By the way -- if you claim to be a Christian...

[metis]

Not really obvious and still doesn’t make sense,
but will leave it at that.

OK, let me briefly explain that there's a difference between belief versus living out what's been taught, such as what we see playing out between the "Sheep" and the "Goats" in Mattew 25. The latter believe about Jesus but not in him as they don't live what's expected of them as his followers.

 

[ElishaElijah]

OK, let me briefly explain that there's a difference between belief versus living out what's been taught, such as what we see playing out between the "Sheep" and the "Goats" in Mattew 25. The latter believe about Jesus but not in him as they don't live what's expected of them as his followers.

Yeah that’s right there is

 

[2ndpillar]

What commandments are you thinking are false? Jesus said this:
”Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.”“
‭‭John‬ ‭6‬:‭29‬ ‭NKJV‬‬
I do that but you don’t because you don’t believe He is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the World.
You also miss-represent what Paul said in Corinthians, bearing false witness:
”Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption. Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed— in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: “Death is swallowed up in victory.” “O Death, where is your sting? O Hades, where is your victory?” The sting of death is sin, and the strength of sin is the law. But thanks be to God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ. Therefore, my beloved brethren, be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your labor is not in vain in the Lord.“
‭‭I Corinthians‬ ‭15‬:‭50‬-‭58‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

Who did God send? He sent the "Word of God" made flesh. As for the "last trumpet" of Matthew 24:31 & Zech 9:5-14, is with respect to "immediately after the tribulation" (Mt 24:29) whereas the "tribulation" will include "Gaza too will writhe in great pain", as is being done today.

 

[metis]

Who did God send? He sent the "Word of God" made flesh. As for the "last trumpet" of Matthew 24:31 & Zech 9:5-14, is with respect to "immediately after the tribulation" (Mt 24:29) whereas the "tribulation" will include "Gaza too will writhe in great pain", as is being done today.

So, God didn't care about anyone prior to 2000 years ago?

 

[2ndpillar]

OK, let me briefly explain that there's a difference between belief versus living out what's been taught, such as what we see playing out between the "Sheep" and the "Goats" in Mattew 25. The latter believe about Jesus but not in him as they don't live what's expected of them as his followers.

The "message" of the "son of man"/Yeshua, was the "kingdom of heaven" (Matthew 13:13-50), whereas only those with eyes to see, the righteous, will understand. The "wicked"/lawless will remain in the dark (Daniel 12:10). Matthew 25 is with respect to the good fruits required to escape the coming fire as stated in Matthew 3:10. The "message" of the "son of man" was greater than just Matthew 25.

 

[metis]

The "message" of the "son of man"/Yeshua, was the "kingdom of heaven" (Matthew 13:13-50), whereas only those with eyes to see, the righteous, will understand. The "wicked"/lawless will remain in the dark (Daniel 12:10).

That's too close to the concept of predestination for me to accept.

Matthew 25 is with respect to the good fruits required to escape the coming fire as stated in Matthew 3:10. The "message" of the "son of man" was greater than just Matthew 25.

Not so, as that parable reflects Jesus' Two Commandments that encompasses all the remaining 611. And Jesus concludes that believe is simply not enough for salvation but living out the faith is.


BTW, why didn't you answer my question in #2644?

 

[ElishaElijah]

Who did God send? He sent the "Word of God" made flesh. As for the "last trumpet" of Matthew 24:31 & Zech 9:5-14, is with respect to "immediately after the tribulation" (Mt 24:29) whereas the "tribulation" will include "Gaza too will writhe in great pain", as is being done today.

Why don’t you believe and apply what Jesus Christ clearly says:
”Jesus answered and said to him, “Are you the teacher of Israel, and do not know these things? Most assuredly, I say to you, We speak what We know and testify what We have seen, and you do not receive Our witness. If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things? No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven. And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life. For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.“
‭‭John‬ ‭3‬:‭10‬-‭17‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

 

[2ndpillar]

So, God didn't care about anyone prior to 2000 years ago?

I don't know, in the time of Jonah, he warned the people to turn from wickedness/lawlessness. In the time of Noah, he warned the people to turn from their wickedness/lawlessness. In the time of Adam, he gave Adam and Eve a commandment to keep, yet apparently, the devil's influence and the promise of everlasting life was too much for them.

That's too close to the concept of predestination for me to accept.

