By Faith. Why?

[Audie]

No, l meant find an historian who is reliable.

As regards the irony, l think it's unjust of you to use the same evidence base for me and Subduction Zone. I made it clear in an earlier post that my evidence for God was the Bible. I have been consistent in referring to this source as my evidence.

I've no idea what the subsiding one says.

YOU made the choice to believe the
Bible is reliable.
It is, sometimes, there really is,Egypt
for example.

The evidence for flood is the bible.
The story is complete and obvious
nonense, believed only by people immune
to reason, or fact.
The opinions of people who so impeach
their credibility have zero value.
Likewise their source of " knowledge"
for ANYTHING in it that cannot be verified
by sources outside that book.

 

[2ndpillar]

I sure don't need lessons from you,
whatever gives you the idea you are
a prophet or know more about my
country than I do is a mystery to me.

Or not entirely, since really what you
are doing is just dump #3 in the series of
" I'm not dumping".
Honestly, people in America!

There is less "honesty" in America today, as they have followed the path of Marx, and like Xi, think constraints on free speech and information is a good thing, and the elite, like Xi, hold the strings of media, and indoctrinate their people. Do you have to pay for things with cash, or are you on camera, and the government can just deduct from your account, and give you a rating as to what you buy? Or are you the 48% of the population which make less than $150/month, and do not have credit or afford an I phone? Have you been smelling the smoke of the crematoriums in China which according to statistics, have burned 100 million dead bodies in since Dec 9 of 2023, and not the around 5,000 claimed by the CCP? Get out your sulfur meter and take a test for the level of sulfur in the air. According to Russian and Japanese studies, China only had 970,000,000 citizens before the opening up of the country and the new covid deaths. Did you know that the portable crematoriums sent to Wuhan in 2020 had the capacity to cremate 250 million people over time, and at that time 25 million cell phone accounts mysteriously vanished? I would say that the people who know the least about China are those in China. My friend's Chinese son didn't know that South America, the Philippines, Australia, and Malasia were destroying Chinese fishing vessels for fishing in their waters. The Chinese live behind their own iron curtain, except their "iron bowl" has been removed. You may be too young to know what the Chinese "iron bowl" stands for. If you had Google or You Tube, you could look it up. Or are you an Epat, and have VPN?

 

[2ndpillar]

Another gooney bird making a fly by dumping a smelly load in the dark

I suggest that you along with the Chinese government should embrace "science" and open information and get Google and You Tube and do your own investigating, before you step in something you would rather not.

 

[Redemptionsong]

Two? I can do better than that.
Testimony of Eight Witnesses

You think they swore to it before God, knowing it's a lie?

Christians go on about "who would die for a lie"
as proof, right ?

Here are people giving greater proof!
For lo, their presumptively immortal
SOULS are on the line to die if they lie!

Let THAT sink in.

If Joseph Smith was a prophet, what other prophets witness to him as a prophet?

 

[Audie]

There is less "honesty" in America today, as they have followed the path of Marx, and like Xi, think constraints on free speech and information is a good thing, and the elite, like Xi, hold the strings of media, and indoctrinate their people. Do you have to pay for things with cash, or are you on camera, and the government can just deduct from your account, and give you a rating as to what you buy? Or are you the 48% of the population which make less than $150/month, and do not have credit or afford an I phone? Have you been smelling the smoke of the crematoriums in China which according to statistics, have burned 100 million dead bodies in since Dec 9 of 2023, and not the around 5,000 claimed by the CCP? Get out your sulfur meter and take a test for the level of sulfur in the air. According to Russian and Japanese studies, China only had 970,000,000 citizens before the opening up of the country and the new covid deaths. Did you know that the portable crematoriums sent to Wuhan in 2020 had the capacity to cremate 250 million people over time, and at that time 25 million cell phone accounts mysteriously vanished? I would say that the people who know the least about China are those in China. My friend's Chinese son didn't know that South America, the Philippines, Australia, and Malasia were destroying Chinese fishing vessels for fishing in their waters. The Chinese live behind their own iron curtain, except their "iron bowl" has been removed. You may be too young to know what the Chinese "iron bowl" stands for. If you had Google or You Tube, you could look it up. Or are you an Epat, and have VPN?

Now you know more than I do because
I live here.

 

[Audie]

If Joseph Smith was a prophet, what other prophets witness to him as a prophet?

Oh such a clever sidestep.
Anything but address the topic.

 

[2ndpillar]

Now you know more than I do because
I live here.

