Ask about Jehovah's Witnesses

[deelo505]

why dont j.w.'s believe in hell and why do they believe on 144000 will go to heaven.i dont get it in the least?

 

[Don Penguinoini]

Is it fun to knock on peoples doors? Or is it one of your ten commandments?

 

[trinity2359]

why dont j.w.'s believe in hell and why do they believe on 144000 will go to heaven.i dont get it in the least?

Actually JWs do believe in Hell [I was a baptized auxiallary pioneer in my younger years, have since recovered nicely ] it just isn't the 'orthodox' version. To them hell is the grave/pit of the OT. The concept of the firery place of torment was figurative language to remind one of the endless burning of the ghehenna (sp) garbage dump - to symbolize eternal destruction, not eternal suffering. Hell is simply non existance.

As for the 144,000 only going to heaven will take some explaining, but generally they take the Revelation number literally and cross that with Jesus' comment about his 'other sheep' and conclude that the rest of faithful humanity will reside on the paradise earth described in Isiah and elsewhere.

 

[trinity2359]

Is it fun to knock on peoples doors? Or is it one of your ten commandments?

It is not one of the ten commandment but it is required to be consider 'active' and be counted. And no it is not fun to knock on doors. As an auxiallary pioneer I knocked on doors/ distributed magazines and conducted bible studies for a minimum of 60 hours month or 15 hours a week on average. Getting doors slammed in your face, controversial householders and indifferent people wasting time in the effort of being polite kind of gets old real quick. Plus you had 5 hours of meetings every week. After I left I felt strange with all this newly found free time LOL.

 

[Don Penguinoini]

It sorta annoys me. Last time i got the Gita from my shelf and blabbed on about that.

 

[deelo505]

Actually JWs do believe in Hell [I was a baptized auxiallary pioneer in my younger years, have since recovered nicely ] it just isn't the 'orthodox' version. To them hell is the grave/pit of the OT. The concept of the firery place of torment was figurative language to remind one of the endless burning of the ghehenna (sp) garbage dump - to symbolize eternal destruction, not eternal suffering. Hell is simply non existance.

i do remember hearing that!

As for the 144,000 only going to heaven will take some explaining, but generally they take the Revelation number literally and cross that with Jesus' comment about his 'other sheep' and conclude that the rest of faithful humanity will reside on the paradise earth described in Isiah and elsewhere.

but if they were to take that number for what it is wouldnt they believe that only the tribes of israel would be in heaven?thats what its speaking of...idk why would they mix that up with the other sheep?
Revelation 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
doesnt it make it clear that the great multitude (i think thats the other sheep correct me if im wrong..im no biblical scholar lol) resisdes in heaven i mean they are standing before the throne?...

 

[Sola'lor]

It is not one of the ten commandment but it is required to be consider 'active' and be counted. And no it is not fun to knock on doors. As an auxiallary pioneer I knocked on doors/ distributed magazines and conducted bible studies for a minimum of 60 hours month or 15 hours a week on average. Getting doors slammed in your face, controversial householders and indifferent people wasting time in the effort of being polite kind of gets old real quick. Plus you had 5 hours of meetings every week. After I left I felt strange with all this newly found free time LOL.

Wow only 60 hours a months? The JW come over to my house occasionally. I'm always happy to have them visit. How long are your missions? As LDS we serve one fulltime procelyting mission for two years. Women serve for one and a helf years. Averaging about 60 hours a week. After that we are expected to still to be missionary just not usually door to door. Just as sort of a mind set. I didn't post this to boast I'm just curious about the diffrences.

 

[trinity2359]

Wow only 60 hours a months? The JW come over to my house occasionally. I'm always happy to have them visit. How long are your missions? As LDS we serve one fulltime procelyting mission for two years. Women serve for one and a helf years. Averaging about 60 hours a week. After that we are expected to still to be missionary just not usually door to door. Just as sort of a mind set. I didn't post this to boast I'm just curious about the diffrences.

You knock on doors until you are dead, LOL. ALL witnesses are commanded to be engaged in 'field service'. There are different categories of service (at least when I was a witness, about 15 years ago)
Inactive publisher - no timesheet for 3 consecutive months, I think?
baptized publisher - turned a timesheet of at least 10 hours so something for the month.
auxiallary pioneer - volunteer to commit to 60 hours per month, can quit at anytime but prefer 1 year at minimum
pioneer publisher - volunteer to commit to 90 hours per month, attend a special school after 6 months of service and again, like a 1 year commitment
speical pioneer/missionary - lifetime commitment to 130 hours per month, attend special school (lliek MTC except it is called Gilead) and receive a stipend and like an LDS mission, the church leadership decides where to send you with limited visits back home.
All other publishers are expected to earn their own support.