Having an "elect" of God, is apparently too much of a concept for you to accept. The "son of man" came as a light for all, that all might believe through him. Yet the "world did not know him". Yeshua came as a "witness, that he might bear witness of the light, that all might believe through him", though "he was not the light". (John 1) The light and the truth came through Yeshua, the "Word of God" made flesh, yet the world did not know him.

Not so, as that parable reflects Jesus' Two Commandments that encompasses all the remaining 611. And Jesus concludes that believe is simply not enough for salvation but living out the faith is.

There was no mention of 611 commandments in Mt 22. The Commandments that Yeshua listed one must keep to enter into life, were taken from the 10 Commandments with respect to loving one's neighbor. (Mt 19:16-19).

 

[Trailblazer]

Obadiah is only two pages long, and it is full of prophecies which have not been fulfilled, and they are aimed around the land of Edom going to Israel, which is now being fulfilled by Israel about to take the land given to Jacob/Israel back from the sons of Essau/Edom, which was initiated in 1948, 1967 and is ongoing, and has nothing to do with Baha as a prophet or a messiah. I can say that of all the prophets, but they are way longer than 2 pages. The whole "message" of Yeshua is symbolic, in that his message the "kingdom of heaven", was made with parables, with the aim of only the righteous being able to understand (Matthew 13:13-14 & Isaiah 6:8-9).

Yes, as I said, most of the prophecies for the messianic age have not been fulfilled yet since we are only about 70 years into an age that will last no less than 1000 years.

However, all the prophecies for the return of Christ/coming of the messiah have been fulfilled.

There are so many prophecies but Micah 7:12 is a good one.

Please note that Baha’u’llah had no control over His own destiny for the last 40 years of His Life after He declared His mission because He was deemed a prisoner of the government He was banished and exiled from place to place. The following prophecy was fulfilled by these exiles and banishments.

Micah 7:12 In that day also he shall come even to thee from Assyria, and from the fortified cities, and from the fortress even to the river, and from sea to sea, and from mountain to mountain.

He shall come from Assyria: At that time Assyria was a large area. Baha’u’llah and His family lived in the part that was Persia, now Iran, in the city of Tihran.

and from the fortified cities: Baha’u’llah was banished from city to city: After being released from the Black Pit dungeon in Tihran in 1852, His family and companions had only a short time before being sent to the fortified city of Baghdad. While living in Baghdad, He gained such a large following that the enemies where shocked. Right away He was banished again, this time to the fortified city of Istanbul.

The Governor of the city refused many times to fulfill the orders that he received to banish Him again. Finally forced to follow orders, Baha’u’llah was banished again to the fortified city of Adrianople. He was honored and praised, and shown respect everywhere, until He was finally sent to the most horrific of all places, the fortress of Akka, where it was expected that He would succumb to the terrible conditions.

and from the fortress even to the river: It was while in Baghdad that the Tigris river became a special place, as Baha’u’llah crossed it to the Ridvan Garden. April 21, 1863 was the fulfilment of prophecy, as that was when Baha’u’llah declared to those around Him His Station as the Manifestation of God.

and from sea to sea: After His banishment in Baghdad, His exile was by way of the Black Sea. Still a prisoner He crossed the Black Sea from Sinope on His way to Constantinople. After the banishment in Adrianople, He crossed the Mediterranean Sea from Gallipolis in Turkey, embarking at Alexandria, Egypt, then on to the fortress of 'Akka, the most desolate of cities.

and from mountain to mountain: The time in Baghdad was turbulent with opposition. To protect His family and companions Baha’u’llah went to the Kurdistan mountains. There He lived in poverty, but the area was magnetized by His presence. After two years, He was persuaded to return to Baghdad.

The other mountain was in Israel, Mount Carmel, where He had docked before His final journey to Akka. Later He had a chance to return to Mount Carmel, to pitch His tent. Here He wrote the Tablet Of Carmel, surrounded by pilgrims looking for the return of Christ to descend from heaven. Mount Carmel is the headquarters of the Baha’i Faith.

From: William Sears, Thief in the Night

Map of Baháʼu'lláh's banishments

 

[Dimi95]

A false prophet is one who makes a false prophecy?

So Muhammad is a false prophet?

Sahih al-Bukhari 4428 - Book 64, Hadith 450
'The Prophet (ﷺ) in his ailment in which he died, used to say, "O `Aisha! I still feel the pain caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and at this time, I feel as if my aorta is being cut from that poison.'

