By the way -- if you claim to be a Christian...

[URAVIP2ME]

Genesis 26:5 because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.”

James 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered up Isaac his son on the altar? 22You see that faith was working with his works, and as a result of the works, faith was perfected; 23and the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “AND ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS RECKONED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS,” and he was called the friend of God. 24You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone. 25In the same way, was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out by another way? 26For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.

I find Abraham and Moses did Not live in the same time frame. ( I think the difference was about 400 years )
So, the laws at Gen. 26:5 was in connection to Genesis 17:10,23; Genesis 22:3,12 and Not the Mosaic Law.

 

[YoursTrue]

I looked in the TANACH and from the Hebrew at Ecc. 3:19 (page 1735) it says ALL have the same spirit.
So, like the animals our spirit is also a genderless ' it ' - Ecclesiastes 12:7 B

Right.

 

[ElishaElijah]

Genesis 26:5 because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.”

James 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered up Isaac his son on the altar? 22You see that faith was working with his works, and as a result of the works, faith was perfected; 23and the Scripture was fulfilled which says, “AND ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS RECKONED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS,” and he was called the friend of God. 24You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone. 25In the same way, was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out by another way? 26For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.

Jame 5:16-17 Therefore, confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another so that you may be healed. The effective prayer of a righteous man can accomplish much. 17Elijah was a man with a nature like ours, and he prayed earnestly that it would not rain, and it did not rain on the earth for three years and six months.

Elijah was a righteous man, with a nature like ours, yet when he prayed, it would rain, or he also raised the dead, and healed the sick. How is your righteousness manifested. Was the pope able to cast out demons when he tried?

Justified by works of faith not by works of the Law. They are different works and people don’t recognize that but if you look at and understand what James is communicating, you can see that.
Example God told Abraham to leave his family to a land God promised and the works of faith were, he left not knowing where he was going because He believed God.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

The problem with this passage is it is a circular assumption that all individuals with an 'inquiring mind' will follow the Biblical truth and follow him, which is only true for those that believe one of the many varied conflicting claims of truth is the true one, The bottom line is the inquiring mind is rare and by far most follow their parents of peers choice. many in the comfortable Western culture my church shop for the shoes that fit, but do not wander far from the fold.
The conclusion of each of the many conflicting religions and their divisions, is that is one must have an 'inquiring mind" and you would believe as they do.

Apparently few have an inquiring mind because Jesus said MANY would prove false at Matthew 7:21-23.
When I was about age 20 I asked people if they went to church and why.
Only one person answered to worship God.
The rest said basically because of family/parents, it's the thing to do, even I don't go...............
Turned out the one who said ' to worship God ' did Not like the Bible books written by Paul.
So, yes, to have an inquiring mind about what the Bible really teaches, then to test out or taste to see. - Psalm 34:8
No wonder Jesus talked about the broad or spacious road in a negative way at Matthew 7:13-14

 

[YoursTrue]

I find Abraham and Moses did Not live in the same time frame. ( I think the difference was about 400 years )
So, the laws at Gen. 26:5 was in connection to Genesis 17:10,23; Genesis 22:3,12 and Not the Mosaic Law.

Thanks for that.The covenant between God and Abraham is in one of the references you provided. Genesis 17, I quote from the NIV:
9Then God said to Abraham, “As for you, you must keep my covenant, you and your descendants after you for the generations to come. 10This is my covenant with you and your descendants after you, the covenant you are to keep: Every male among you shall be circumcised. 11You are to undergo circumcision, and it will be the sign of the covenant between me and you.

This was before the Mosaic Law Covenant between Israel and God.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Justified by works of faith not by works of the Law. They are different works and people don’t recognize that but if you look at and understand what James is communicating, you can see that.
Example God told Abraham to leave his family to a land God promised and the works of faith were, he left not knowing where he was going because He believed God.