That is how it goes when you live in a Marxist totalitarian system. Russians think that they are saving Ukraine from Marxist, when actually they are the Marxist, and are looking at a total defeat, and have lost more than 120,000 soldiers, and claim much less. The people of the Marxist Venezuela at least have had enough of having nothing to eat and are fleeing to the U.S.. The Chinese rich seem to know more than the poor and are trying to save themselves by investing their money overseas, whereas the poor continued up to the present to invest in overpriced Chinese property, which they don't actually own, and which is unfinished, because they aren't told the truth, and don't have anywhere else to invest anyway. They only lease property from the government for 70 years. Now many Chinese can't get what money they have left out of their banks. Now if you had an open press, you would already know all of this. As some places in China have a 90% covid positive tests, how is this possible if the Chinese vaccine actually worked? It didn't work, and now China is importing a Pfizer medication, which is probably no better, but it doesn't matter, because very few will be able to access it. The young athletes in America are dying of heart problems, most probably due to the original Pfizer vaccine. It causes long stringy clots which can kill, a fact the Marxist faction of the US administration doesn't want anyone to know. The Chinese youth, think that invading Taiwan is a good idea. Well, it is a good idea for the fish, when the inadequate transport tries to take young Chinese soldiers across 100 km of torturous seas. The Khan tried to cross similar seas to defeat Japan and wound up losing his whole fleet, by what is called Torah (Typhone), as in the Torah Torah of WWII. Maybe you are too young to understand the phrase Tora Tora and its consequences. If you only had Google, or You Tube.

 

[Audie]

That is how it goes when you live in a Marxist totalitarian system. Russians think that they are saving Ukraine from Marxist, when actually they are the Marxist, and are looking at a total defeat, and have lost more than 120,000 soldiers, and claim much less. The people of the Marxist Venezuela at least have had enough of having nothing to eat and are fleeing to the U.S.. The Chinese rich seem to know more than the poor and are trying to save themselves by investing their money overseas, whereas the poor continued up to the present to invest in overpriced Chinese property, which they don't actually own, and which is unfinished, because they aren't told the truth, and don't have anywhere else to invest anyway. They only lease property from the government for 70 years. Now many Chinese can't get what money they have left out of their banks. Now if you had an open press, you would already know all of this. As some places in China have a 90% covid positive tests, how is this possible if the Chinese vaccine actually worked? It didn't work, and now China is importing a Pfizer medication, which is probably no better, but it doesn't matter, because very few will be able to access it. The young athletes in America are dying of heart problems, most probably due to the original Pfizer vaccine. It causes long stringy clots which can kill, a fact the Marxist faction of the US administration doesn't want anyone to know. The Chinese youth, think that invading Taiwan is a good idea. Well, it is a good idea for the fish, when the inadequate transport tries to take young Chinese soldiers across 100 km of torturous seas. The Khan tried to cross similar seas to defeat Japan and wound up losing his whole fleet, by what is called Torah (Typhone), as in the Torah Torah of WWII. Maybe you are too young to understand the phrase Tora Tora and its consequences. If you only had Google, or You Tube.

I'm putting you on ig., as you are using
me as an excuse to post ignorant bigoted
anti Chinese raving.

 

[Subduction Zone]

You have a habit of regurgitating the same nonsense without regard to evidence.

Can you name me one historian that you believe provides us with reliable history?

Yes, and you just admitted that you argument is not a rational one.

 

[shunyadragon]

No, l meant find an historian who is reliable.

Academic history is not dependent on any single historian, and as a whole is reasonably reliable based on the objective evidence such as archaeology historical records and research and like science is open to change when new evidence becomes available.

As regards the irony, l think it's unjust of you to use the same evidence base for me and Subduction Zone. I made it clear in an earlier post that my evidence for God was the Bible. I have been consistent in referring to this source as my evidence.

The problem remains that your claims of evidence concerning the Bible and prophecy is subjjettiive and anecdotal.

 

[shunyadragon]

I suggest that you along with the Chinese government should embrace "science" and open information and get Google and You Tube and do your own investigating, before you step in something you would rather not.

I do not 'go along' with any government. I go with science as a scientist with over fifty years.

 

[shunyadragon]

If Joseph Smith was a prophet, what other prophets witness to him as a prophet?

Simply to Mormons he is a prophet. To jews and Christians the prophets of the OT are prophets, because of subjective nature of these claims the witness of other prophets is as anecdotal as their claims.

 

[Audie]

Academic history is not dependent on any single historian, and as a whole is reasonably reliable based on the objective evidence such as archaeology historical records and research and like science is open to change when new evidence becomes available.



The problem remains that your claims of evidence concerning the Bible and prophecy is subjjettiive and anecdotal.

Do you know of any accounts of the
supernatural that can be verified by
adequate cross references?

 

[2ndpillar]

I do not 'go along' with any government. I go with science as a scientist with over fifty years. I avoid non-science manure spreaders like you.

I don't know, it seems the "experts", who call themselves disciples of "science", have been stepping in it quite frequently lately, not that they haven't been wrong more times than can be counted in earlier times. As for not going along with "any government", that kind of sounds like a "sovereign citizen", which for good reason has been classified as a terrorist movement and seems a bazaar class of citizen. Facts are facts, regardless of what self-professed "science" experts claim. I suggest that you use your science expertise and find out where Fauci is hiding.

 

[Redemptionsong]

True of all the diverse conflicting claims of the different religions and their divisions..

I cannot believe that a God of truth, which we agree the one God must be, cannot communicate His truth to mankind. Even knowing that lies and deception are at play in this world, it must be possible for an omniscient God to communicate his will and plan of salvation to mankind.