Q 69:44-46
"And if the apostle Were to invent Any sayings in Our name,
We should certainly seize him By his right hand,
And We should certainly Then cut off the artery Of his heart"

I am going by your standard.

 

[Dimi95]

Having an "elect" of God, is apparently too much of a concept for you to accept. The "son of man" came as a light for all, that all might believe through him.

John 8:12
"When Jesus spoke again to the people, he said, 'I am the light of the world.'Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life."

He claimed 'light' as he claimes 'way' , 'truth' 'life'.

Jesus also said:
'I am the resurrection and the life. The one who believes in me will live, even though they die;'

So you can put that 'through him' in the basket.

Yet the "world did not know him".

John 1:
'He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him.'

You can note what was made through him.

You use verses , but not complete,why?

Yeshua came as a "witness, that he might bear witness of the light, that all might believe through him"

,
False
Jesus claimed to be the light as explained in John 11:25-26

And not through him , but in him.

You use 'through him' to justify your belief.

Is this what Dawaghandist are teaching you?

though "he was not the light". (John 1)

John 1
In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind.

life = light

a=b b=c , a=c

also

John 1
There was a man sent from God whose name was John.He came as a witness to testify concerning that light, so that through him all might believe.He himself was not the light; he came only as a witness to the light.

The light and the truth came through Yeshua, the "Word of God" made flesh, yet the world did not know him.

Again the same
Jesus claims to be the light , way , truth , life , ressurection..

He did not say - 'i come with the truth' , he said 'I am the truth'

There was no mention of 611 commandments in Mt 22. The Commandments that Yeshua listed one must keep to enter into life, were taken from the Commandments with respect to loving one's neighbor. (Mt 19:16-19).

No, no
The greatest commandment is 'Love your God with all your heart , all your soul and all your mind'

Second is : 'Love your neighbor as yourself'

Matthew 22:40
'On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.'

Any questions?

 

[metis]

I don't know, in the time of Jonah, he warned the people to turn from wickedness/lawlessness. In the time of Noah, he warned the people to turn from their wickedness/lawlessness. In the time of Adam, he gave Adam and Eve a commandment to keep, yet apparently, the devil's influence and the promise of everlasting life was too much for them.

You continue to avoid the question, namely why would God supposedly ignore those who lived more than 2-3000 years ago and/or who lived in different areas of the world whereas they wouldn't know anything about the God of Israel? You keep avoiding that question.

Having an "elect" of God, is apparently too much of a concept for you to accept.

Why would God "elect" only some and ignore all the others, especially before Jesus' time? How is that logical?

Yeshua came as a "witness, that he might bear witness of the light, that all might believe through him", though "he was not the light". (John 1) The light and the truth came through Yeshua, the "Word of God" made flesh, yet the world did not know him.

Which again is totally illogical, and it's mean spirited to boot.

There was no mention of 611 commandments in Mt 22. The Commandments that Yeshua listed one must keep to enter into life, were taken from the 10 Commandments with respect to loving one's neighbor. (Mt 19:16-19).

There were and are 613 Commandments as found in Torah-- not just 10. Jesus mentions them when he said in Matthew [22]37 "Jesus said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”

BTW, here's where you can find the 613: A List of the 613 Mitzvot (Commandments) - Judaism 101 (JewFAQ)

 

[2ndpillar]

You continue to avoid the question, namely why would God supposedly ignore those who lived more than 2-3000 years ago and/or who lived in different areas of the world whereas they wouldn't know anything about the God of Israel? You keep avoiding that question.

The God of Israel was the same God of Abraham, Noah, and Adam. Adam was from the beginning. Apparently, the God of Noah, didn't ignore the people of Noah's time, nor will he ignore the people of today, whether they acknowledge the God of Israel or not. It will come down to how they treat their neighbors. Whether they murder, lie to, or take their neighbor's wife, it will all be written down in the book of life, and from their deeds, they will be judged (Revelation 20:12). Whether they are judged now or later, no one escapes the white thrown judgment. In the meantime, you have the tribulation, the day of the LORD (Joel 2:31-32) to look forward to, unless of course you "sleep"/die beforehand.

Revelation 20:12 And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds.

Why would God "elect" only some and ignore all the others, especially before Jesus' time? How is that logical?