Very interesting contrasting the 'works of faith' (John 13:34-35 example) with the 'works of the Law' - Romans 10:4
James was writing about 'spiritual works' after the Mosaic Law ended.
Paul in Hebrews was writing to Jewish Christians, and now No circumcision works of the law in effect. - Acts 15

 

[YoursTrue]

is no longer

Thanks for that.The covenant between God and Abraham is in one of the references you provided. Genesis 17, I quote from the NIV:
9Then God said to Abraham, “As for you, you must keep my covenant, you and your descendants after you for the generations to come. 10This is my covenant with you and your descendants after you, the covenant you are to keep: Every male among you shall be circumcised. 11You are to undergo circumcision, and it will be the sign of the covenant between me and you.

This was before the Mosaic Law Covenant between Israel and God.

@URAVIP2ME and also, yes, he listened to God who told him to move...counted to him as righteousness. Abraham had special communication with God and obviously Abraham passed this information on to his descendants.

 

[shunyadragon]

Apparently few have an inquiring mind because Jesus said MANY would prove false at Matthew 7:21-23.
When I was about age 20 I asked people if they went to church and why.
Only one person answered to worship God.
The rest said basically because of family/parents, it's the thing to do, even I don't go...............
Turned out the one who said ' to worship God ' did Not like the Bible books written by Paul.
So, yes, to have an inquiring mind about what the Bible really teaches, then to test out or taste to see. - Psalm 34:8
No wonder Jesus talked about the broad or spacious road in a negative way at Matthew 7:13-14

The circular reason to justify ones own over others remains problematic as described in post #2,494.

There are hundreds at least of conflicting beliefs claim the narrow road to 'true' belief.

 

[2ndpillar]

Justified by works of faith not by works of the Law. They are different works and people don’t recognize that but if you look at and understand what James is communicating, you can see that.
Example God told Abraham to leave his family to a land God promised and the works of faith were, he left not knowing where he was going because He believed God.

Whether building an ark, being a spy for Joshua, or attempting to sacrifice Isaac, a work of faith, goes way past "believing", it requires an action. The fact that Elijah was "righteous" and like Abraham, listened to the "Word"/voice of God, enabled him to have his prayer acted upon. On the other hand, your prayers can't heal yourself, much less anyone else. Why is that? Yeshua's message was that you needed to keep the Commandments to enter into life (Mt 19:17). Yet you follow the church of Paul, and say it is not necessary to keep God' Commandments, but on the other hand, you keep the commandments and decrees laid down by the "beast with two horns like a lamb", Constantine. I am thinking that that won't end well.

 

[ElishaElijah]

Yet you follow the church of Paul, and say it is not necessary to keep God' Commandments, but on the other hand, you keep the commandments and decrees laid down by the "beast with two horns like a lamb", Constantine. I am thinking that that won't end well.

Maybe this passage will help bring clarity because you’re understanding about what Paul taught and how he lived is wrong. Also your understanding of salvation isn’t right either.
”And when we had come to Jerusalem, the brethren received us gladly. On the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present. When he had greeted them, he told in detail those things which God had done among the Gentiles through his ministry. And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord. And they said to him, “You see, brother, how many myriads of Jews there are who have believed, and they are all zealous for the law; but they have been informed about you that you teach all the Jews who are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children nor to walk according to the customs. What then? The assembly must certainly meet, for they will hear that you have come. Therefore do what we tell you: We have four men who have taken a vow. Take them and be purified with them, and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads, and that all may know that those things of which they were informed concerning you are nothing, but that you yourself also walk orderly and keep the law. But concerning the Gentiles who believe, we have written and decided that they should observe no such thing, except that they should keep themselves from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual immorality.”“
‭‭Acts‬ ‭21‬:‭17‬-‭25‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

 

[2ndpillar]

I find Abraham and Moses did Not live in the same time frame. ( I think the difference was about 400 years )
So, the laws at Gen. 26:5 was in connection to Genesis 17:10,23; Genesis 22:3,12 and Not the Mosaic Law.