 

[trinity2359]

but if they were to take that number for what it is wouldnt they believe that only the tribes of israel would be in heaven?thats what its speaking of...idk why would they mix that up with the other sheep?
Revelation 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
doesnt it make it clear that the great multitude (i think thats the other sheep correct me if im wrong..im no biblical scholar lol) resisdes in heaven i mean they are standing before the throne?...

.. you would think LOL
Their rationale is that the earth is before the throne so it counts.

 

[deelo505]

.. you would think LOL
Their rationale is that the earth is before the throne so it counts.

i guess...but then why what was the purpose of it being said..you know... its said to make a destinction of where they are or else if it was just earth then they would need to say it...lol

 

[Sola'lor]

You knock on doors until you are dead, LOL. ALL witnesses are commanded to be engaged in 'field service'. There are different categories of service (at least when I was a witness, about 15 years ago)
Inactive publisher - no timesheet for 3 consecutive months, I think?
baptized publisher - turned a timesheet of at least 10 hours so something for the month.
auxiallary pioneer - volunteer to commit to 60 hours per month, can quit at anytime but prefer 1 year at minimum
pioneer publisher - volunteer to commit to 90 hours per month, attend a special school after 6 months of service and again, like a 1 year commitment
speical pioneer/missionary - lifetime commitment to 130 hours per month, attend special school (lliek MTC except it is called Gilead) and receive a stipend and like an LDS mission, the church leadership decides where to send you with limited visits back home.
All other publishers are expected to earn their own support.

Cool. I never knew any of that.

 

[trinity2359]

Cool. I never knew any of that.

I just read on one of my JW boards that they have reduced the time requirement since my day. It is now auxillary need 50 hr/month and pioneers need 70 hr/month. Boy was I overworked LOL

 

[deelo505]

First of all, I want to say that any kind of child abuse absolutely disgusts me and I hate it from the depth’s of my soul, and If I thought for one moment that my religion was harbouring these wicked people, the first thing I would do is dial 911 and I would leave without a second thought. In fact, the next time you see a JW in the street, ask them how they feel about paedophiles and you will get a response of utter disgust. Your post is very venomous and one sided, and I bet you don’t even care to listen to our side of the story, right? As a fact, in order to get the full picture you have to listen to what both sides have to say, and then draw your own conclusion. These websites that these people put up have actually done their job, by people like you believing every word they say, and guess what? It actually worked.







Much of what this “elder” has said has been bent and twisted to fit the conclusion he wants it to fit. People who don’t really understand what he’s saying will believe every word he say’s, and to the untrained eye, seems very convincing. However, since JW know exactly what he is talking about and can sift through what is correct and what is not simply by looking at it, it is very easy to tell that he has a hidden agenda/or has some kind of vendetta against us. Some of the things he say’s on that site simply amazes me. For example, he say’s that people with a history of sex offences (including paedophilia) are allowed to become an elder, a position of trust. This could not be further from the truth! Our organization has actually BANNED people who have serious sex offences to ever be in a position of trust. This is just one of many untruths that I found at that site.



As far as courage and freedom, we don’t suppress anybody to follow the laws of our religion. If they want to stay, we encourage them to do so, if they want to leave, that it entirely their call. It would be wrong for us to interfere with people’s personal lives to try and influence their decisions. We also never try to personally interfere with people’s thought, since that is a god-given right, and it would be wrong to do so.







These very “elders” you speak about I personally know and are some of the nicest people you will ever meet. Most of these same “elders” you speak about have wife and children who they love dearly themselves and would never want that to happen to their children, in fact, they hate the act of paedophilia. And no, I do not take everything my elders say as “gospel”, because by nature, I am a very sceptical person. What you don’t seem to realize is that the elders don’t teach anything themselves, they teach from the Bible.



Ask yourself this question: Why do Jehovah’s Witnesses have a system in place in which we expel people for serious misconduct like fornication and adultery, but according that website you have shown, not paedophilia? It just doesn’t make any sense and their argument just does not add up.



In fact, if you look at our website, it actually gives good advice on how we can protect our children from this wicked act:



http://www.watchtower.org/library/g/1993/10/8a/article_01.htm

http://www.watchtower.org/library/g/1993/10/8a/article_02.htm

http://www.watchtower.org/library/g/1993/10/8a/article_03.htm



The above links are the same “Watchtower organization” that your ‘Silent Lambs’ founder said did not care about the welfare of children.