God has known the "elect" from the foundation of the world. You can declare your ability to be logical, such as numbered among the wise and intelligent, but God says that the wisdom of God will be withheld from you (Matthew 11:25-27). God knew the "elect" before they were born.

Jeremiah 1:5 “Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you; I appointed you a prophet to the nations.”

Which again is totally illogical, and it's mean spirited to boot.

Take our complaint to God. Or possibly, you don't think John in John 1 was telling the Truth, but then again you might think your take is superior to John's because of your supposedly superior "logic".

There were and are 613 Commandments as found in Torah-- not just 10. Jesus mentions them when he said in Matthew [22]37 "Jesus said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”

BTW, here's where you can find the 613: A List of the 613 Mitzvot (Commandments) - Judaism 101 (JewFAQ)

The 10 Commandments, Law of God, are in the ark of the covenant. The 1st four are with respect to how to love God, and the last 6 are for loving your neighbor. The Law of God, the Commandments, are for every person (Ecclesiastes 12:10), whereas the law of Moses, are for the sanctification of Israel.

 

[2ndpillar]

John 8:12
"When Jesus spoke again to the people, he said, 'I am the light of the world.'Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life."

He claimed 'light' as he claimes 'way' , 'truth' 'life'.

Jesus also said:
'I am the resurrection and the life. The one who believes in me will live, even though they die;'

So you can put that 'through him' in the basket.

John 1:1, "In the beginning was the Word" John 1:14, "and the Word became flesh" The "Word" came before the "Word made flesh".
John 1:9 "There was the true light which coming into the world, enlightens every man."

Yeshua was the "Word (Law and the prophets) made flesh", which in the last supper was depicted as the unleavened bread of life, which would be the Word of God without the leaven (hypocrisy of the Pharisees), which one must eat. The "Word" is the Spirit of Revelation, and is the Spirit of God, which in the last supper was described as the blood/wine, in which one must drink. You can read the Law and the Prophets, the "Word of God", but without the source of life and revelation, the "Word", the Spirit of Revelation, one is simply delegated to be as a hypocritical empty shell. If one does not "believe" in "me", the Word made flesh, though they die, they will not live. You cannot nail the Word of God to a cross and expect a good outcome. I suggest that you remove the leaven (teachings of the Pharisee of Pharisees) from your bread of life.

 

[Dimi95]

John 1:1, "In the beginning was the Word" John 1:14, "and the Word became flesh" The "Word" came before the "Word made flesh".
John 1:9 "There was the true light which coming into the world, enlightens every man."

In the beginning was the Word , and the Word was with God , and the Word was God.

You are abusing information.

John 1:14
'The Word became flesh'

That means God became flesh

That is how logic works on textual criticism.Maybe you should learn more about mathematics..

Yeshua was the "Word (Law and the prophets) made flesh", which in the last supper was depicted as the unleavened bread of life, which would be the Word of God without the leaven (hypocrisy of the Pharisees), which one must eat. The "Word" is the Spirit of Revelation, and is the Spirit of God, which in the last supper was described as the blood/wine, in which one must drink. You can read the Law and the Prophets, the "Word of God", but without the source of life and revelation, the "Word", the Spirit of Revelation, one is simply delegated to be as a hypocritical empty shell. If one does not "believe" in "me", the Word made flesh, though they die, they will not live. You cannot nail the Word of God to a cross and expect a good outcome. I suggest that you remove the leaven (teachings of the Pharisee of Pharisees) from your bread of life.

You call on Aramaic i see
What does 'Yeshua' mean in Aramaic?


I am not interested in your views,I am interested in how Scripture supports your claims.

You stated two verses and then used Dawaghandist tactics to explain the Bible.So you are using the Quran as source to explain the Bible.

James 1:22
'Do not merely listen to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says.'

 

[Dimi95]

John 1:9 "There was the true light which coming into the world, enlightens every man."

In John 1:8 the emphasis is on John , not Jesus , since we know what is stated in John 1:6

Let's see what John 1:9-11 says

"The true light that gives light to everyone was coming into the world.He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him.He came to that which was his own, but his own did not receive him."

The true light is Jesus , since Jesus claims to be the light in John 8:12
'I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life.'.

That is why in John 10 it says 'He' and not 'It'.
'He' is Jesus - the Logos , which is God according to John 1.