The covenant (circumcision) made with Abraham (Genesis 26:5), the covenant made with all the peoples, as Abraham means father of peoples, is not inclusive of the "My commandments, My statutes, and My laws (Gen 17:10,23). One verse has a plural subject, whereas one is singular. In the same vane, Noah was declared righteous, and he wasn't given the covenant of circumcision, yet he walked blameless/perfect (Genesis 6:7). What defines perfect/complete (Mt 19:17-21)? Do you think Noah murdered, stole, lied, committed adultery, and was deemed "perfect" and righteous because he simply believed that God exists, and will be saved by simply calling on the name of the LORD (Joel 2:31), or in the case of Paul, call on the name of the Lord. You have to be deep in the rabbit hole to consume that.

Genesis 6:9 This is the account of Noah and his family. Noah was a righteous man, the only blameless person living on earth at the time, and he walked in close fellowship with God.

Genesis 6:9 (king James bible) These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.

 

[2ndpillar]

Maybe this passage will help bring clarity because you’re understanding about what Paul taught and how he lived is wrong. Also your understanding of salvation isn’t right either.
”And when we had come to Jerusalem, the brethren received us gladly. On the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present. When he had greeted them, he told in detail those things which God had done among the Gentiles through his ministry. And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord. And they said to him, “You see, brother, how many myriads of Jews there are who have believed, and they are all zealous for the law; but they have been informed about you that you teach all the Jews who are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children nor to walk according to the customs. What then? The assembly must certainly meet, for they will hear that you have come. Therefore do what we tell you: We have four men who have taken a vow. Take them and be purified with them, and pay their expenses so that they may shave their heads, and that all may know that those things of which they were informed concerning you are nothing, but that you yourself also walk orderly and keep the law. But concerning the Gentiles who believe, we have written and decided that they should observe no such thing, except that they should keep themselves from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual immorality.”“
‭‭Acts‬ ‭21‬:‭17‬-‭25‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

Not that the unknown author of Acts, supposedly a comrade of Paul, has any weight, but do "Christians", or the Gentile followers of Paul, avoid things sacrificed to idols, or did Paul tell them gods don't exist, and if they have enough faith, they can eat what they want. Per Galatians 2, did Paul circumcise his Gentile friend? Do "Christians" avoid blood, or from things "strangled", or from sexual immorality, or is all dependent on their supposed level of faith? As for Paul shaving his head, well, he is all things to all men, a Greek to the Greeks, and a Pharisee to the Pharisees. Whatever floats their boats. Paul's message seems to be one of double mindedness, or as described as the leaven of the Pharisees.

 

[ElishaElijah]

Not that the unknown author of Acts, supposedly a comrade of Paul, has any weight, but do "Christians", or the Gentile followers of Paul, avoid things sacrificed to idols, or did Paul tell them gods don't exist, and if they have enough faith, they can eat what they want. Per Galatians 2, did Paul circumcise his Gentile friend? Do "Christians" avoid blood, or from things "strangled", or from sexual immorality, or is all dependent on their supposed level of faith? As for Paul shaving his head, well, he is all things to all men, a Greek to the Greeks, and a Pharisee to the Pharisees. Whatever floats their boats. Paul's message seems to be one of double mindedness, or as described as the leaven of the Pharisees.