As l see it, the prophet (or man who hears God and responds in faith) must be a key figure in God's plan if God is to successfully communicate his will to mankind.

The safeguards that God could put in place to ensure that prophets are true to their calling are numerous. But, even with threats and safeguards in place, there is still room for the prophet's audience to ignore, reject or kill the prophet before his message is disseminated.

As l have already suggested, one approach, which the God of the Bible appears to have employed, is to find more of than one prophet to speak on an important issue. In so doing, the message is reinforced and its importance is magnified.

Another way of supporting a prophet is to give the prophet supernatural power, as Moses demonstrated to the Pharaoh in Egypt. Even if there are other gods involved, the omnipotence of the one God will always outshine the others.

And then there is the question of God's authority. It's up to the prophet to educate his audience as to the true nature of the God he represents. If his God is not a God of the highest truth, righteous and just in nature, then this must also raise questions as to the authority and majesty of the prophet's God.

Do you take the stance that God is impotent, and unable to get his message disseminated?

 

[2ndpillar]

I'm putting you on ig., as you are using
me as an excuse to post ignorant bigoted
anti Chinese raving.

Am I "ignorant" and "bigoted" because I pointed out that the Leninist/Marxist/Stalinist Putin is claiming he is freeing the Ukrainians from Marxism, or that I said that the regular Chinese citizen does not have access to Google or You Tube, or that I quoted statistics from a Chinese statistician that China has had more the 5000 deaths. Or that China, despite being heavily vaccinated, has around a 90% positive testing rate? Or that the Venezuelans are fleeing Marxist Venezuela? Or that the Marxist administration of the U.S. is subverting information, and lying to the public? Where is your point of disagreement centered? Is your "faith" in the apostle Mao, a disciple of Marx, of the religion of godlessness?

 

[shunyadragon]

I cannot believe that a God of truth, which we agree the one God must be, cannot communicate His truth to mankind. Even knowing that lies and deception are at play in this world, it must be possible for an omniscient God to communicate his will and plan of salvation to mankind.

What you believe or not believe does not determine the nature of God's Revelation and relationship to humanity.

As l see it, the prophet (or man who hears God and responds in faith) must be a key figure in God's plan if God is to successfully communicate his will to mankind.

All those who claim to be prophets from many diverse conflicting claims and messages claim to be key figures in God=s plan.

The safeguards that God could put in place to ensure that prophets are true to their calling are numerous. But, even with threats and safeguards in place, there is still room for the prophet's audience to ignore, reject or kill the prophet before his message is disseminated.

So far God's (?) safeguards have not prevented many prophets to make conflicting claims about the nature of God's Revelation and relationship with humanity.

As l have already suggested, one approach, which the God of the Bible appears to have employed, is to find more of than one prophet to speak on an important issue. In so doing, the message is reinforced and its importance is magnified.

One of many conflicting approaches that make such claims.

I believe you have failed to respond to substance of my posts.

Another way of supporting a prophet is to give the prophet supernatural power, as Moses demonstrated to the Pharaoh in Egypt. Even if there are other gods involved, the omnipotence of the one God will always outshine the others.

So many prophets claim supernatural powers.

And then there is the question of God's authority. It's up to the prophet to educate his audience as to the true nature of the God he represents. If his God is not a God of the highest truth, righteous and just in nature, then this must also raise questions as to the authority and majesty of the prophet's God.

Do you take the stance that God is impotent, and unable to get his message disseminated?

No, but I seriously question the claims of anyone of the many diverse conflicting claims of having the truth when the evidence overwhelming contradicts the claims. I consider Revelation evolving and continuous and does not reflect any one's religion's claims of exclusive Revelation.

The problem like all other diverse conflicting claims it is easily refuted, because of the inconsistencies and contradictions of your ancient religion and all others grounded in an ancient tribal culture that fail to represent any sort of consistent universal truth.

 

[shunyadragon]

Am I "ignorant" and "bigoted"

Yes . . .

 

[shunyadragon]

I don't know, it seems the "experts", who call themselves disciples of "science", have been stepping in it quite frequently lately, not that they haven't been wrong more times than can be counted in earlier times. As for not going along with "any government", that kind of sounds like a "sovereign citizen", which for good reason has been classified as a terrorist movement and seems a bazaar class of citizen. Facts are facts, regardless of what self-professed "science" experts claim. I suggest that you use your science expertise and find out where Fauci is hiding.

I have never met anyone claiming to be a disciple of science, but my computer works fine.

Though you claim to know all there is to know about science, without any education in science.

 

[Audie]

I have never met anyone claiming to be a disciple of science, but my computer works fine.

Though you claim to know all there is to know about science, without any education in science.

Whoever you are responding to-
doesn't matter as it's a universal for any yec or divers of the sort, to claim to know more about science than any scientist, and to be infallible in religious matters.

Not, of course, in all matters of science: few will
pretend to be rocket scientists, but they know
BB and ToE are phony, though no scientist does.

And infallible as to the whether, the which, and more, regarding god.