You did not reply on my first responce , is Muhammad then a false prophet , since i am using the same standard as you?

 

[Dimi95]

Yeshua was the "Word (Law and the prophets) made flesh"

Yeshua is the Logos and not your poofy explenation which is also dismissed by
Maathew 5:17
'Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.'

Where does he say 'I am the Law'?
You are cluless when claims are considered,and that is expected because of your Dawaghandist tactics.

which in the last supper was depicted as the unleavened bread of life, which would be the Word of God without the leaven (hypocrisy of the Pharisees), which one must eat.

More tactics and playing chess with words as many do.
which would be 'Yeshua' as he is the Logos.

Here is what Yeshua said in the Last Supper

Luke 22:19
"And he took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, 'This is my body given for you; do this in remembrance of me'."

The "Word" is the Spirit of Revelation, and is the Spirit of God, which in the last supper was described as the blood/wine, in which one must drink.

Again already seen tactic

Same chapter
'In the same way, after the supper he took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood, which is poured out for you.'

You can read the Law and the Prophets, the "Word of God", but without the source of life and revelation, the "Word", the Spirit of Revelation, one is simply delegated to be as a hypocritical empty shell.

I suggest that you read the NT one more time , as abusing words is obvious in your explenations.

If one does not "believe" in "me", the Word made flesh, though they die, they will not live. You cannot nail the Word of God to a cross and expect a good outcome.

We do not determine what is the outcome , God does.
And the Logos was on a cross 2 000 years ago.
Our faith is based on the eyewitness of the Apostles.

I suggest that you remove the leaven (teachings of the Pharisee of Pharisees) from your bread of life.

I suggest that you should re-study the Bible and you can come back again.We are always here to talk.

Byeee

 

[2ndpillar]

Yeshua is the Logos and not your poofy explenation which is also dismissed by
Maathew 5:17
'Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.'

Where does he say 'I am the Law'?
You are cluless when claims are considered,and that is expected because of your Dawaghandist tactics.

Now you are arguing against yourself. Matthew 5:17 is with respect to the son of man, Yeshua, coming to fulfill the Law and the prophets, which as of today, has not been completed/fulfilled, and not one stroke or letter of the Law and the prophets shall pass away until "all is accomplished. Anyone trying to do so will be called "least" in the kingdom of heaven (Matthew 5:17-19). Keep in mind that Saul's name was changed to "Paul", which means small, and the foremost of small/little is least, and everyone knows that Paul is the foremost of everything, such as the foremost sinner. When a person is unable to debate a subject, the first thing they go to is insults.

 

[2ndpillar]

More tactics and playing chess with words as many do.
which would be 'Yeshua' as he is the Logos.

Here is what Yeshua said in the Last Supper

Luke 22:19
"And he took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to them, saying, 'This is my body given for you; do this in remembrance of me'."

Well, Yeshua spoke in parables with regard to the "kingdom of heaven" (Matthew 13:13-14). He used imagery in his descriptions. No one eats a slain son of man for their sins, that would be the traditions of pagans. The "unleavened bread" which the disciples ate, was the bread of life, without the leaven of the Pharisees, which is imagery for the hypocrisy of the Pharisees. As for the wine, Yeshua would not again drink the wine until "I drink it new with you in My Father's Kingdom" (Mt 26:29), which only happens "immediately after the tribulation" (Mt 24:29-31). The feast of Booths is the fall festival, when Israel came out of Egypt/nations, and in the end, will commemorate when Israel is gathered out of the nations/Gentiles again, and joined with Judah (Ezekiel 36 & 37).

 

[Dimi95]

Now you are arguing against yourself. Matthew 5:17 is with respect to the son of man, Yeshua, coming to fulfill the Law and the prophets, which as of today, has not been completed/fulfilled, and not one stroke or letter of the Law and the prophets shall pass away until "all is accomplished. Anyone trying to do so will be called "least" in the kingdom of heaven (Matthew 5:17-19).

Read Revelation 21 and 22 , maybe you will learn something

Keep in mind that Saul's name was changed to "Paul", which means small, and the foremost of small/little is least, and everyone knows that Paul is the foremost of everything, such as the foremost sinner. When a person is unable to debate a subject, the first thing they go to is insults.

No i didn't , just because you can't handle the answer , doesn't mean it is insult.

Read first Matthew 20:1-16 and take note of 16th verse

"So the last will be first, and the first will be last."