence, they are using the paedophile scandal as a weapon: the church has lost its moral authority, they say, whereas for some reason Trump is beyond reproach.

Its a very, very disturbing phenomenon and as I said above, I expect that excommunications could come in the future as the Church grows to treat this as a modern-day heresy.

I should note that these movements represent a minority of the American Catholic Church but a worrying minority nonetheless.

 

[Stevicus]

So, should we expect the Spanish Inquisition to follow?

 

[pearl]

I should note that these movements represent a minority of the American Catholic Church but a worrying minority nonetheless.

Indeed it is worrying. It was a 'minority' that got the ear of the conservative hierarchy post Vatican II and there wasn't the social media to spread their anti-Francis venom.
What I do not understand is why 'all' Catholics apparently do not believe we are ONE Church, the same teaching church, guided by the same Holy Spirit, not the church of Trent or Vatican II.

 

[exchemist]

Indeed it is worrying. It was a 'minority' that got the ear of the conservative hierarchy post Vatican II and there wasn't the social media to spread their anti-Francis venom.
What I do not understand is why 'all' Catholics apparently do not believe we are ONE Church, the same teaching church, guided by the same Holy Spirit, not the church of Trent or Vatican II.

Really? Factions and splinter groups have been a feature of all religions since the dawn of time and there is no reason for Catholicism to think itself immune, as history amply shows.

But this is not a genuine theological difference: it is just some unpleasant people trying to dress up their intolerance in religious clothing.

 

[exchemist]

So, should we expect the Spanish Inquisition to follow?

 

[Estro Felino]

LOL...Pope Francis is clearly a leftist.
He doesn't like Trump and unleashes the Italian clergy against our populist government who supports Trump

 

[exchemist]

LOL...Pope Francis is clearly a leftist.
He doesn't like Trump and unleashes the Italian clergy against our populist government who supports Trump

Well it would be surprising if the Pope were to like boorish liars.

 

[pearl]

rife in these groups like Church Militant that would make an old-style Marxist ideologue blush.

There was a reason why the Fathers of Vat II, in formulating a synthesis of the Church's self-understanding, chose not 'the nature of the Church Militant, but from 'Lumen gentium' 'the mystery of the Church.'
As I have stated before we are one Church, there is a rediscovery of forgotten aspects that had always been part of her heritage, a novel experience of new dimensions of this one church by means of conscious and renewed assimilation of her old contents. 'The Church is merely fulfilling her mission, which consists of maintaining the never-fading novelty of Christ as it constantly renews itself and making it accessible to al people of all times.'

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Its a very, very disturbing phenomenon and as I said above, I expect that excommunications could come in the future as the Church grows to treat this as a modern-day heresy.

When abortion restrictions were removed in Canada, and again when same-sex marriage was legalized, the Church tried to coerce Catholic lawmakers with threats that they might be denied the Eucharist, but they didn't follow through.

Given that track record, why would be American immigration policy be the line in the sand for the Catholic Church?

 

[metis]

This is Catholic fundamentalism at its worse.

I have long been a stern critic of American lay Catholicism, which has become disturbingly permeated with explicitly anti-Catholic, right-wing nativist infilitration.

The USCCB (The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops) is frequently making pronouncements critical of this insidious counter-culture among the laity in America but do any of them listen?

I fully agree with both of you, but we also have to remember that even back in Jesus; time, some talked-the-talk but didn't walk-the-walk. Because of diversity within the Church, this is to be expected, at least to a degree.

BTW, according to "America" magazine, those that attend mass an average of once a week were significantly less likely to have voted for Trump than the "holiday Catholics" or those who very rarely attend.

I've mentioned this before, and that is that one has to pick whether they believe in Jesus or Trump because it's virtually impossible to believe in both without having a serious problem with "cognitive dissonance". And a litmus test for that are the
Seven Deadly Sins: pride, greed, lust, envy,gluttony, wrath and sloth. If we compare Jesus and Trump on these, there's a HUGE difference as anyone should be able to tell.

 

[exchemist]

I fully agree with both of you, but we also have to remember that even back in Jesus; time, some talked-the-talk but didn't walk-the-walk. Because of diversity within the Church, this is to be expected, at least to a degree.

BTW, according to "America" magazine, those that attend mass an average of once a week were significantly less likely to have voted for Trump than the "holiday Catholics" or those who very rarely.

I've mentioned this before, and I'll do it again, one has to pick whether they believe in Jesus or Trump because it's virtually impossible to believe in both without having a serious problem with "cognitive dissonance". And a litmus test for that is the
Seven Deadly Sins: pride, greed, lust, envy,gluttony, wrath and sloth. If we compare Jesus and Trump on these, there's a HUGE difference as anyone should be able to tell.

That made me laugh - nervously.

I had not thought of it before, but it's uncanny how many of the deadly sins are epitomised in the person of the Orange One.

But he's very popular with the "Religious Right".........'nuff said.......

 

[Father Heathen]

LOL...Pope Francis is clearly a leftist.

As was Jesus, judging by his teachings and example.

 

[pearl]

one has to pick whether they believe in Jesus or Trump

Trump is merely the latest personification giving public voice to their agenda of bringing back the 'good ole days' when 'sin' was clearly defined for them.
And so was their politics. All one need do is look at the controversy over
Cardinal Joseph Bernardin's
'Seamless Garment'.

Pope Francis: "The church, ‘the seamless garment of the Lord,’ cannot allow herself to be rent, broken or fought over."

https://www.americamagazine.org/faith/2017/11/17/can-seamless-garment-approach-pro-life-issues-make-comeback-catholic-church