”And certain men came down from Judea and taught the brethren, “Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved.” Therefore, when Paul and Barnabas had no small dissension and dispute with them, they determined that Paul and Barnabas and certain others of them should go up to Jerusalem, to the apostles and elders, about this question. So, being sent on their way by the church, they passed through Phoenicia and Samaria, describing the conversion of the Gentiles; and they caused great joy to all the brethren. And when they had come to Jerusalem, they were received by the church and the apostles and the elders; and they reported all things that God had done with them. But some of the sect of the Pharisees who believed rose up, saying, “It is necessary to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.” Now the apostles and elders came together to consider this matter. And when there had been much dispute, Peter rose up and said to them: “Men and brethren, you know that a good while ago God chose among us, that by my mouth the Gentiles should hear the word of the gospel and believe. So God, who knows the heart, acknowledged them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He did to us, and made no distinction between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. Now therefore, why do you test God by putting a yoke on the neck of the disciples which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved in the same manner as they.” Then all the multitude kept silent and listened to Barnabas and Paul declaring how many miracles and wonders God had worked through them among the Gentiles. And after they had become silent, James answered, saying, “Men and brethren, listen to me: Simon has declared how God at the first visited the Gentiles to take out of them a people for His name. And with this the words of the prophets agree, just as it is written: ‘After this I will return And will rebuild the tabernacle of David, which has fallen down; I will rebuild its ruins, And I will set it up; So that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord, Even all the Gentiles who are called by My name, Says the Lord who does all these things.’ “Known to God from eternity are all His works. Therefore I judge that we should not trouble those from among the Gentiles who are turning to God, but that we write to them to abstain from things polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from things strangled, and from blood. For Moses has had throughout many generations those who preach him in every city, being read in the synagogues every Sabbath.” Then it pleased the apostles and elders, with the whole church, to send chosen men of their own company to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas, namely, Judas who was also named Barsabas, and Silas, leading men among the brethren. They wrote this letter by them: The apostles, the elders, and the brethren, To the brethren who are of the Gentiles in Antioch, Syria, and Cilicia: Greetings. Since we have heard that some who went out from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your souls, saying, “You must be circumcised and keep the law” —to whom we gave no such commandment— it seemed good to us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men to you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul, men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. We have therefore sent Judas and Silas, who will also report the same things by word of mouth. For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit, and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things: that you abstain from things offered to idols, from blood, from things strangled, and from sexual immorality. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell.“
‭‭Acts‬ ‭15‬:‭1‬-‭29‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

If you’re Jewish, Jesus Christ is your atonement and through Him your sins forgiven and keep your traditions and follow the law, live a Holy life in the Spirit.
If you’re a Gentile, Jesus Christ or your atonement and through Him your sins are forgiven, live a Holy life in the Spirit

 

[2ndpillar]

If you’re Jewish, Jesus Christ is your atonement and through Him your sins forgiven and keep your traditions and follow the law, live a Holy life in the Spirit.
If you’re a Gentile, Jesus Christ or your atonement and through Him your sins are forgiven, live a Holy life in the Spirit

The Jews have not been atoned for and are waiting for a new heart and spirit and a cleansing, and to be resettled on the land given to Jacob/Israel, under the kingship of David. (Ezekiel 37) They are still under the judgment of the LORD (Hosea 5 & 6).
As for the Gentiles, they apparently do not live a holy life in the main, and as they are under the "plagues" of "her"/Babylon, and are nearing the end of their liaison with the son of man, in the form of Hosea 3, their "many days" are coming to an end, and the "harlot", bought for the equivalence of 30 shekels of silver, will be returned to her original husband, the prince of Greece (Daniel 10). At that time Israel will return to seek the LORD and David their king, with respect to the "last days" (Hosea 3:5).

Hosea 3: …2 So I bought her for fifteen shekels of silver and a homer and a lethech of barley. 3Then I said to her, “You must live with me for many days; you must not be promiscuous or belong to another, and I will do the same for you.” 4For the Israelites must live many days without king or prince, without sacrifice or sacred pillar, and without ephod or idol.…

 

[ElishaElijah]

The Jews have not been atoned for and are waiting for a new heart and spirit and a cleansing, and to be resettled on the land given to Jacob/Israel, under the kingship of David. (Ezekiel 37) They are still under the judgment of the LORD (Hosea 5 & 6).
As for the Gentiles, they apparently do not live a holy life in the main, and as they are under the "plagues" of "her"/Babylon, and are nearing the end of their liaison with the son of man, in the form of Hosea 3, their "many days" are coming to an end, and the "harlot", bought for the equivalence of 30 shekels of silver, will be returned to her original husband, the prince of Greece (Daniel 10). At that time Israel will return to seek the LORD and David their king, with respect to the "last days" (Hosea 3:5).