We have never denied that it exists, but strongly deny the fact that we are accused of not doing anything, which is absurd. What people don’t seem to realize is that the victims are the society’s utmost priority, and also another top priority is of rooting the wicked people who are responsible.



I have also have to say this. Your blanket statements about Jehovah’s Witnesses have been nothing short of incredible. You have accused JW of saying things and doing things that I have never heard of in my entire time of being a JW! You neither provide references or evidence to support these “assumptions” of yours, and in fact, use these “points of yours” as an argument! A term you have used throughout this thread is “excommunicated”. Linwood, can you please explain to me your definition of ‘excommunicated’ in the JW faith? Also, what is your definition of “such is the nature of the faith”?


The real fact is that if I were to express my concern about this situation to my elders – I would NOT get excommunicated. The only time anybody gets expelled is when serious misconduct against the Bible is done, not because, I decided to accept there is a problem – which is not a sin – but because I disobeyed the Bible. If the elders were to excommunicate me for any other reason other than biblical violations, it would be gross misconduct on their part.

although some things may be takin out of context there are alot of nonbias websites that are credible that document a large number of malestation in the jw community

 

[newhope101]

I know a person that was disfellowshiped for starting to smoke again. She had been given up for about a year when she was baptised. Initially she was devasted.

Her thoughts were around some of the horrible acts that deserve disfellowshipping. However she has never forgiven the JW's for doing this. She would undertand that her witnessing priveledges were withdrawn but felt disfellowshipping over an addiction was unfair.

She was given the opportunity to stop and could have said that she would. However she did not feel in her heart that it was time to try again at that time so she told the brothers she could not try to give up at this time and she was disfellowshiped.

Does this remain the status quo?

 

[diosangpastol]

How Does One Be Assured of Salvation After Becoming A Jehovah's Witness?

 

[Pegg]

I know a person that was disfellowshiped for starting to smoke again. She had been given up for about a year when she was baptised. Initially she was devasted.

Her thoughts were around some of the horrible acts that deserve disfellowshipping. However she has never forgiven the JW's for doing this. She would undertand that her witnessing priveledges were withdrawn but felt disfellowshipping over an addiction was unfair.

She was given the opportunity to stop and could have said that she would. However she did not feel in her heart that it was time to try again at that time so she told the brothers she could not try to give up at this time and she was disfellowshiped.

Does this remain the status quo?

Yes it is still the case. Although being disfellowshipped does not prevent you from continuing to attend meetings.

You cannot smoke and continue to be a member of the congregation...or be in the witnessing work. However, if you are struggling with an addiction, but you are making efforts to stop the addiction by getting professional help, then you would not be disfellowshipped. But if you told the elders that you simply were not ready to give something up...then of course they would have no choice but to disfellowship you.

As soon as your friend makes the decision to try and give up, she could go back to the elders and ask to be reinstated.

 

[Pegg]

How Does One Be Assured of Salvation After Becoming A Jehovah's Witness?

by enduring in faithfulness to God, until the end, as Jesus said.

Matt 24:13 "But he that has endured to the end is the one that will be saved"

 

[Pegg]

although some things may be takin out of context there are alot of nonbias websites that are credible that document a large number of malestation in the jw community

if that is true or not, i dont know...

Of course that does not mean that these things dont happen. We are prone to error as much as anyone else. And if someone comes into a congregation for the purpose of getting close to children, then we are just as much victims of such crime as anyone else

but as to how our organization handles such things, i have to say that they are above reproach. We are taught to train our children to say no to molesters. The organization prints articles frequently to help parents prepare their children to recognize such attacks. We even openly discuss such things during our meetings.

Also, if a brother is convicted of such a crime, then the organization has a blanket rule that he can NEVER serve in a position of authority or oversight EVER. If it is an elder who commits such a crime, he is removed from his position and will never be appointed to such a position again...not even 50 years down the track...not even if he is repentant of his crime and never touches another child again in his whole life.

 

[Jensen]

I know that JWs do not accept blood transfusions but my niece says that JWs do not see doctors either. If this is so is it new? Because I think that she is wrong, another case of someone not knowing what she is talking about.

Jensen

 

[Gloone]

I know some Jehovah's that have been kicked out of their houses for dating at a young age. Why do adult's who are JW feel the need to control the decision making of their youth? Usually rebellion follows.
I also use to play Diablo at a young age on the computer and my cuz was not allow to get anywhere close to the game, and I would always give him hell for it. What is the reason behind all of that?