Bible and the Quaran - same god

[ProfLogic]

The folks at Qumran were Jews.

Sheesh

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Sea_Scrolls

Do you know of any christian that believes in carbon dating? i have met some and they think its just an unproven method..? If they do... they just found the most skull of a little girl to date that is 7 million years old.and the bible goes 5000 years only..... I haven't ask a believer in the Quaran on carbon dating.

 

[d.]

most people can't stand their family

exactly! they're like george constanza's family.

 

[Laila]

It's simple, what God says about Himself in the bible is very different to what he says in the koran, they cannot both be true. The Triune God of the bible has a Son, allah has no son, the God of the bible attaches himself to a particular earthly people namely the Jews, He is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, allah's people descends from Ishmael. He attaches Himself to place -- Jerusalem, allah does not. He offers salvation by grace on a just basis, allah just forgives sin because he is apparently merciful and for no other reason.
I know for the sake of peace and unity people want to say that they are the same but it is ignoring some blatant differences to say so and would take a rank denial of the bible to do so.

You said it. The Old Testament and Gospels were for a particular group of people. The Quran is for all mankind in all times and places. Putting it another way if you got a memo from work regarding the same subject, for example office stationery, one dated last month, one last week and one yesterday which memo would be the most effective and valid.

The truth is all revelations come from the same source (THE GOD). It may help to look at this from a historical point of view.

Judaism has as its holy book the Hebraic Bible. This differs from the Old Testament of the Christians in that the latter have included several books which did not exist in Hebrew. In practice, this divergence hardly makes any difference to the doctrine. Judaism does not however admit any revelation subsequent to its own.

Christianity has taken the Hebraic Bible for itself and added a few supplements to it. The church has made incisive cuts in the profusion of books relating the life and teachings of Jesus. It has only preserved a limited number of writings in the New Testament, the most important of which are the 4 Canonic Gospels. Christianity takes no account of any revelation subsequent to Jesus and his Apostles. It therefore rules out the Quran.

The Quranic Revelation appeared 6 centuries after Jesus. It resumes numerous data found in the Hebraic Bible and Gospels since it quotes very frequently from the Torah and Gospels. The Quran directs all muslims to believe in the sciptures that precede it.

People should believe in what they want, in fact this is in accordance with God given 'free will'. However, one cannot deny the fact that there is only ONE GOD. Regardless of whether you are Christian, Jewish, Hindu or Muslim - there is only one(THE GOD). Of course there are blatant differences in the religions and it is up to people to educate themselves and then go with the truth and logic but the truth remains that there is only ONE GOD.

If people follow or believe that which God does not prescribe it is not the fault of God since this is the test of faith

 

[Quiddity]

Do you know of any christian that believes in carbon dating? i have met some and they think its just an unproven method..? If they do... they just found the most skull of a little girl to date that is 7 million years old.and the bible goes 5000 years only..... I haven't ask a believer in the Quaran on carbon dating.

I don't know where you live but that certainly my experience whatsoever. Plenty of Christians are just fine with carbon dating, evolution, etc. But this is deviating from the OP...

 

[ProfLogic]

wow....
is your family like the brady bunch? if we take the family analogy one step further it makes sense...most people can't stand their family (i know mine get on my nerves and some i don't even talk to anymore)

No... my family can sing dance and act..lol..... but there are families that work together too, between the 3 religions all you hear are the bad blood thats why experiencing things with each is the best way to see reality.. not what's written.

 

[ProfLogic]

I don't know where you live but that certainly my experience whatsoever. Plenty of Christians are just fine with carbon dating, evolution, etc. But this is deviating from the OP...

Just was curious because angelous gave the link about carbon dated material... back to the main program.. There are so many different Christian groups......

 

[Laila]

I believe people always refer something about infidels in the Quaran or is that something else?... it seems to be a parallel to the bible beliefs that anyone that do not worship in the manner that the book refers to are evil..needs to be destoryed, etc? Can you explain this in reference to the Quaran if any?

Secondly, the same god indeed... I am pretty sure others would argue about this because, people still today says that believing int he bible becomes the favor of the self proclaimed god. Now if the self proclaimed god decided to select a different set of people and a different set of scriptures then one of the deemed selected group is incorrect. People into religion most likely thinks they are the just and correct one.

Hi ProfLogic,

The Quran refers to disbelivers since if you don't believe in ALL the revelations from GOD are you not a disbeliever?
This is what it states about disbelievers;

Say: O unbelievers!
I do not serve that which you serve,
Nor do you serve Him Whom I serve:
Nor am I going to serve that which you serve,
Nor are you going to serve Him Whom I serve:
You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.
Quran Surah 109 verse 2-6.

It also states that 'There is no compulsion in religion' Quran Surah 2 verse 256.
You cannot force people to follow your faith they have to find the truth themselves by reason and logic. All will be revealed on the day of judgement.

 

[ProfLogic]

exactly! they're like george constanza's family.

But they only fight with words... which is similar as a debate not the barbaric way of annihilation and slaughter of the innocence. If its one god for them and they think its the same god, then none of them would go to heaven or paradaise since they are destroying their own by trying to get rid of the each party... Wouldn't you say so?