Hosea 3: …2 So I bought her for fifteen shekels of silver and a homer and a lethech of barley. 3Then I said to her, “You must live with me for many days; you must not be promiscuous or belong to another, and I will do the same for you.” 4For the Israelites must live many days without king or prince, without sacrifice or sacred pillar, and without ephod or idol.…

​

Well, you don’t know or understand much and you don’t realize you’re close to blaspheming the Holy Spirit and the wrath of God rests on you

 

[URAVIP2ME]

............................................There are hundreds at least of conflicting beliefs claim the narrow road to 'true' belief.

Yes, there are hundreds at least of conflicting beliefs....... that is a reason why the word 'few' appears at Matthew 7:14
That does Not mean there is Not a narrow road to follow.
I like Psalm 119:105 because Scripture is like a light (flashlight) to our immediate steps and like High Beams illuminating the dark road ahead of us.

 

[2ndpillar]

Well, you don’t know or understand much and you don’t realize you’re close to blaspheming the Holy Spirit and the wrath of God rests on you

Well, one of us is in the doghouse, and I don't think it is me. I will admit that you have the "many" (Mt 7:12-15), on your side, but it is the "many" on their broad path to "destruction". The lemmings have company going over their cliffs, but that doesn't provide comfort when they hit the rocks below.

 

[ElishaElijah]

Well, one of us is in the doghouse, and I don't think it is me. I will admit that you have the "many" (Mt 7:12-15), on your side, but it is the "many" on their broad path to "destruction". The lemmings have company going over their cliffs, but that doesn't provide comfort when they hit the rocks below.

I’m trusting in the blood of Jesus Christ as my atonement and have no confidence in my flesh or works of the law for my righteousness. It’s all what He has done for me, His Works.

 

[Dimi95]

The Bible is the measure to test who is or who isn’t a Christian, by that Word is how everyone is judged and have to answer to God for.
Death isn’t a threat as you falsely say but a reality that we all will face, that is when everyone will have their objective truth. That’s what I said.
I follow the Lord Jesus Christ, show me anywhere that He denied that the Word of God that we possess is His Word, He upheld and confirmed the whole Bible as His Word, true and authentic.
If a person doesn’t believe that then why would they consider themselves a Christian?

This is what Jesus said, I would say this is objective evidence and when you get that.

”“There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and fared sumptuously every day. But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man’s table. Moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham’s bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. “Then he cried and said, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.’ But Abraham said, ‘Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented. And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.’ “Then he said, ‘I beg you therefore, father, that you would send him to my father’s house, for I have five brothers, that he may testify to them, lest they also come to this place of torment.’ Abraham said to him, ‘They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.’ And he said, ‘No, father Abraham; but if one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.’ But he said to him, ‘If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.’ ”“
‭‭Luke‬ ‭16‬:‭19‬-‭31‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

Nietzsche once said:

There was only ever one Christian , and that was Christ.

 

[shunyadragon]

Yes, there are hundreds at least of conflicting beliefs....... that is a reason why the word 'few' appears at Matthew 7:14
That does Not mean there is Not a narrow road to follow.
I like Psalm 119:105 because Scripture is like a light (flashlight) to our immediate steps and like High Beams illuminating the dark road ahead of us.

this whole exchange neglects on your part the fallible human conflicting claims that my way is the only way based on the claim that IF those that have an 'inquiring mind' they would agree with your exclusive belief of the only true way, This so circular it bites you in the butt.

Those that cite pages and pages of ancient text to justify their ancient agenda have the weakest case,

If one has an 'inquiring mind' they would not cling to one ancient tribal agenda and claim their way is the only true way, and have better understanding of science as science, and the diversity of human beliefs over the millennia.