JewSout, then I don't know where judaism goes to since I just saw on the comparison side that judaism, there's no clear afterlife....

 

[ProfLogic]

Hi ProfLogic,

The Quran refers to disbelivers since if you don't believe in ALL the revelations from GOD are you not a disbeliever?
This is what it states about disbelievers;

Say: O unbelievers!
I do not serve that which you serve,
Nor do you serve Him Whom I serve:
Nor am I going to serve that which you serve,
Nor are you going to serve Him Whom I serve:
You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.
Quran Surah 109 verse 2-6.

It also states that 'There is no compulsion in religion' Quran Surah 2 verse 256.
You cannot force people to follow your faith they have to find the truth themselves by reason and logic. All will be revealed on the day of judgement.

That sounds more gentle/respectful than what I have seen in the OT.... There's a jealous god in that book...

Does it tell you where the non believers go?

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Do you know of any christian that believes in carbon dating? i have met some and they think its just an unproven method..? If they do... they just found the most skull of a little girl to date that is 7 million years old.and the bible goes 5000 years only..... I haven't ask a believer in the Quaran on carbon dating.

Plenty of them.

Carbon dating merely compliments other dating methods with the Scrolls. The dating of ancient manuscripts is done primarily by analyzing the handwriting...

 

[ProfLogic]

Plenty of them.

Carbon dating merely compliments other dating methods with the Scrolls. The dating of ancient manuscripts is done primarily by analyzing the handwriting...

SOK thanks lord wiki...ounds like a new thread in the making.. Thanks... And tell the demons if you see them, I been waiting for their master's return for a while now......peace.

 

[Laila]

Where does the Koran say that Allah has no son?

What does the Old Testament say about God's Son?

The differences aren't in the revelation, they're in the religions that different humans created.

That Quran states that God has no son;

Say: He, Allah, is One.
Allah is He on Whom all depend.
He begets not, nor is He begotten.
And none is like Him.
Quran Surah 112 verse 1-4.

Where does it say in the Old Testament that God has a son?

Muslims believe that the Quran is uncorrupted, it has stayed original word for word and it is the word of God and not a human being. If you read it you will find insight into science that could not have been known by anyone except God in that period of time. In fact with todays technology we have only begun to understand the science in some of the verses.

 

[Laila]

That sounds more gentle/respectful than what I have seen in the OT.... There's a jealous god in that book...

Does it tell you where the non believers go?

Hey Proflogic,

Just cause you're a muslim there is no guarantee that it's a ticket to paradise!
All judgement rests with GOD (all knowing and all powerful), I'm just a mere human with very little knowledge.

People are punished for bad deeds and rewarded for good deeds, the ultimate reward is of course paradise. God is the best of Judges.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

And tell the demons if you see them, I been waiting for their master's return for a while now......peace.

You can tell them that yourself.

 

[*Paul*]

Didn't the bible NT introduce the son? I know some portions of religion is just based on the OT.. is that closer to the Quaran?

Ps 2v12: Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him
Isa 9v6: For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
Dan 3v25: He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.
Zech 12v9: And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.
Zech 12v10: And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.
Admittedly you have to think about the Zecharia passage but for my Christian eyes, it's clear enough.

Now who were the Jews expecting, who wasa the Christ to be?: Compare with Isaiah 9v6:
Mt 26v63: But Jesus held his peace. And the high priest answered and said unto him, I adjure thee by the living God, that thou tell us whether thou be the Christ, the Son of God.

 

[jewscout]

No... my family can sing dance and act..lol..... but there are families that work together too, between the 3 religions all you hear are the bad blood thats why experiencing things with each is the best way to see reality.. not what's written.

well then you've never met my family...

 

[Jerrell]

Those who actually know less than they think about the Christian and Moslem God, say they are the same God.
The Attributes are totally diffrent, they do totally diffrent things.

The God of Christianity
1) He calls only Jewsih Prophets
2) He chose the Jewish Poeple
3) He has a Son

The God of Islam
1) He called a Pagan Arab
2)He chose the Arab People
3) He has no son

 

[ProfLogic]

well then you've never met my family...

Just keep trying... By the way I saw that in Judaism... Jesus is the false prophet. Any evidence on this? in Quaran.. Jesus is a prophet and in Christianity jesus is a god. A muslim told me that 1/3 would be saved and jesus himself will come back to tell all the religions who he is.That covers all 3 beliefs but where would people who do not even believe jesus existed nor god belong?

 

[ProfLogic]

Those who actually know less than they think abd the Christian and Moslem God, say they are the same God.
The Attributes are totally diffrent, they do totally diffrent things.

The God of Christianity
1) He calls only Jewsih Prophets
2) He chose the Jewish Poeple
2) He has a Son

The God of Islam
1) He called a Pagan Arab
2)He chose the Arab People
3) He has no son

The interesting part is that the god came from abraham.... Does this mean abraham was confused or possibly 2 abrahams or abram......

 

[ProfLogic]

People are punished for bad deeds and rewarded for good deeds, the ultimate reward is of course paradise. God is the best of Judges.

What is the definition of the god's paradaise in the Quaran.. Is that the 70 virgins description? In the old days translation I always thought virgins are reflective of women.